Let me start of by saying that I am in no way an expert in these old tractors. I bought an NAA about 6 months ago and it runs really well but the steering is giving me trouble. I am using it with a 60 inch finishing mower to mow my 3 acres of grass. The last few times I have run it the steering is really difficult to turn to the left and makes a creaking noise but only when going left. When I turn to the right the left tire cuts into the lawn really bad but when turning to the left there is no problem. I am thinking it is a bearing out on the left spindle but the creaking noise seems to be coming from the steering box. Anyone have any suggestions where to start looking to find the problem? Thanks
1953 NAA question
- Thread starter Firehawk
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gatractorman
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That is a classic old tractor, keep it going if you can. I inherited this same model tractor.
I would start by purchasing an I&T manual for this model, then I would check the lube in the steering box then check the spindles for loose play also the spindle tubes have grease fittings that for some reason are forgotten about.
Also you may have one steering rod adjusted longer or shorter than needed this will cause the ribbed tires to dig in.
These tractors didn't steer bad when everything is right.
I would start by purchasing an I&T manual for this model, then I would check the lube in the steering box then check the spindles for loose play also the spindle tubes have grease fittings that for some reason are forgotten about.
Also you may have one steering rod adjusted longer or shorter than needed this will cause the ribbed tires to dig in.
These tractors didn't steer bad when everything is right.
Soundguy
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Jack the front end up.. check the bushings in the spindles.. check the hub bearings.. these 'may' address the cutting in. The hard steering, is almost without a doubt the top thrust bearing that has disintegrated in the top of the steering box.
You may notic ethat the steering wheel rises up or goes down intot he shaft a bit when you steer side to side.
I fthe steering is easy when jacked up.. but hard when down.. figure bearing. if it is hard when jacked up.. figure bad spindle bushing.. or too much sector backlash adjustment.
The steering box and tube has a bushing at the top of the tube.. that needs to be checked too.. as if it is out.. it allows too much play in the shaft. The 'top' bearing, which is under the steering cover rides atop the steering worm gear ( ballnut rides the worm ).. there is a race in the steering cover. There is an identical bearing and race int he bottom of the box. generally if there is any lube in the box.. this race and bearing are ok.. but you may still need to fish the old roler bearing parts out with a magnet on a pole. or pull the sector side covers and the steering shaft and clean the box out completely.. your choice. If you do pull the sectors, pay attention to alignment.. there is a master spline tooth ont he left sector.. the left sector engages the ballnut in front, and the right sector in the rear improper alignment will make it steer farther in one direction. DO NOT take the ballnut apart.. you will be forever getting the rollers back in it.
If your sector seals are good.. fill it with 140wt lube.. if they leak, either replace them ( some work.. ) or replace the fill plug with a 1/4 pipe thread grease zerk and pump full of a 0# grease like John Deer cornhead grease.. it is a pourable grease that settles, and is suitable for gear boxes, as it will settle and flow back into the gears instead of slinging out to the sides and staying there like a regular grease. Many NH dealers also carry a rhine pourable gear box lube.. same deal.. it's a 0# grease..... etc.
DO get an F)-19 I&T manual. R&R ont he gearbox isn't that bad... You will spend more time getting the torpedo sheetmetal off than doing the box. Bearings and races go for about 7$ each.. so figure 14$ for the top.. your choice on doing the bottom or the seals. I've rebuilt a few N gear boxes... havn't seen a bad lower bearing in a unit that had at least some oil in it. I've also ound that if the seals aren't totally gone.. grease is the easiest fix.. if the seals have seperated and shelled out.. go ahead and replace them.. they won't hold the grease thru the 1/18 and 1/16 gaps very well..
After you get the box back together.. adjust the sector backlash via the nut-locked studs onthe sector side covers. As you screw the stud in.. the sectors mesh tighter... snug is fine..any tighter and steering will be hard and gears will wear.. Adjust left side first.. then right.. do this with front still jacked up.
Also.. no need to remove the box from the tractor if you are not replacing the bottom bearing race ( it sets in a recess atop a welsh plug that can be driven out to replace the race.. like i said.. if there is 1/4" oil in there.. lower bearing and race probably ok.. but do get the excess metal out... and acoid the nylon bearings some chincy-cheap places may try to sell you.. go back in with metal bearings..
If you need help.. email... I collect fords... and the basic design of that dual sectore steering box started on ford in 1947, and was improved in the early 50's.. then again in late 52.. then again in 54.. and again at the thousand series.. etc.. ( trike and some other models had a different setup.. )
Soundguy
You may notic ethat the steering wheel rises up or goes down intot he shaft a bit when you steer side to side.
