Critter Proof Foundation Vent Screens?

   / Critter Proof Foundation Vent Screens? #1  

ultrarunner

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This is a very active year for critters that like to set up housekeeping in home crawl spaces.

I surveyed the perimeter and found 5 of 12 builders grade vent screens with the 1/4” mesh ripped out.

The nominal size is 6x14 with finished in stucco opening of 5.5x13.5 opening.

I’ve seen a possum, raccoon and mice/rats this year… in nearly 60 years this would be a first and neighbors reporting similar.

Short of making something up with expanded metal what do you use to critter proof crawl space?
 
   / Critter Proof Foundation Vent Screens? #2  
This is a very active year for critters that like to set up housekeeping in home crawl spaces.

I surveyed the perimeter and found 5 of 12 builders grade vent screens with the 1/4” mesh ripped out.

The nominal size is 6x14 with finished in stucco opening of 5.5x13.5 opening.

I’ve seen a possum, raccoon and mice/rats this year… in nearly 60 years this would be a first and neighbors reporting similar.

Short of making something up with expanded metal what do you use to critter proof crawl space?
Stucco?

Seriously, stucco. Seal the crawlspace and line the floor with a vapor barrier. Keeps the vermin out and increases the fire resistance, and cuts the heating/cooling costs.

Failing that, any of the more modern, louver plus screen combinations, e.g. Vulcan vents. I think without a metal outer layer, rats, raccoons, and skunks can muscle their way in pretty easily. As you already know that they want to get in, it is probably overdue to up the barriers. It doesn't have to be Alcatraz, just enough to get them to go elsewhere, right?

FWIW: I added 1/16" stainless mesh on our original 1/4" mesh for fire safety by using stainless safety wire to wire the outer fine screen to the inner screening. I bulk cut a bunch of vent sized screens with a plasma cutter; it took just a few minutes to make a house worth of screen inserts.

All the best,

Peter
 
   / Critter Proof Foundation Vent Screens?
  • Thread Starter
#3  
What gauge on the stainless…?

When I say crawl space it’s about 5’ under the kitchen and living room joists…

I’ve got about a dozen Model A blocks, axles, fenders, etc plus some more modern 289 and 302 V8 motors.

A lot of that was stored when I was a teenager…

The surprise was seeing the possum and raccoon under there but opening 5x13 is big enough it seems.

Home is 2400 square feet and May PGE is 8.8 kWh average per day and .44 therms per day natural gas… single pane aluminum windows circa 1950’s…

As an individual I have never used a lot as far as utilities.
 
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   / Critter Proof Foundation Vent Screens? #4  
Stucco?

Seriously, stucco. Seal the crawlspace and line the floor with a vapor barrier. Keeps the vermin out and increases the fire resistance, and cuts the heating/cooling costs.

Failing that, any of the more modern, louver plus screen combinations, e.g. Vulcan vents. I think without a metal outer layer, rats, raccoons, and skunks can muscle their way in pretty easily. As you already know that they want to get in, it is probably overdue to up the barriers. It doesn't have to be Alcatraz, just enough to get them to go elsewhere, right?

FWIW: I added 1/16" stainless mesh on our original 1/4" mesh for fire safety by using stainless safety wire to wire the outer fine screen to the inner screening. I bulk cut a bunch of vent sized screens with a plasma cutter; it took just a few minutes to make a house worth of screen inserts.

All the best,

Peter
We’re considering encapsulation of our crawl space, but I have some questions.

What does one do with the foundation vent holes?

If one doesn’t insulate the the foundation walls how does it save on HVAC costs?
 
   / Critter Proof Foundation Vent Screens? #5  
This is a very active year for critters that like to set up housekeeping in home crawl spaces.

I surveyed the perimeter and found 5 of 12 builders grade vent screens with the 1/4” mesh ripped out.

The nominal size is 6x14 with finished in stucco opening of 5.5x13.5 opening.

I’ve seen a possum, raccoon and mice/rats this year… in nearly 60 years this would be a first and neighbors reporting similar.

Short of making something up with expanded metal what do you use to critter proof crawl space?
I was going to suggest 1/4" hardware cloth, but apparently your critters are more determined than ours. It keeps them out of the greenhouse here. Maybe double or triple layer it until you get a more permanent solution?
 
