2305 and Independent Lift?

[hink10]

Hi Hink,

I just wanted to reinforce what Kenny is trying to convey. Proper rear ballast is extremely important. Many people fill them solid with concrete.

With that said, perhaps you could have the best of both worlds by incorporating a carefully thought out landscape rack to the top of the ballast box. Using some PVC pipe sleeves in the BB, you could make it a removable rack. Just keep in mind that you will be having to walk around this contraption so give some thought to keeping things oriented so that you won't end up with a rake tine in your eyeball, not to paint a morbid picture.

But again, heed Kenny's advice. He's watching out for you.

With regard to the Independent Lift, as a former 2305 owner, I had the IL on mine. In retrospect, I personally might have stuck with the mechanical lift for two reasons, 1) the lift cylinder will not hold the deck up, just lift it temporarily. The system depends on a detented cam knob to keep the deck raised, a system which could be better on these machines, and 2) when lowering the deck, if I accidentally (very easy to happen) pushed the SCV all the way out and entered the Regen fuction (rapid loader dump), my deck would bounce up and down wildly because of it. However, I never desired to keep anything on the rear of the machine while mowing like yourself.

I hope this helps.

Thanks for the advise. I was thinking exactly the same thing about a removable frame w/ pvc inserts on top of ballast. Don't even know that I'd want to, just thinking.

I learned the importance of ballast last year. I borrowed a tractor, I don't recall the model but it was fairly big. I was using it for some relatively light loader work and it had no ballast! I was very careful, but I knew I'd never do it again without the proper ballast! When I'm doing any real loader work, I'll probably have the backhoe on.

Still trying to decide on the ind. lift, if anything, my wife hated the 3 pt. hanging off the rear, I could remove it if I was just mowing. Is it a pain to install the ind. lift? Doesn't seem like it should be too bad, the dealer made it should like it was even challenging for his service techs! I find that hard to believe, they must not do many. Either that or he wanted to charge me the over $400 in labor he quoted! Wanted $850 for the ind. lift installed, retail is $4?? for the parts.

Steve

 

[C-Range]

Steve,

Your wife "hating the 3 pt arms on the rear" is a bit of an eyebrow raiser. What is the big deal? The 2305 is the epitome of an all purpose machine. It can do more tasks than most anything else around. The cost for this is that you have to make a few compromises here and there. In the end, it's a superstar for those who need to have one machine that does it all.

I didn't install my independent lift, my dealer did. In my experience with installing JD add on kits though, none of them have been tremendously difficult to install, assuming you have or are willing to get the right tools to do the job and the aptitude to follow the instructions properly.

As for what the dealer told you, it sounds like propaganda to me but I can't really say. And about their charges, I don't know if it is inline with the JD allowance for this installation, but they do have bills to pay too. Think long term. That's how the machine was made - for the long term. Whatever few bucks you have to pay now will most likely not repeat for a very long time.

 

[hink10]

The wife would like it to look more like a mower than a tractor, not a big deal, she will get used to it. You are correct about making compromises for sure. This was really the only option in my eyes for what I want/need as it is an all-in-one. It is a bit more tractor than I want to store and operate in my neighborhood however. That was the wife's concern also. Another reason for the ind. lift would be a quicker install/removal of the BH. I would have no problem installing, I like to think I'm capable and I have plenty of tools. I may have the dealer install a diverter kit. I believe the kit is $364 and they wanted $450 installed. It's worth $86 to have it installed.

Believe me, I know these dealers have the overhead and operate on relatively small margins. I do work for a friend who owns an RV dealership. Our margins are very small and we don't negotiate on price, just list it low and be done with it. That's why I didn't question the prices too much, I asked if it was his best deal, he said yes and that was that.

Anyway, I'm excited to get the beast, every time I look outside, I think of something I could be doing with it. I especially want a set of those nice new 42" forks, that may be the most useful tool I can think of, so many uses. I do a lot of stone work and they are great for placing landscaping stone. I'm sure I'll be ordering them soon!:thumbsup:

Steve

Steve,

Your wife "hating the 3 pt arms on the rear" is a bit of an eyebrow raiser. What is the big deal? The 2305 is the epitome of an all purpose machine. It can do more tasks than most anything else around. The cost for this is that you have to make a few compromises here and there. In the end, it's a superstar for those who need to have one machine that does it all.

