220v outlet for welder powered by (2) 20 amp breakers

[GeneV]

sorry, missed the brand and model number.... Ok, here are the pertinant specs, at least on Amazon.:Rated Input Voltage: AC 100~250V; Frequency: 50~60Hz; Rated Input Power: 230V/6.7KVA/29.3A & 115V/4.7KVA/41A; Current Range, 230V: 5-160 Amp & 115V: 5-130

As you can see, for max output you will need 29.3A on 230 volts and would have to have a 41 amp circuit on 115 volts and even then it would not develope full power according to the KVA rating. Likely if your circuit runs more to 240 volts as many do here in America, it might draw a bit less. And again, most 1/8 rods will need less than 160 amps to run good. The 7014 1/8 runs pretty good at 140, and the 7018 runs good at 122 to 125. Depending on welder. While it says it will burn a 1/8 rod at 130 amps on 120 volts, you must always take ratings with a little skepticism. Of course it IS an inverter so the efficiency will be much higher than a transformer machine.

As stated before, you could run with your existing wiring and a 20 amp 240 volt breaker and see how it does. Of course with the smaller rods, you are not going to have any problem at all, and likely will do just fine with some 7018 up to 1/8 and you could certainly try some 7014 (monkey rod) at 140. Of course like any other welder, these "amp" settings are just where you start. You will always have to go up or down a little with settings depending on how your machine runs. No two machines run alike. Watch the puddle, and you will soon have a feel for "too hot" and "too cold".

Oh wow, so looks like I'd HAVE to do this convoluted 220v outlet business to get things cooking on 20 amps. Totally hear you on "balls to the wall", certainly would prefer to have surplus unused amps.

But now I'm taking a second look at Jaxs's post about gfci's on my garage line...

 

[GeneV]

Yes,it will double the power. 110volt x 20 amps = 2200 watts . 220 volts x 20 amps = 4400 wats. It isn't a "royal pain" at all for an electrician to run a bigger wire to the garage. Hire one. The fact you have GFIs make this impossible,the fact you don't know electrical make's it foolish to circumvent GFIs in order to do it.

Ok, I see what you mean here about gfci's...current in hot must match current in neutral for it not to trip. But in my case, I'm only taking the hot from that circuit, so it's gonna trip the gfci's upstream, urghh summabich!

 

[MossRoad]

How many circuits do you currently have from your house to your unattached garage?

 

[WranglerX]

Alright Dale, this is helpful, so sounds like I would come out ahead with 220 even on 20 amps? I don't have the welder yet, but what I'm reading on amazon, people doing ok with 20 amps on 110v. Somebody asked about something similar to what I'm looking to do with 20 amps on 220, the response to the question from Amico was that 30 amps is "better".

Be careful of what you read as reviews.....

I have a Hobart Handler 140 MIG welder it is 120 vac unit, its capable if 140 amps for MIG welding, and the Hobart manual states it can run perfectly well on 20 amp breaker... What they are a little shy of telling you is that is at mid range setting.... IF I crank it up to its full potential it trips 20 amp breaker.... Some deeper research shows the on top setting it draws 24.7 amps.... DUH.... Had to put in 30 amp "DEDICATED" welding circuit to accommodate welder... That is why I noted the code compliance is different for dedicated welder circuit then for "house hold" receptacles....

Quite frankly I don't think you will be happy with 20 amp 240 v circuit for welder as it limit you to low to mid range amperage (heat) and if so you wasted money on a 240 volt machine when a plain 120 volt machine will have same output as "limited" 240 volt operation..... The first time you put a big rod in machine and crank up amperage and strike a arc on some 3/8 plate and about 3.5 seconds into weld "POP" goes the beaker and, you are wondering "what the heck is wrong here"....

Dale

 

[WranglerX]

16 Amp Digital Display LCD Stick/ARC DC Inverter 115V & 23V Welding Machine

Site states 20 amp on 120v , and 30 amp on 240 v circuit...

DO NOT go by information in retailers ad (much of the time its not correct), go by product sheet for welder....

Dale

 

[GeneV]

How many circuits do you currently have from your house to your unattached garage?

As far as I know 2 circuits, one marked "garage" in the panel in the basement, which services the garage door and all the outlets. The defunct shed circuit is the other one, I traced that to it's breaker with a circuit tracer tool thingie.

But the conduit carrying those wires out from the panel is jammed full of other wires too, there's no room to stick two more 10 ga wires in there. So, would need to run a new conduit.

 

[GeneV]

Be careful of what you read as reviews.....

I have a Hobart Handler 140 MIG welder it is 120 vac unit, its capable if 140 amps for MIF welding, and the Hobart manual states it can run perfectly well on 20 amp breaker... What they are a little shy of telling you is that is at mid range setting.... IF I crank it up to its full potential it trips 20 amp breaker.... Some deeper research shows the on top setting it draws 24.7 amps.... DUH.... Had to put in 30 amp "DEDICATED" welding circuit to accommodate welder... That is why I noted the code compliance is different for dedicated welder circuit then for "house hold" receptacles....

Quite frankly I don't think you will be happy with 20 amp 240 v circuit for welder as it limit you to low to mid range amperage (heat) and if so you wasted money on a 240 volt machine when a plain 120 volt machine will have same output as "limited" 240 volt operation..... The first time you put a big rod in machine and crank up amperage and strike a arc on some 3/8 plate and about 3.5 seconds into weld "POP" goes the beaker and, you are wondering "what the heck is wrong here"....

Dale

No no, it's no waste. I got this for same price as harbor fright's little 80 amp stick welder, and this one is a much nicer machine. I've read and watch reviews of people comparing both and even on 120v, the Amico wins out.

Correction: 11 bux less than HF's welder.

 

[GeneV]

Would I not feel the same way with any other 120v welder?

 

[Popgadget]

If you have 12 gauge wire from the panel to the outlet box, and room in the panel for another breaker, you could feed that with a 2 pole 20amp breaker and put in a 240 volt 20 amp receptacle for your welder. That would meet code and everything would be protected. You won’t have as much power available to the welder as you would with 10 gauge wire and a 30 amp breaker, but you will have twice as much as you would on a 20 amp 120 bolt circuit.

 

[CoyPatton]

If I understand your information correctly, you have a box with 2 separate 20 amp circuits in it.
You could have 240 volts present in this box but not necessarily! Unless you understand how a breaker box is constructed that confuses you! By your questions in opening statement, I am guessing you do not understand the construction of a breaker box.

Try to stay simple here so please police accept that qualifier!
1) You have 2 supply lines of 120 volts (and other lines) coming into the breaker panel.
2) The construction is such that from top to bottom the supplied breakers go from one to the other supply line. So that 1 & 3 and 2 & 4 number breakers as groups get power from different supply lines. (Sorry probably clear as mud). But here in is why you may not have 240 v in that empty box. Breakers in slot 2 & 3 get power from the same supply line as do breakers in slots 1 & 4.
This alternating process continues. In that breaker 2 & 6 are feed by the same supply line. Also 1 & 5 are on the same supply line. So if you look at your breaker panel you can soon grasp the alternating pattern.
3) To get 240v in a box you need a hot wire from each supply line.
4) For good reason for safety NEC requires the 2 breakers to be physically connected in the breaker panel. This is do if only 1 hot wire experiences in number of fault issues, it trips all power to that outlet.