   / Critter Proof Foundation Vent Screens? #6  
I had a client with a rat problem. They ate through the screens on her crawl space vents and then took over her crawl space. I bought this metal from Lowes


I cut it to fit tight and then added screws into the corners to wedge it tight. Then I went around the outer edge with clear roofing caulk


I saw her yesterday out walking her dogs and she said the rats haven't gotten in since I did this. So it's working so far!!!
 
   / Critter Proof Foundation Vent Screens? #9  
Thanks I didn’t know them made those.
You're welcome. As for energy savings, I haven't gotten too far into the details to be able to say for sure, but got the impression that most heat loss is through the ceiling. Crawl spaces aren't heated and cooled enough to affect energy use as much as living areas. I am personally not sure that floor insulation between the crawl space and the living area is really justified, much less insulating the foundation walls in a crawl space.

In Tennessee, moisture from humidity is more of an issue in crawl spaces. In the remodel I did, I was more concerned about moisture. Installed vent covers, heavy mil plastic over the crawl space, and dug a perimeter drain which dried out the crawl space in my particular situation very well. I did not insulate the floor or the foundation walls.
 
   / Critter Proof Foundation Vent Screens? #10  
What gauge on the stainless…?

When I say crawl space it’s about 5’ under the kitchen and living room joists…

I’ve got about a dozen Model A blocks, axles, fenders, etc plus some more modern 289 and 302 V8 motors.

A lot of that was stored when I was a teenager…

The surprise was seeing the possum and raccoon under there but opening 5x13 is big enough it seems.

Home is 2400 square feet and May PGE is 8.8 kWh average per day and .44 therms per day natural gas… single pane aluminum windows circa 1950’s…

As an individual I have never used a lot as far as utilities.
Sorry, I thought that you were going after the standard screened vents. If it were me, given the local fire risk (you might look at what Berkeley Fire Safe is doing for ideas), I would enclose it all with fire resistant material, Hardie board, stucco over fire resistant plywood, and preferably seal the space. I think fire hardening homes is here to stay in California.

@dieselscout80 The desired method to block the vents is a 2x on the inside, and a vapor permeable, water resistant layer on the outside covered by whatever your exterior material is. US construction being what it is, almost every home is not well sealed between floors, so enclosing the crawlspace stops air intrusion from the crawlspace into the home. To give some numbers for perspective, a 2,400sq.ft. well built home from the 70s might have 2,000-3,000cfm of air intrusion at 0.2" of water pressure (0.0004psi) of pressure difference, much of that from the crawlspace. A 20mph wind will generate that pressure difference.

So that's thousands of cubic feet per minute of warm, humid air that you don't have to cool, and then lose to the environment, nor have to heat in the winter.

I can tell you it makes an enormous difference to an otherwise tight house. I had previously sealed all of the pipe pass through with expanding foam, as well as all of the ductwork openings, and sealing the crawlspace gave us a six to tenfold improvement in the indoor air quality (AQI), e.g. dropping the house AQI to 4-8@2.5micron, when the outdoors was 30, and to an AQI of 12, when the outdoors was 160, and running the whole house filter dropped the 12 to 4 in half an hour.

In our case, we think that we are saving around 50% of our prior energy bill. Might be 60%. Not a small amount in my view. We did add 4" of perimeter foam insulation, and the installer that we were "eccentric" for wanting more than 2", but the marginal cost was almost zero, and it almost halves the heat loss.

For folks in rural locations, not just Western states, especially with trees, I think that getting rid of crawlspace vents by encapsulating the crawlspace, and ventilating it with condition air is a great way to harden homes against wildfire risks. It is also a great way to save on cooling and heating costs.

All the best,

Peter
 
   / Critter Proof Foundation Vent Screens? #11  
Don't know what the problem is dieselscout80 wants to solve, but my first thought is that basic grading and drainage outside need to be considered first and then a roll of heavy mil plastic might be a lot less expensive to try than the cost of a professional "encapsulation."
 
   / Critter Proof Foundation Vent Screens? #12  
Don't know what the problem is dieselscout80 wants to solve, but my first thought is that basic grading and drainage outside need to be considered first and then a roll of heavy mil plastic might be a lot less expensive to try than the cost of a professional "encapsulation."
Not drainage issues

I wonder if something like 2” foam board on the brick would be good enough insulation?