I fthe steering is easy when jacked up.. but hard when down.. figure bearing. if it is hard when jacked up.. figure bad spindle bushing.. or too much sector backlash adjustment.
The steering box and tube has a bushing at the top of the tube.. that needs to be checked too.. as if it is out.. it allows too much play in the shaft. The 'top' bearing, which is under the steering cover rides atop the steering worm gear ( ballnut rides the worm ).. there is a race in the steering cover. There is an identical bearing and race int he bottom of the box. generally if there is any lube in the box.. this race and bearing are ok.. but you may still need to fish the old roler bearing parts out with a magnet on a pole. or pull the sector side covers and the steering shaft and clean the box out completely.. your choice. If you do pull the sectors, pay attention to alignment.. there is a master spline tooth ont he left sector.. the left sector engages the ballnut in front, and the right sector in the rear improper alignment will make it steer farther in one direction. DO NOT take the ballnut apart.. you will be forever getting the rollers back in it.
If your sector seals are good.. fill it with 140wt lube.. if they leak, either replace them ( some work.. ) or replace the fill plug with a 1/4 pipe thread grease zerk and pump full of a 0# grease like John Deer cornhead grease.. it is a pourable grease that settles, and is suitable for gear boxes, as it will settle and flow back into the gears instead of slinging out to the sides and staying there like a regular grease. Many NH dealers also carry a rhine pourable gear box lube.. same deal.. it's a 0# grease..... etc.
DO get an F)-19 I&T manual. R&R ont he gearbox isn't that bad... You will spend more time getting the torpedo sheetmetal off than doing the box. Bearings and races go for about 7$ each.. so figure 14$ for the top.. your choice on doing the bottom or the seals. I've rebuilt a few N gear boxes... havn't seen a bad lower bearing in a unit that had at least some oil in it. I've also ound that if the seals aren't totally gone.. grease is the easiest fix.. if the seals have seperated and shelled out.. go ahead and replace them.. they won't hold the grease thru the 1/18 and 1/16 gaps very well..
After you get the box back together.. adjust the sector backlash via the nut-locked studs onthe sector side covers. As you screw the stud in.. the sectors mesh tighter... snug is fine..any tighter and steering will be hard and gears will wear.. Adjust left side first.. then right.. do this with front still jacked up.
Also.. no need to remove the box from the tractor if you are not replacing the bottom bearing race ( it sets in a recess atop a welsh plug that can be driven out to replace the race.. like i said.. if there is 1/4" oil in there.. lower bearing and race probably ok.. but do get the excess metal out... and acoid the nylon bearings some chincy-cheap places may try to sell you.. go back in with metal bearings..
If you need help.. email... I collect fords... and the basic design of that dual sectore steering box started on ford in 1947, and was improved in the early 50's.. then again in late 52.. then again in 54.. and again at the thousand series.. etc.. ( trike and some other models had a different setup.. )
Soundguy
Wow soundguy...what a great post! I actually printed that post and are now keeping it with all of my manuals. I got the left wheel problem fixed by changing the length of the rod. I am going to order the berring and bushing today and we'll see if that takes care of the problem. I have one other question about it. My steering wheel will not come off. I removed the nut and tried and tried to pull it off but could not. Does anyone know what I am doing wrong? Have any tips? Thanks again guys!
Soundguy
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Common issue. First.. hit it real good with penetrating oil. To make it easier, do this for a few days, Thread the acorn nut back on but leave it just a little bit loose.. take a small hammer like a tack hammer ant tap all the way around the hud of the wheel right where it engages the splines onthe steering shaft.. do this for a couple days with the penetrating oil. On the day you remove it.. hat the hub up.. then quench it with penetrating oil.. heat it up again and tap aroud the hub.. this should swag the metal hub. If that doesn't make it some off, loosen the nut another coule turns, and stradle the tranny standing ont he floor boards.. grab the steering wheel on either side and rock it as you pull up.. this usually breaks it free.. DO remember to have that acorn nut back on.. or else you will wake up laying onthe ground behind your tractor 10 minutes later with a not on your forehead and holding a steering wheel trying to figure out what happened.
If it's really stubborn, fint a nut ( or the acorn nut ) and thread it on and use a puller on it. Snug the puller up.. then tighten it a bit.. tap on hub with hammer... this usuallt does it.. be care full.. steering wheel hup is stamped sheet metal and will eventually deform. If this looks like what is happening, no need to save it.. steering wheels are available.. just get a hacksaw and cut some relief cuts up the side of the hub.. stay out of the steering tube then take a chissle where the metal comes upt he side of the hub and flattens out to go over to the spline, and split it with a chissle.
Try all the other stuff first.. especially if you want to salvage the steering wheel.
