1910 stalled / won't start

[Anonymous Poster]

1910 stalled / won\'t start

I purchased a Ford 1910 (1600 hrs) from a local dealer a couple of weeks ago, with help from people here. I've been trouble free since, BUT, today seemed like gremlin day! First problem was I found the exhaust cracked and leaning just below the muffler after it makes the upward turn from the block. Didn't bother trying to do anything with that - yet.
Then, I fried the fan belt, overheated a little and spilled some fluid. I replaced the belt (44" V-belt - right?), topped off the fluid w/ 50/50 (only took about one half of the coolant jug) every thing seemed fine, except the exhaust.
I later noticed it was having some stutters at idle and attributed this to the exhaust being cracked. Later in the day, after several hours of use, I was box scraping started to get bogged down. The tractor then stalled and wouldn't start. I wasn't bogged down to the point of being close to stalling the tractor, so I'm not sure thats related. It was like I had just ran out of fuel, although I had just put in 5 gallons a few hours before.
After going over a few things I decided to check the fuel filter (the screen in front of the radiator was really clogged when I cahnged the belt). I closed (I think - no markings) the petcock, unsrewed the bowl and found some debris in the bottom. Dumped the debris and checked the filter which looked fine. Replaced everything (including the spring I almost missed) and tried starting. Remembered I had the petcock off and turned it back to the position it was in (pointing staight down). It almost started several times but wouldn't catch (like it was cold and didn't have enough glow plug). Tried the glow plug, no help. Unscrewed the filter agin to see if I could determine the correct petcok setting. Again, a little debris in the bowl. All three positions seemed to have little effect on the amount of gas coming through (I didn't try turning it over with the bowl off).
Before I go any further let me admit up front I've got no idea what I'm doing! I've run a borrowed NH skid steer out of fuel before and that had a "tickler" lever that I couldn't find on this. I've also seen the crack each injector method, but I'm not sure I need to do this or where to do this. The tractor stalled like it was running out of gas. There was no indication of anything seizing or breaking. I had put 5 gallons in a few hours before (good clean diesel). As I said, it almost started a couple of times, but just wouldn't "catch."
I'm not to mechanically inclined and I feel like I'm missing something pretty simple. I'll be getting on my delaer for the manuel that was promised to go with this and for some advice. In the mean time, to put my mind at ease, any suggestions? Could the cracked exhaust pipe below the muffler cause this kind of malfunction? Am I missing another fuel filter somewhere? Is there a tickler?
Any help is greatly appreciated. I know I've kind of rambled here, but I wanted to get as many details in.
BTW - Strange, but the tractor acted the same way in the same spot twice. The first time I had decided I was low on fuel, and it ran fine after I put in the 5 gallons. Second time it had fuel and I wasn't so lucky. It was pointed downhill both times, but not any kind of dramatic angle.
Thanks again,
Tony

 

[Bird]

Re: 1910 stalled / won\'t start

I'll take a guess. First you say it happened twice in the same spot, headed downhill, and you found debris in the filter bowl. My guess is water and/or debris in the fuel tank that only gets picked up when it's tilted a certain direction. I believe I'd completely drain and clean the fuel tank and blow out the fuel lines with compressed air. It's trying to start, but won't quite make it? I'll guess you're going to need to bleed the injectors.

 

[AndyMA]

Re: 1910 stalled / won\'t start

I agree with Bird. I have a 2120 and when I have a similar problem I do what you did and then I bleed the injectors. When a diesel gets air bound it will not start and the air has to be blead. This will happen anytime you run out of fuel. Just crack the top bolt on each of the injectors and crank the engine over. Wait until no bubbles and tighten the bolts. The engine should now start.

Andy

 

[Anonymous Poster]

Re: 1910 stalled / won\'t start

Just to be silly, I'll say I assume by 'gas' you meant 'diesel', right? /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

I'm not 100% familiar with your tractor, but aren't you supposed to toss the fuel filter & use a new one? Or does yours use a fuel bulb & fine mesh screen?

I too would clean out the whole system. I think the other guys have it right.

