Any machinists out there?

[Taylortractornut]

I took machine shop classes in HS and later 2 years of it in college. I was always facinated by a shaper. HS the school board deemed our 2 shapers unsafe and mad e the shop disconnec the big one as a slacker walked infront of the clapper tool post and got a big square bruise on his gourd. I used a smaller one in that shop but we didnt have alot of tooling for it and I really didnt have time to learn alot about it in 3 hours each day with Welding and mill work and lathes to use.

In College we had a medium shaper and a few more tools with it. I did a few projects on it but not many. I liked it for a fe jobs over a Mill.

Im now getting back into machining more and more at the shop and am rebuilding one lathe and working on the motor of another. I got a nice Enco fullsize knee mill 2 weeks ago. A freind of mine that got me into machining as a kid had a freind that was parteners in a Fastener company. They sold out due to the recent illness of the owner. My friend told me I could getthe mill for less than scrap if I paid cash for it before the auction as they had to empty the building. I thought it might be kinda worn out, but to my surprise its like new. Very wel ltaken care of. Came with a pressureize lube and a ower feed and DRO. Its super tight, I found out the mill was a few years old. I got it and a face mill, Bridgeport Boring Bar, and Jacobs chuck , coolant system and a Kurt vise for 500 dollars.


Also in the load was a few bits of tooling like jobber bits. On to the point about a shaper, I have a friend that bought a lathe and a mill and shaper that came with it. He didnt want to sell is as it had a good vise for his drill press. He made a deal with me if I got him a vise I could have the shaper and tooling. I mentioned that to my freind and they had started scrapping it. THey threw in the vise in the deal. My other friend liked the vise and traded the shaper for it. I hope to use the shaper mainly for cutting internal keways.

I know they are a good bit dated but Id like to learn about them to keep the knowledge of them around.

 

[charlz]

Seems like quite a few people on the homeshopmachinist.net forums have shapers, have rebuilt them etc etc. Probably some on practicalmachinist.com as well but that is mostly 'real' machinists and they don't look to fondly on some of the home shop grade equipment and Chinese discussions are banned Myself I only have a lathe but plan on getting mill at some point.

 

[Taylortractornut]

I was on practical Machinst for a while but the attitude there was pitiful. I grew up in machining and warked for a while as a professional. I have all commercial machinery too. My former mill was a toy grizzl mill. I didnt use it much as it didnt have capacity. It paid for itself a few times over o n key ways.

I plan on adding a small horizontal mill one day to. Theres several places over stocked on older mills and lathes. I have 800 in my 24 inch swing lathe, My logan lathe was free, I gave 150 for my surface grinder, 20 for a power hacksaw, and 500 for the mill. Ive got a large drill press Im rebuilding it was in a junk yard and working when parked. I finally got the owner to sell it. I dont plan to make a full time living with it but its nice to have it all around the shop. Lots of folks now are rebuilding and repairing now instead of replacing.

 

[charlz]

Machine shop was something that was not available when I was in high school. I took welding, small engines and all those but always wanted to learn some machining. Idaho is pretty sparse when it comes to machine shop tools. When they do come up they command decent money. Any old Bridgeport or clone will run you $4k+, guys in other parts of the country can buy them for less than $1k all day long. Portland, OR seems to be the closest place with decent prices, around $2k for the same machine. If I do go there (8 hour drive one way) to buy one I might buy two and resell one to pay for the trip I recently picked up a nice Southbend 13" lathe to replace the 12" Atlas/Craftsman I started with, it originally went to a high school and is in great shape. I had to drive about 800 miles round trip to bring it home. :confused2: Hadn't seen one before or since that was in this part of the country and remotely in driving distance.

 

[czechsonofagun]

I got my Logan 10" cheap few years ago and use it more than I would ever imagine. The mill is a need that pops up more and more, I get around it somehow but would love to have a mill.

