50 Hour Service Costs Variations...

[Emainiac]

Today, I called the dealer I bought my tractor from and asked about having my first 50 hour (actually 70 hour) service and they boastfully told me it was $1000 for the first service. I knew it would be expensive, but $1000? So I checked the manual and there is nothing special being done. Topping off the fluids, change oil and filters, check radiator, etc.

So I called another dealer who is also 50 minutes away, but in another direction. He told me it was $250 for all the same items to be serviced.

I'm assuming cost difference may be due to location (populated/non-populated) but I'm not sure.

Am I missing something here?

 

[Emainiac]

One more question, the manual seems to be a bit ambiguous whether the hydraulic fluid needs to be changed at 50 hours, or at 300 hours.

 

[rScotty]

Is it running well? If so & no problems I'd want to think it over just as you are doing. I've had a dozen tractors and taken care of many more. Yes, I'd say the first service is important.... but I'd be leary of someone charging an unrealistic amount. Here's some knowledge:

The big dollar expense item on the first service is the changing of the trans/hydraulic fluid and hydraulic filters. That oil change alone can easily run over 200 dollars if you have 10 or 12 gallons of trans/hydraulic oil to replace. That really is a special oil and I like to use John Deere low viscosity HyGard for cold climates year around. There are other good ones, but they are all costly oils. The hydraulic filters are the more expensive ones as well. You may get by for a little less because the shuttle shift doesn't have the absolute requirement for a low particle count that the HST transmissions do. Remember that the transmission and hydraulics share a common sump.

I usually just look through the side of the fuel filter chamber and if I feel good about the fuel I've geen getting and don't see an obvious fuel/water demarkation or a lot of fuzz on the filter I leave it alone. Particles that settle in the chamber below the fuel filter don't affect it. It's good to do it at low hours like you are because it gets the initial wear particles out as well as any machining scraps left. You will probably see quite a few metal flakes in the first service. It's nothing to worry about. It's why you do a low hour change.

I always change the inner air filter and sometimes the outer as well - although often it is cleanable.

Grease the zerks. Engine oil and filter... and you are done. Don't forget to check the coolant, battery terminals, and maybe lightly hose out the radiator from the back to force out the chaff and dirt the fan pulls in. Careful with the fins.

My opinion: $250 is a little bit too low.....They are probably putting in a lesser quality trans/hydraulic oil & aftermarket filters. Nothing wrong with asking why it is less expensive, though. You can price the JD HyGard oil online & judge for yourself. It runs roughly 20 to $25 a gallon. Other good trans/hydraulic oils are in the same range. It will last another nearly 700 to 900 hrs though, ...so this is when you put the good stuff in.

On the other hand, a shop charging a thousand dollars for that 1st service is not just too high, it is rudely so.

I think there is a lot to be gained by doing the basic service yourself. Or being involved in some way. It doesn't have to be done all in a day. Spread it out. And keep a record of what was done and when.
good luck,
rScotty

 

[rScotty]

Is it running well? If so & no problems I'd want to think it over just as you are doing. I've had a dozen tractors and taken care of many more. Yes, I'd say the first service is important.... but I'd be leary of someone charging an unrealistic amount. Here's some knowledge.

The big dollar expense item on the first service is the changing of the trans/hydraulic fluid and hydraulic filters. That oil change alone can easily run over 200 dollars if you have 10 or 12 gallons of trans/hydraulic oil to replace. That really is a special oil and I like to use John Deere low viscosity HyGard for cold climates year around. There are other good ones, but they are all costly oils. The hydraulic filters are the more expensive ones as well. You may get by for a little less because the shuttle shift doesn't have the absolute requirement for a low particle count that the HST transmissions do. Remember that the transmission and hydraulics share a common sump.

I usually just look through the side of the fuel filter chamber and if I feel good about the fuel I've geen getting and don't see an obvious fuel/water demarkation or a lot of fuzz on the filter I leave it alone. Particles that settle in the chamber below the fuel filter don't affect it. It's good to do it at low hours like you are because it gets the initial wear particles out as well as any machining scraps left. You will probably see quite a few metal flakes in the first service. It's nothing to worry about. It's why you do a low hour change.

I always change the inner air filter and sometimes the outer as well - although often it is cleanable.

Grease the zerks. Engine oil and filter... and you are done. Don't forget to check the coolant, battery terminals, and maybe lightly hose out the radiator from the back to force out the chaff and dirt the fan pulls in. Careful with the fins.

My opinion: $250 is a little bit too low.....They are probably putting in a lesser quality trans/hydraulic oil & aftermarket filters. Nothing wrong with asking why it is less expensive, though. You can price the JD HyGard oil online & judge for yourself. It runs roughly 20 to $25 a gallon. Other good trans/hydraulic oils are in the same range. It will last another nearly 700 to 900 hrs though, ...so this is when you put the good stuff in.

On the other hand, a shop charging a thousand dollars for that 1st service is not just too high, it is rudely so.

I think there is a lot to be gained by doing the basic service yourself. Or being involved in some way. It doesn't have to be done all in a day. Spread it out. And keep a record of what was done and when.
good luck,
rScotty

 

[Emainiac]

All great feed back. The second dealer said that they do NOT change the transmission fluid, rather top it off if all appears fine when they change/clean the filters.

In looking at the manual, on the chart they provide, they say 300 hours, but else where, they say 50 hours. I'd certainly want new fluid here for the reasons you mentioned above.

I'm assuming the original dealer is changing the fluid and this accounts for some of the cost difference.

 

[rScotty]

One more question, the manual seems to be a bit ambiguous whether the hydraulic fluid needs to be changed at 50 hours, or at 300 hours.

That's because it really is ambiguous. The timing of the first change has been a debate for as long as there have been mechanics. I'm in the camp that believes a new tractor heats the oil more which ages it... and it also collects more wear and manufactuing particles. So I like to do the first engine and trans/hydraulic oil & filter changes at less than 100 hours. Often at 50 hrs.
But having done that 1st change. I go much longer. Although I change engine oil annually depending on usage, I'll go 750 hrs before changing the trans/hydraulic oil for the second time. Part of that extended time is because of using a top grade trans/hydraulic oil at that first change. I also believe in low viscosity year around for cold climates.

rScotty

 

[LS Tractor Owner]

Most of the manuals are not clear on the hydraulic fluid replacement. Usually somewhere in the manual is a "maintenance chart"..... that is where it it marked "replace", "adjust", "check fluid level", etc...

Most all show "replace filter" at the 50 hour mark, then either at 200 or 300 hours is the change / replace fluid.

Most hydraulic fluid is good well past 500 hours under ideal conditions. Hence the replacement at 2-300 hours is well within the usable life....
I really think they specify changing it that early with the idea that most users will push that limit.

When I changed mine at 250 hours, it still looked perfectly clear, no abnormal smell, no metal shavings shimmering. I did change the filter at 50 hours. In hindsight, I wish I cut the original filter open to see what was inside.

 

[Emainiac]

I really think they specify changing it that early with the idea that most users will push that limit.

I think you're right about this.

 

[ptsg]

I paid €40 for the 50 hour service because it was under warranty and it has to be done by the dealer. Engine oil + oil filter and check everything else out. The dealer did offer the labor on the first service but that would be one hour at €30 anyway.