48" Mower Deck problem

[stang]

Hey Guys,

I know this is my first post, but I am looking for some help/advice. I have an LA 145 mower with a 48" deck with 49 hrs on it. Was just out doing the lawn when I heard a nasty growl coming from the deck. Stopped the mower right away and found the small idler pulley was completely fried. Not only that, but it must have been going for some time, cause it had been spinning on the spindle shaft and completely destroyed it. Any advice on what I can do to repair it ? Is it possible to buy a new shaft from a JD dealer ? Or will I have to have one machined, and weld a new one in place ?



I am able to do the repairs myself, but need options as to my best way to do the repair. Any and all advice is much appreciated.

Stang

 

[rayikeo2]

Do you have any factory warranty? It might be covered with only 49 hours.

 

[stang]

I bought this tractor May 9, 2009. So technically the warranty expired 2 weeks ago. But I would guess they would still honour it. I only have 49.7 hrs on it. Problem is, getting anything repaired thru warranty is a real pain in the @SS. I bought it at a local Home Depot, but the dealer who does the service is an hour an a half away. On top of that, the long wait to have it repaired. It's just easier to do it myself. So far I have replaced 2 pulleys, and the starter solenoid., and now this. Lesson learned. I will now question a product's warranty repair service before buying anything major.

 

[SandburRanch]

If I were in your situation with warranty and dealer distance I would try a couple of things first.

That looks as if it's an inner bearing race meltdown and may not be fused to the shaft all that well. So I would first try a heavy backup like maybe an 8# sledge hammer or equivalent pressed firmly against the glob in several locations while popping it with a hammer on the opposite side. This would be in anticipation of distorting it enough to slip off.

If that failed I'd be using one of several cutting methods. 1) A cold chisel with the same backer in case it got hot enough to anneal the race. 2) A Dremel tool and cut off wheel or 3) Take it to a competent welder and have it torched off.

It is often thought if the shaft is nicked it is ruined. In this application, not so. As a matter of fact that shaft could have a triangle profile with a radius on the corners equal to the inner bearing race and work just as well.

At the bottom of the shaft there will probably be a Boss for the inner race to reside on. That isn't very critical either as long as there is most of it remaining when the shout'in is done. To see what that shaft may look like, remove the pulley from the idler shaft to the immediate left in pic 2 if you don't recall from previous work.

 

[mullins87]

Have you looked on the bottom side of that mount to see if the stud can be unbolted?

 

[rayikeo2]

It does look like the bolt extending through the bracket is replaceable. First take a really good pair of vice grips or a large pair pliers and twist the left-over bearing part off the bolt. After that take a good look at the bolt to see if it is salvageable. Then order needed parts on-line from John Deere Parts. The bolt probably got hot enough that it lost it's temper, and it needs replaced if you can get it off. You may be able to get parts at a local Tractor Supply if you can take the old one in to match it up.
Great job taking the picture.

 

[stang]

What you see in the picture is the damage done to the shaft the pulley sits on. There is no inner race in the pic. The inner race is still in one piece, and came out with the pulley, but the bearing was piled up very badly. The damage seen is what was done to the area the inner race sits on. This entire shaft needs to be replaced. It looks to me as if the shaft is press fit into the bracket. I see no weld's any where.

I was hoping to see that this shaft is available from JD, but I have yet to find it in any parts diagram. I am going to use a zipcut and cut the shaft off as close to the bracket as possible, and punch out the remaining pieces. I'm guessing I will have to machine a new shaft and weld it into place.

 

[rayikeo2]

I will look at the john Deer Parts catalog for you to see how this goes togather and comes apart. What is the Deck ID number? Ray

 

[rayikeo2]

Stang, This part looks like it not replaceable without a whole new deck (very expensive) or repair as you see fit. Check this parts diagram.

John Deere - Parts Catalog

That is a lot more work than I anticipated. Good Luck. Maybe some one else has had this problem and can help you more. :confused2:

 

[stang]

Hi Ray,
Mower Deck ID # - GXA145A208464



This is what the bracket looks like with the stud removed. It appears it was inserted into the hexagonal hole, then the back side was peened over to hold it in place, before the bracket was installed. Looks as tho the new stud will need to be welded into place.

See what parts you can find for me. I really appreciate your help.

Thanks,
Stang

EDIT ** Thanks Ray, thats what I kinda figured.

 

[rayikeo2]

If all else fails you might want to contact John Deere Parts, show them the picture and see if there is any way they can get a part from the deck manfacture. Either the complete bracket or the bolt spindle and weld it in. I would think they would be embarrassed about the part failing in such a short time and try to accomadate you.

 

[pennwalk]

Just because JD designed it that way doesn't mean you can't improve it. It looks to me as if cost was a factor in that assembly. You could put together something that will work at least as well and be replacable too.

Chris

 

[mullins87]

First off, you don't HAVE to use JD parts. Go to your local parts store that has a good selection of idler pulleys. Find one that matches or is close to the original. Once you have that, then pick up an appropriate grade 8 bolt that will fit the hole in that bracket. You may have to use some washers or jam nuts to position the pulley at the proper height. If it fails again, it will be easily replaceable.