As far as internet, I love this forum:

The Home Shop Machinist & Machinist's Workshop Magazine's BBS - Powered by vBulletin

check the shop made tools just to get the idea

Classes? I never took any, but my first masters is Mech.Engineering - I am well educated theoretican My major was in machining too.

 

[Taylortractornut]

THanks for the links I took a look through the shop tools and was amazed. My first lathe is a Logan grandad picked it up after WW2 THe lathe was made on Febuary 8 1942.


I asked a question on PM one time that was fairly significant and got flamed over it. I did the job anyway and got through it no sweat.


I was lucky I got to have Mr Brown in shop class he was a master welder and machinist and liked his job. We got to build all sorts of things and often all our jobs were mixed together. He retired after his health went down. The school wouldnt let kids go through one class like metal trades but 2 years Mr. Brown found a way to get us that wanted to take it 4 years to take it that long. It paid off. The county has cut Ag shop, Carpentry and building trades, and Refrigeration and AC over the last coule years. And I figure Metal trades will be next. Its sad because all the folks I know around here my age that made someting of them selves all started or still work in the trades that were shut down.


I wished I d have know you needed a mill there was 3 others that sold for 550 Each. I started to get another but im running out of room.

Surplus industrial in SHeffeild AL has a good stock of mills at the moment. Ans they can ship them.

 

[ultrarunner]

I've got a Bridgport NC Tape Mill and a Southbend lathe... always wanted to upgrade the lathe and now, just don't really have the inclination...

Worked for awhile in a Tool and Die shop that had everything... it was real small pre WWII and then expanded... sadly, a huge fire turned most of the equipment to puddles on the floor... the aluminum parts.

Machine Tool prices in the Bay Area have fallen dramatically with the exodus of manufacturing...

Shapers can do a lot with inexpensive tooling... a big plus for those on a shoe string...

 

[sweettractors]

Retired in 1980 from Machinest/Tool and Die/Mold Maker for PR Mallory and Co. I really miss the work, however, don't have time to devote to a hobby shop......Grandkids and Honey Do's Ken Sweet

 

[sal64]

machinist cnc prog 31yrs, its a dieing trade in the past 10 yrs sean 80% of work go to china.

 

[Taylortractornut]

I miss it alot some times. I didnt do alot of the fancy projects in college I did all the big turning and setups that took some doing. I had the tool and die teacher baffled one day I needed to turn down a 30 inch diameter Flywheel off a hit and miss motor. My machinshop teacher gave me a go ahead to pi$$ off the T&D teacher. TD told me we dont have a lathe with the swing you need. I made a center arbor and put it in the biggest rotary table in the shop then put it in the mill. 30 minutes later I hd a newly turned flywheel. I did work in a few small and older shops in school, and after I worked for Geartek running running a CNC after I refused to . I was supposed to work in the manual shop I did a few months after I told them Id quit. That was a bad job with worse bosses. I kinda burnt out after that and went back running equipment.



Now that Ive gotten alot of time on the side now and need to stay near home since Ill bee a dad in a few months I wanted to get back into it a bit.

I have a small foundry to that a bit interesting on casting small parts.

 

[ultrarunner]

machinist cnc prog 31yrs, its a dieing trade in the past 10 yrs sean 80% of work go to china.

The Bay Area used to be a mecca of small to medium size shops...

I did a lot of work on the space shuttle project... some for James River, Continental Can, Kellogg's and Caterpillar... two of our long term clients were Steccone Squeegee and Upright Scaffolding...

All have long since left the area and all of the small shops have folded.

One of our competitors was having a struggle... the son was sharp, but just not that interested in the business of bidding only to loose out.

He sold off the shop, kept some equipment and moved to an old farm in wine country... it wasn't long before he put his talent to use improving machinery used in the wine industry and put in a small vineyard on his property... have not seen him in years... read a nice write up about his business and patents in the SF Chronicle...

Sometimes change can be good.