By adding fuel & starting it up right away, all the dirt & water in the bottom of your tank got suspended in the fuel, & sucked down into the fuel system. Get it all cleaned out.... There should be a steady stream of fuel with one of the valve settings.

--->Paul

 

[Anonymous Poster]

Re: 1910 stalled / won\'t start

Thanks for the quick responses guys - I love this board!
Basics, yes I'm using diesel and I probably should just toss the filter - its paper. Cracking the injectors, am I doing this on top of the block OR down on the right side?
Cleaning the whole system, do I just disconnect each line and blow it out or do I have to go further?

 

[Anonymous Poster]

Re: 1910 stalled / won\'t start

follow up:
went to the dealer and got some advice. I replaced the filter and both lines (coming from the petcok and going to - I don't know what its called!) along with the filter. Still no luck. I started taking the lines apart at the banjo fittings and found many of the gaskets on both sides of the fittings to be disintergrated and breaking off in pieces, which looked very similar to what I was finding in the bottom of my bowl. One gasket in particular (on the bottom of the fitting that connects to "out" on the filter) was pretty bad and after I reattached I could see air bubbles/fuel leaking from the area. I never did get gas up to the injectors so, my questions are:
1) can minor fuel/air leaks in these gaskets prevent fuel from getting to the injectors
2) is there another spot I should be checking to see if the debris from the gaskets is cloggin up something
3) when I crack the injectors, am I really just "cracking" them or should I be opening them most of the way. The dealer recommended doing all at once and closing each one when I saw fuel from it. I think the other time I've see this done it was one injector at a time. Suggestions?
4) How long should I be cranking the engine before I see fuel at the injectors? I'm sure I've got a lot of air in there now, but I was cranking for quite a while with no results.
Its great I've got a place to go ask questions at this time of night instead of sleeping on it!

 

[Bird]

Re: 1910 stalled / won\'t start

I don't know about your 1910, but the only times I had to bleed the injectors on my B7100, I did them one at a time and didn't have to crank more than 5 seconds on any of them, and I only loosened each one a little bit. If I thought there was gasket debris in there, I might take the lines loose completely and blow them out first, them screw them back on not quite completely finger tight before cranking the engine to bleed them.

 

[JohnMiller3]

Re: 1910 stalled / won\'t start

<font color="blue">...Before I go any further let me admit up front I've got no idea what I'm doing!... </font>

Hi,

No offense, but before you dig yourself a real deep hole... and the deeper the more $$$ it ends up costing... /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif

(You certainly don't want to introduce any new problems and add to it...) /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

What's the chances of getting the dealer out there and do a service call...?

This way, you can look over the tech's shoulder, see how it's done... and hopefully won't be in this position again... but you'll have the knowledge to proceed on your own in the future... if need be... /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[Anonymous Poster]

Re: 1910 stalled / won\'t start

The dealer didn't seem to think or suggest a tech was necessary. What are the chances of something going wrong if I bleed it wrong?

 

[djradz]

Re: 1910 stalled / won\'t start

If you've openend the sediment bowl, NH then says to flush the lines, with the bowl off by opening the shutoff valve until fuel flows freely from the filter. Shut the valve and reinstall the bowl and proceed to bleed. To bleed: 1) Open the shut-off valve. 2)Open the bleed screw at the pump (top of pump, behind where injector lines connect) 3)Push the hand throttle lever to the high speed position. Turn the engine over a few seconds to bleed the high pressure fuel tube. 4)loosen the injector line fittings at the injectors. 5) with the throttle still in the wide open position, crank the engine until air-free fuel flows from each connection. 6)Do not crank the engine continuously for more than 30 seconds. Doing so may cause starting motor failure. If air is not purged from the system, repeat the procedure.

 

[Soundguy]

Re: 1910 stalled / won\'t start

I'm not familiar with a 1910.. i've got a 1920...
I'll go with the others.. an air leak on the suction side of the injector pump is going to make starting difficult.

