Tchara
Bronze Member
I have a Westendorf loader with 2" cylinders. Westendorf offers an option for 3" cylinders. Would the 3" cylinders give me better lifting capacity? What would be the advantage to the larger cylinders?
3" cylinders
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J_J
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Much more power.
You might need more ballast on the back.
For each cyl, and you have two lift and two curl.
2 in cyl, 1 in shaft, 3000 psi
Push - 9,425 lbs
Pull - 7,069 lbs
3 in cyl, 1.5 in shaft, 3000 psi.
Push - 21,206 lbs
Pull - 15,904 lbs
You might need more ballast on the back.
For each cyl, and you have two lift and two curl.
2 in cyl, 1 in shaft, 3000 psi
Push - 9,425 lbs
Pull - 7,069 lbs
3 in cyl, 1.5 in shaft, 3000 psi.
Push - 21,206 lbs
Pull - 15,904 lbs
Mace Canute
Elite Member
More force available through the use of larger cylinders may not be an advantage because it can put added stress on the loader and the tractor if you ever get into a situation where you max out the available lifting force, plus the speed of the loader is reduced by the same percentage that the power is increased.
Usually an engineer will design a safety factor into the equipment and you have to be careful about how much of that safety factor you fudge with. Also, sometimes engineers are over ruled for costs sake and the safety factor becomes rather "optimistic".
Without knowing a bit more about your loader and the tractor it's installed on and what you will use it for, it's a bit difficult to get any more specific about both advantages and disadvantages.
Usually an engineer will design a safety factor into the equipment and you have to be careful about how much of that safety factor you fudge with. Also, sometimes engineers are over ruled for costs sake and the safety factor becomes rather "optimistic".
Without knowing a bit more about your loader and the tractor it's installed on and what you will use it for, it's a bit difficult to get any more specific about both advantages and disadvantages.
David Devuono
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The 3 inch cylinders are probably for a tractor with a lower hydraulic pressure? IE my old Massey does not put out too much more then 1500 PSI.
J_J
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Using the same tractor, with the same pressure, you will have 3 times more lifting force.
Look at my post above, and you will see the difference.
The lift operation will be slower.
You might need more weight on the back to counteract the new lifting capacity.
The cyl's do not give the true lifting capacity of the cyl due to the angle of the cyl mounting setup.
OP
Tchara
Bronze Member
Appreciate everyone's input. I called Westendorf, and they told me the loader will safely use up to 3 1/2 inch cylinders. They want 455.00 each for them. May have to wait a few paydays.
oldnslo
Super Member
Loader can safely but can the tractor? Front axles only hold so much before things get real expensive. What is the FEL that Branson supplies for the 3520 rated to lift? What will your Westendorf with 3 1/2 cylinders lift?
Your tractor your money, your repair bills. If I remember correctly this is a fairly new tractor so I would wonder what Branson would say when you more that double your potential lifting force and you try and claim a front axle breakage on warranty.
+1 ! If the loader is not the limiting factor in what you can lift (by design), it goes to the next weakest part... front axle, chassis, whatever. If you really need to lift more than what the tractor was designed for, you need more tractor, not a FEL on steroids.
J_J
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The cyl them selves are not the limiting factor, as a 2 in cyl and 1 in shaft @2500 psi will lift about 7,854 lbs with a straight on push, X two cyl.
---------------------------------------------------------3 in--------1.5 in -----@2500 psi---------------17,671 lbs------------------------------------.
It is the angle of the cyl mount and mechanical geometry that dictates the limiting load, plus the safety factor built into the machine for a safe operation.
The engineers try and come up with a cyl size and relief setting that will allow the loader to raise a certain load and keep the operator from tipping the tractor. Loaded tires and or an attachment is sometimes necessary to prevent the unstable condition.
If the relief goes off, that means that you are at your built in limit.
Some have cheated a bit on the relief pressure, to gain a couple of hundred lbs.
Can the front axle take the increased load? Maybe , or maybe not.
---------------------------------------------------------3 in--------1.5 in -----@2500 psi---------------17,671 lbs------------------------------------.
It is the angle of the cyl mount and mechanical geometry that dictates the limiting load, plus the safety factor built into the machine for a safe operation.
The engineers try and come up with a cyl size and relief setting that will allow the loader to raise a certain load and keep the operator from tipping the tractor. Loaded tires and or an attachment is sometimes necessary to prevent the unstable condition.
If the relief goes off, that means that you are at your built in limit.
Some have cheated a bit on the relief pressure, to gain a couple of hundred lbs.
Can the front axle take the increased load? Maybe , or maybe not.