 

[lockhaven]

I am a mold builder by trade. I now design molds and fixtures for some small shops still hanging on. it is a trade that is on it's last leg. I am familiar with shapers (an old way of moving material fast) i also program lasers. My apprenticeship taught me sheet metal, general machining, EDM, NC lathe and mill, gear cutting with the right equipment I can build anything you desire. Problem is the industry is dead in the US China has attacked us and corporate America has allowed it.

 

[JD 4520]

If you have a tractor, you're a mechanic. Can't have one without the other.

 

[czechsonofagun]

I will probably repeat myself, but my first job after college was for this tool shop for a huge company. We made die casting dies for aluminum, it was beautiful engineering.

I was in manufacturing preparation with most of the time designing special tools and EDM electrodes. Cool stuff and I wish I had access to the equipment there - and the knowledge of those old timers.

 

[om21braz]

He sold off the shop, kept some equipment and moved to an old farm in wine country... it wasn't long before he put his talent to use improving machinery used in the wine industry and put in a small vineyard on his property... have not seen him in years... read a nice write up about his business and patents in the SF Chronicle...

Sometimes change can be good.

+1 Redesign of existing Italian winepresses, etc. at one time, if not now, would be a good business to be in. On a tour of a local winery, one of the winemakers was doing the tour and noted how problematic their machinery was. He compared it to having a Ferrari and the manufacturer's technicians were hard to get onsite, not to mention the cost.

As for machinist? Apprentice here - moved into design and now occasionally get my hands back on a Bridgeport, lathe, or welder. Funny how the CNC (read younger) guys cannot figure out how to make some parts that were originally done "by hand".

 

[Taylortractornut]

I used to get a chuckle out of the T&D students in college. T&D shop and Machine tool operation were in the same building divided by set of class rooms. The T&Ds most never had turned on a machine in their lives used to brag about being the best because they got degrees at the end of 2 years. MTO students got certificates. They had to take 2 maths, English Lit, Psychology, and some other bs to take TD. We got 98 percent more shop time with a better teacher. Our machines were older Cincinatti and South Bend and other units, I liked to hear the T&D kids whine about the old machines making mistakes when compared to the Highschool ones I used these were like new money.

I made my teacher teach me how the use the T&D class's EDM machine. THats a handy unit there. My teacher said It was a good thing to know how to use it and the othe machines like the shaper and horizontal mill.

OM21braz I know what you mean by the CNC machinists in awe of what a hand machine can do. I have a friend that can program one but is lost on a manual machines.

Im working one ugrading my foundry, I found a large ceramic foundryshell from the old Ford head casting plant. Its double the sieze of the one I have now.

 

[czechsonofagun]

You are either operator or machinist. If you are machinist, you can do more with old equipment than operator with the best.
My boss at the car shop had 2hp Bridgeport and used it as a drill press. He had rotary table too - saying he did not figure it yet. I say what is there so complex about rotary table? That machine kept me sane while working for him.

 

[dmccarty]

Over the last year or so we have done a fair bit of driving on the NC back roads.

I was amazed at a couple of sights.
- How many machine shops are out in the middle of no where.
- Some of the operations were/are very large.
- How many are recently out of business.

But I still see some that are open and I wonder how they make a living.

Later,
Dan

 

[300UGUY]

I worked in tool & die for 35 years. Several years ago, I was talking to a young machinist for Makino, a builder of machining centers. He remarked that he had never worked on a machine "with handles". It took me a minute to understand what he was talking about.

 

[2LMAKER]

This pretty entertainmg thread.
Considering a toolmaker apprentiship was 8000 hrs machine time ( the math classes were seperarate)
At the end of your apprentiship the old timers would ask if your were a "toolmaker now"
When you answered "yes" they'd all get a good laugh
After 35 yrs in the trade with most of which using manual machines ,CNC is the cats meow . Things that would take hours to set up and special tools for,can be done with standard tools in a fraction of the time. One thing to remember people doing it for a living have to do it best possible way.
While fixing old US iron then making stuff on it is great. Don't kid yourself there is still quite a machine trade in US and what can be done is even more amazing.