One more way way way right field outside possibility...
Does your injector pump have a fuel shutoff solenoid?.. if your machine turns off when you shut the key of, then yes it does.... Check to see that a wire didn't get pulled off the solenoid.
If while you are bleeding the lines you don't get any fuel, it may be the solenoid stuck closed... but really sounds like an air problem..

good luck,

Soundguy

 

[Anonymous Poster]

Re: 1910 stalled / won\'t start

soundguy - no solenoid
djradz - I think those are the steps I needed. I;m making a couple of assumptions though 1) the high speed tube bleeder screw is a screw (there are a bolt which looks like a fill hole and then the fitting with a screw on top) and I can just loosen the fitting as it'll be a pain to loosen the screw and 2) I'm supposed to close the bleeder on the pump before I crack the injector bleeders - right?
I'm feeling more confident with the help of you guys and the dealer. I discussed the bowl filling up with the the dealer and it seems it was taking much to long 3-5 minutes. Dealer suggested I blow out the line with compressed air. Sure enough, bowl is now filling in about 30 seconds or less. I only attempted a little bleeding (battery was weak) but I think the correct bleeding procedure and blowing out the lines SHOULD do the trick.
Now, bad news, this means I've got quite a bit of junk in my fuel tank (again - assuming) so what do I do to solve that?
Wish me luck guys, every day this thing isn't running is killing me!

 

[djradz]

Re: 1910 stalled / won\'t start

AV, I think you've got it!!! The setup is similar to my old 1720, but I'm not sure of the screw vs. the bolt. I'd try what looks easiest. My 1720 used to have a bolt with a hole in the side of it, but yours could be a little different. Anyway, once the fluid flows easily to the bowl, it should also flow easily to the top of the pump. I'd do some serious cleaning of the tank before doing much of anything more. If it took compressed air to get much flow at the bowl, you've got a major problem in the tank or the line to the bowl. Can you see into the tank? Park in a dark location and use a flashlight maybe. My guess is you've got some gelling or rust or other gunk. I think I've read somewhere that diesel will even support some kind of mold or algae growth if enough moisture gets into it. Anyway, that filter bowl should fill up in a matter of seconds! Even if your problem turns out to be something else, your current situation with fuel flow (or lack thereof) is not right. Lastly, yes, before doing any bleeding of the lines or cranking of the engine, close the bleed screw/bolt (whatever) on the top of the pump. As NH states, fluid should have flowed freely by this time.

 

[Anonymous Poster]

Re: 1910 stalled / won\'t start

OK, makes sense, thanks again.
Now, what does cleaning out the tank entail? I'm assuming I need to remove it from the tractor - then what? How about additives / cleaners for diesel?
Hopefully, I'm not jumping ahead and will have it started tonight!

 

[djradz]

Re: 1910 stalled / won\'t start

If you can remove it, that would be the easiest way to clean it. That way you can add clean fuel, slosh it around, and then dump it. Then do it again and again until it looks clean. I've even hear of putting a few small stones or larger nuts and bolts in to help with any scrubbing action that might be necessary. Obviously, anything you put in must come out. If you can't get the tank off, I really don't have any suggestions other than siphoning off, refilling, and then doing it all again. You should look to see if there's some type of screen or filter in the tank which also might need to be cleaned or even replaced. I'm not sure what a 1910 has. When you're all done, I'd just add good clean fuel. I prefer to purchase it from a gas station that services diesel autos rather than from a fuel supplier, but everyone has there own opinions. Stay away from any place where there fuel is stored above ground or gets very low usage.

 

[Anonymous Poster]

Re: 1910 stalled / won\'t start

Thanks to everyone's help I got the 1910 purring good as new last night. That bleeder screw on the pump really did the trick as soon as I figured out how to use it! I must of just about bled the injectors too because it almost started while I was just bleeding the pump. FYI, it seemed I also had an air lock on the line between the filter and pump. I opened it several times before starting the bleeding process and watched air escape.
hopefully, the tank won't plug again until a rainy day. When it does, I plan to remove and clean it and replace the seals around the banjo fittings.

 

[djradz]

Re: 1910 stalled / won\'t start

Good to hear. I'd be cautious about using it though until I got the tank clean. If you had to use compressed air to clean out the line, I suspect it may not take too long to plug again. If you can see junk in the tank, I'd take care of it immediately. Anyway, glad you've figured out what was happening.