I didn't install my independent lift, my dealer did. In my experience with installing JD add on kits though, none of them have been tremendously difficult to install, assuming you have or are willing to get the right tools to do the job and the aptitude to follow the instructions properly.

As for what the dealer told you, it sounds like propaganda to me but I can't really say. And about their charges, I don't know if it is inline with the JD allowance for this installation, but they do have bills to pay too. Think long term. That's how the machine was made - for the long term. Whatever few bucks you have to pay now will most likely not repeat for a very long time.

 

[hink10]

Hey Everyone,

Thanks for the feedback, I've learned a lot! Anyway, I've decided to buy the IL for $350 delivered. I will install that, shouldn't be a problem. I have a feeling the dealer hasn't done many. I know if I do it myself it will be done right, at least the way I want it done, nice & tidy. I completely re-worked the fuel system on my Ford 7.3L diesel from the tank to the return (among many other mods). All with the help of good folks like you on a truck forum. I have plenty of tools and just enough common sense to do the job, with directions of course!

Since I'm getting the IL, I also want the diverter valve. I almost called the dealer today and told him to add it at a cost of $450. The kit costs about $364 retail. I know this sounds stupid, but now I want to save $100 or so and add it myself. After spending $20K +, what's another $100 right? On one hand I want to save a few bucks, on the other, that's one less thing to do later when I could be playing on my new toy. I have a real problem getting hung-up on the details like this. Help me make this trivial decision! I have a feeling the response will be mixed, just like my head! Any install experience would be great too! Thanks again for all the help thus far! :thumbsup:

Steve

 

[dcyrilc]

Hey Everyone,

Thanks for the feedback, I've learned a lot! Anyway, I've decided to buy the IL for $350 delivered. I will install that, shouldn't be a problem. I have a feeling the dealer hasn't done many. I know if I do it myself it will be done right, at least the way I want it done, nice & tidy. I completely re-worked the fuel system on my Ford 7.3L diesel from the tank to the return (among many other mods). All with the help of good folks like you on a truck forum. I have plenty of tools and just enough common sense to do the job, with directions of course!

Since I'm getting the IL, I also want the diverter valve. I almost called the dealer today and told him to add it at a cost of $450. The kit costs about $364 retail. I know this sounds stupid, but now I want to save $100 or so and add it myself. After spending $20K +, what's another $100 right? On one hand I want to save a few bucks, on the other, that's one less thing to do later when I could be playing on my new toy. I have a real problem getting hung-up on the details like this. Help me make this trivial decision! I have a feeling the response will be mixed, just like my head! Any install experience would be great too! Thanks again for all the help thus far! :thumbsup:

Steve

The tractor's sitting at the dealer and your not getting it til next weekend, right? I say pay the $100 and have the dealer throw it on while you're waiting for that last part before delivery.

 

[C-Range]

Hink,

The diverter valve is an easy install. I know this because I had to completely remove the one on my 2305. The dealer installed it all wrong. There are two hyd hoses, one larger diameter than the other. The larger hose is to provide adequate flow to the loader, the smaller hose is for the less demanding independent lift. They had put them in backwards. This also required reinstalling all of the quick disconnects as they were also bottom-over-top. I discovered the improper install because the forward/reverse pedals were getting stiffer and stiffer to operate. It turned out that the tech didn't properly secure the hoses away from the pedal linkage and a hose was abrading against a linkage joint. They had already largely destroyed each other by the time I found the problem. To make matters worse, I asked my dealer (at the time) for the installation instructions to confirm the hose swap suspicion and they said I had to call JD. I called and they said I had to get them from the dealer. Whopee! I did finally get them from the dealer when I asked a tech directly instead of the sales guy. The moral of the story is that you should DEMAND all of the installation paperwork used during the prep of your machine.

Also DEMAND any hardware that is removed from the machine during the installation of any add on equipment. You just might need it someday, as is what happened to me and had to buy it.