 

[jinman]

The idler pulley's arbor hole is 0.66". JD does not sell that shoulder bolt separate from the deck. I think you need to research finding a shoulder bolt or you could put a bushing on a smaller diameter bolt. The JD idlers are common items on eBay. I just bought a half dozen (yes, that many) to have as spares because as soon as they start to howl, I replace them. My deck has a little over 100 hours on it and I have replaced both small idlers twice and the large idler once. If you don't constantly stay on top of this deck, it will end up like yours over and over. You have my sympathy. We were sold a product that is very high maintenance. Idlers and spindles are the most replaced item on the 100 series of mowers. You can also expect to replace the carb float chamber needle valve on the B&S engine also. If your engine starts and then dies about 20 seconds later and won't restart. Take it to your dealer and tell him you need the new brass needle valve. All JD dealer's shops know about this and have been given info on how to fix it.

 

[mjncad]

Stang:

Welcome to TBN and the world of crap BBM (Big Box Mart) grade mowers regardless of manufacturer.

As Jinman says, these decks are high maintenance items for one reason or another. Also don't be surprised if it eats belts and electric clutches. I'm on my third belt, and my electric clutch and actuating switch puked at 56-hours. My L(emon)-130 has about 75-hours on it.

Also if yours has the Tuff-Torq (oxymoron) K46 hydrostatic tranny; these are known to be problematic too. So far mine hasn't given me trouble; but it's just a matter of time.

 

[stang]

@Jinman -The whole reason these pulleys fail is because of the cheap bearings. I am going to drill the welds out and try replacing with a high quality NTN piece. Bearings are cheap, and there is no excuse for JD to maufacture a part that has such a high rate of replacement. If I find a bearing that works, I'll post up a part #.

@mjncad - Thanks for the Welcome, and the head's up on the nightmare I am about to face with this POS mower. This is pretty sad really. When I was growing up I used to respect JD equipment as being the best there was. This is the reason I purchased this unit, for the quality, and dependability. So much for that eh ?? As of right now it has cost me $58/hr to operate this mower, not counting the fuel and parts already required.

So I used the other stud as a template and created a CAD drawing. I made a few minor changes, but not much that can be done for improvement. My brother-in-law is going to make me a new part tomorrow, and I will weld it onto the bracket. We'll see how long that last's.

Stang

 

[jinman]

@Jinman -The whole reason these pulleys fail is because of the cheap bearings.
Stang

I think cheap bearings may be a part of the problem, but I've seen some pretty cheap bearings on other mowers that lasted much longer. I think shock mounting of that first small idler is also a big deal. Everytime you engage the clutch, it just slams that first small idler since it is the first thing on the deck and has no shock mounting. If I were going as far as you are, I'd manage to create a flexmount where I could put on a heavy spring to tension that first idler. Then, when the clutch is energized, it will absorb that initial shock until the blades get up to speed and spinning. Also, be sure to keep those spindles greased. JD recommends every 25 hours, but I think 8 to 10 is much more realistic. If you have not seen it, check out this thread.

 

[SandburRanch]

I didn't read the manual so I probably should get 20 lashes for not greasing spindles with sealed bearings every 25 hours. But I did change the bearings this winter and found one lower sealed bearing with dried caked grease that looked, after removing the seal, like the grease may have been 30 years old.

The housing contained some thin black grease but not nearly full. Just calculating in my retarded brain I figure if I pumped 3 squirts every 25 hours the housing cavity might be full after 6 or 7 years. Them there JD folks have sure got this old man confused.

What really may have happened in manufacture is the computerized robot drilled holes in the wrong part and JD decided one of those cheep drive in zerks would be the cheepist way to plug the hole.:laughing:

 

[mjncad]

Please see interspersed comments.

@Jinman -Bearings are cheap, and there is no excuse for JD to maufacture a part that has such a high rate of replacement.

Sure there is a good bean counter excuse...selling replacement parts makes mo' money for Deere. That's what the parts guy told me about the crap electric clutches.

@mjncad - Thanks for the Welcome, and the head's up on the nightmare I am about to face with this POS mower. This is pretty sad really. When I was growing up I used to respect JD equipment as being the best there was. This is the reason I purchased this unit, for the quality, and dependability. So much for that eh ?? As of right now it has cost me $58/hr to operate this mower, not counting the fuel and parts already required.

The problem occurred when Deere decided to enter the low end market to gain market share. Prior to putting the Deere name on the hood, they sold cheap Saber lawn tractors with a different shade of green.

Had Deere stayed solely with selling lawn and garden tractors through their dealer network, I'd bet the lowest cost unit would be today's X300 and the BBM rigs would be other brands.

The trouble in my opinion is that people who buy these things at Despot & Doh's (Home Depot & Lowe's) think they're getting a real Deere quality rig; when in reality they're getting a mediocre piece of metal. Whether this eventually bites Deere in the butt or not is unknown to me.

Stang

 

[stang]

** UPDATE **

Back up and running guys. Machined a new spindle and welded it onto the bracket. Installed a new idler and all worked very well after a 2 hour mowing. Well, except for the tension idler that is now howling like a banshee. I have ordered several replacement parts so I am ready for the next failure.

Thanks for all the advice and information !!!

Cheers .....

Stang