On the reinstall.. wire brush all debri/paint / rust out of the threads and splines.
One last thing.. is the splined area is real rusty, and you want to save the steering wheel vs cutting it off, then get some naval jelly and put it on and let it eat that rust down first..
Soundguy
If it's really stubborn, fint a nut ( or the acorn nut ) and thread it on and use a puller on it. Snug the puller up.. then tighten it a bit.. tap on hub with hammer... this usuallt does it.. be care full.. steering wheel hup is stamped sheet metal and will eventually deform. If this looks like what is happening, no need to save it.. steering wheels are available.. just get a hacksaw and cut some relief cuts up the side of the hub.. stay out of the steering tube then take a chissle where the metal comes upt he side of the hub and flattens out to go over to the spline, and split it with a chissle.
Try all the other stuff first.. especially if you want to salvage the steering wheel.
On the reinstall.. wire brush all debri/paint / rust out of the threads and splines.
One last thing.. is the splined area is real rusty, and you want to save the steering wheel vs cutting it off, then get some naval jelly and put it on and let it eat that rust down first..
Soundguy
Well SoundGuy you da man.... It was exactly like you said the top berring pretty much exploded. I got it replaced but now when I turn the steering wheel to the right the yoke?? goes up but the wheels do not turn.. I know I did something stupid but cannot figure out what.
Soundguy
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When you reassemble the box, the top cover with he race should hold the bearing, on the steering shaft in a bit of pre-load against the bearing on the bottom of the shaft, against the race in the bottom of the box. Use shims around the top cover to control preload. Once you have the top cover on, if the steering wheel can rise and fall, you do not have any preload.. that is.. there is bearing clearance between the bearing and race. Not sure how this happened unless the top or bottom race slipped or wore BADLY or the beaing is not the correct one. ( nylon - plastic bearings will not fit correctly inthe oem application.. ).
If this wasn't what you were describing, please repost and I'll try to help.
Also.. when you say 'yoke'.. are you refering to the ballnut?
If so.. did you remove the ballnut and shaft from the box? If so, did you get the ballnut centered back on the shaft, and then have it engage the left sector with the left sectors 'large' master spline standing straight up, and then have the left sector engege the right sector with the right sector set so that there were equal number of teeth above and below the area the splines joined? ( I&T fo-19 and FO-4 manuals show this real good, and explain the secot / ballnut realignment much better than I can. ).
Let me know if you need any more info, or if we need to look at this furthere to figure it out.
( Also.. if you did remove the ballnut and shaft.. did you make sure the lower bearing stayed ont he shaft.. the keepers are weak.. lower bearing might have slippe doff, leaving about 1/4 to 3/8" extra clearance, and noway to establis some preload ont he shaft.. etc..
Soundguy
If this wasn't what you were describing, please repost and I'll try to help.
Also.. when you say 'yoke'.. are you refering to the ballnut?
If so.. did you remove the ballnut and shaft from the box? If so, did you get the ballnut centered back on the shaft, and then have it engage the left sector with the left sectors 'large' master spline standing straight up, and then have the left sector engege the right sector with the right sector set so that there were equal number of teeth above and below the area the splines joined? ( I&T fo-19 and FO-4 manuals show this real good, and explain the secot / ballnut realignment much better than I can. ).
Let me know if you need any more info, or if we need to look at this furthere to figure it out.
( Also.. if you did remove the ballnut and shaft.. did you make sure the lower bearing stayed ont he shaft.. the keepers are weak.. lower bearing might have slippe doff, leaving about 1/4 to 3/8" extra clearance, and noway to establis some preload ont he shaft.. etc..
Soundguy
Well after pulling the sectors and the steering shaft I found that the bottom berring was destroyed as well. I have 2 new ones on order and they should be here in the next couple of days. I got them from just8ns.com so they are the metal berrings. On a side note I was amazed that 2 local NH dealerships wanted $19.26 at one and $21.86 at the other for this same berring. When I asked why there was a difference I was told that they each do their own markup. When I called just8ns it was $12...humm that's quite a markup..rant over. /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif I will let yall know how I do putting this all back together.
Soundguy
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I get my bearings from just8ns as well.. they are the correct bearings.
The bottom one may be tricky, especially if your keeper is gone. if so.. just gob it up with grease and stick it in place till you get it assembled.
Soundguy
The bottom one may be tricky, especially if your keeper is gone. if so.. just gob it up with grease and stick it in place till you get it assembled.
Soundguy
Ok I got everything put back together. I have all of the manuals for the NAA but none of them tell me how to adjust the sectors. The only info that I can find is that they say that it should be performed by your dealer. Does anyone know the proper procedure for adjusting them?