The long and short of it is, these days I install as much as possible myself. John Deere does a fabulous job of building the tractors but it's a gamble after that. This is just my personal experience and opinion but I am very picky like yourself so I predict this will resonate with you. And FWIW, I suspect this is not something specific to JD, it's likely with all brands. I believe dealers give the prep work for the smaller machines to the less experienced techs - and less experienced buyers who won't likely know the difference.

Good luck and enjoy your amazing new machine.

 

[hink10]

Okay, here's a question for anyone that's installed an independent lift on a 2305 that had the mechanical lift already installed. I was told that I needed the ind. lift attaching parts kit in addition to the ind. lift kit. I have the part numbers, but not in front of me at the moment.

It appears that the mechanical lift that's on the tractor has all of the same attaching parts that the "required" attaching parts kit has. I specifically asked the dealer I bought the kit from If I needed the attaching kit if I was getting the tractor with the mechanical lift already installed, he said yes as did the dealer I bought the tractor from.

I think that they may be incorrect. In the John Deere pricing literature, the ind. lift kit states it requires the attaching kit for a field install. My thought is that's assuming there is no lift/attaching parts on the machine? I don't have the tractor yet so I can't say for sure, but did receive both kits and read the install directions for the mech. lift and the ind. lift, they seem to use the same attaching parts. The way Deere lists the parts is a bit confusing so I can see how the mistake could be made. I would think the dealers would know better but then again, I'm dealing with sales people, not service techs.

I remember looking at the tractor and it had all the attaching hardware connected to the 3 pt already, no deck attached. I believe all I need to do is remove the mech. lift parts that connect to the 3pt. hitch, install the hydraulic cylinder and route the hose. looks pretty easy to me. Am I wrong?

Thanks,
Steve

 

[North Country]

2) when lowering the deck, if I accidentally (very easy to happen) pushed the SCV all the way out and entered the Regen fuction (rapid loader dump), my deck would bounce up and down wildly because of it.

THAT explains it! And I thought I didn't have regen...

Once you have it installed, here's a tip on using it that not many get - the knob adjusts the point at which the deck will stop when lowered, NOT the current height. In other words, if your deck is 2" high and you want to raise it to 3", don't turn the knob! You'll wear it out. Raise the deck, THEN turn the knob, THEN lower the deck to the new stop. Same goes for adjusting the deck lower - raise deck, turn knob, lower deck. There is a plastic piece in there that wears out quickly if used improperly.

I installed it myself recently, and even with the backhoe subframe removal it didn't take too long. Look up the torques on the BH subframe if you remove it - the rear bolts are torqued a lot lighter than the grade stamp on the bolt would have you believe.

 

[C-Range]

Hink,

If you get familiar with JDParts.com, you can research the parts you need for your installation to the nines. I will often cross reference this with the new machine "Build Your Own" configurator. Unfortunately, this isn't possible with the 2305 any longer

North C,

The regen circuit on my 2305 was almost hard to notice at times so I can understand why you might not have realized it was there. Sometimes when I would try to rapid dump my bucket, it would stick and stop. I'd have to curl it back up and start over again. I took it in to my "dealer" and they said, "mmMMmm, that's just the way it works....:drool:" so I just lived with it.

There is a way to lock out the regen circuit (it's in the owners manual), but it's not a 10 second switch. It's a plate on the SCV mechanism that has to be accessed and moved. I believe this involves removing the SCV cover plate and then pulling two pins. It takes 30 seconds to remove the loader and 10 minutes to lock out the regen circuit. :laughing:

 

[North Country]

The regen circuit on my 2305 was almost hard to notice at times so I can understand why you might not have realized it was there. Sometimes when I would try to rapid dump my bucket, it would stick and stop. I'd have to curl it back up and start over again. I took it in to my "dealer" and they said, "mmMMmm, that's just the way it works....:drool:" so I just lived with it.

There is a way to lock out the regen circuit (it's in the owners manual), but it's not a 10 second switch. It's a plate on the SCV mechanism that has to be accessed and moved. I believe this involves removing the SCV cover plate and then pulling two pins. It takes 30 seconds to remove the loader and 10 minutes to lock out the regen circuit. :laughing:

That's exactly the behavior I noticed. I hadn't removed the cover to look at the L-plate - it's one of those things I was going to get to in the winter.