We have new ductwork that’s insulated. Do I leave the ductwork insulated?

Should I remove the floor insulation?

We also have a heat pump water heater in our crawl space that removes humidity.
 
   / Critter Proof Foundation Vent Screens? #13  
Ductwork insulation is to prevent condensation forming. Would not remove it.

Don't know why you'd remove floor insulation, either.

You can calculate the expected energy savings for your area and your particular home by performing a "manual j" calculation that takes into account the climate of your area, the size of area to be insulated, and the degree of insulation you have versus what you plan to add.
 
   / Critter Proof Foundation Vent Screens? #14  
Not drainage issues

I wonder if something like 2” foam board on the brick would be good enough insulation?

We have new ductwork that’s insulated. Do I leave the ductwork insulated?

Should I remove the floor insulation?

We also have a heat pump water heater in our crawl space that removes humidity.

It took a crew of five working diligently 8+hours a day six days to do ours, but that included ripping out the old ducts, including duct boots. Unlike @2manyrocks, I'm going to suggest that this one is for the pros, at least until you've experienced a few. There's a lot to go wrong.

Like what?

Well the basic issue is that if you have dead space, you run the risk of humidity and mold. Then there is the potential issue of separate radon abatement below the membrane.

So before the vents are sealed, you have to get the under house drainage sorted out, perimeter drains if needed, barrier walls, sump pump, radon abatement, etc., then you need to put a water and vapor proof layer down. Standard LDPE is quite porous to water vapor, and won't cut it. There's inside of the foundation needs to be sealed, and then the membrane brought up to beyond the height of the perimeter foundation, and sealed to the house perimeter joist above the sill. Any obstacles, like piers and footings need to be sealed in the same way, and all of the floor seams need to be sealed with vapor barrier tape. Insulation can be added after the membrane is up, and then sealed both to prevent air intrusion, and to prevent cold spots that might be condensation points.

With that done, the vents are sealed, but the space needs to stay dry going forward. That means either a dehumidifier, and all that goes with it (power, drain pump, remote humidity monitor, overflow alarm, and noise isolation), or you need to divert some airflow from the house to keep the humidity down, and have a method for return air. Pros and cons to both. If one has a dehumidifier, a circulation fan is needed, but often not installed. I have never found dehumidifiers to be reliable, and constantly in need of maintenance. If I could have installed it in the space above, I might have considered it, but not in my crawlspace, but it depends on the access. If it is like @ultrarunner's 5' high space, with a drain, I think having a dehumidifier might be a different story. I don't, so I didn't put a dehumidifier in, but I did put multiple humidity and temperature monitors and we will see how it goes. So far it tracks the house closely, reinforcing the idea that there is a fair amount of air exchange between the inhabited space and the crawlspace.

@dieselscout80 there are arguments both ways on the insulation, but if it were me I would, and did, leave the insulation on. I wanted some control over how much heat or cooling was going into the space. I would bear in mind that most ducts have pitifully little insulation on them (R2-3.5 in many installations), so they are going to leak and absorb a fair amount of heat. If the crawlspace gets humid and you have uninsulated ducts, you run the risk of condensation, mold, and corrosion.

I have found one, repeat one, HVAC professional in my general area, which is not small, who can actually do an accurate Manual J. Seriously. After striking out, I gave up trying to find one, and then found an energy specialist who was also an architect, who actually knew how to do one. Most of the better HVAC folks load up a number of assumptions about "average homes" for your house and call it done. Might be close, but probably won't be. The typical person just eyeballs it. (X thousand sq.ft. mean Y tons of cooling and NN thousand BTUs of heating.) I would not consider doing one until after you have an accurate energy audit, and fixing all of the identified issues. So, by all means consider doing a Manual J, but GIGO. There's a great YouTube video by a couple of HVAC professionals that gets into why one should not trust a Manual J without getting quite a bit of specific data on the home from a series of other tests.

All the best,

Peter
 
   / Critter Proof Foundation Vent Screens? #15  
Radon mitigation is not something I can speak to because you're basically trying to trap it and expel it before it reaches your living space. Leaky ductwork in a crawl space can literally suck it into your living space.

If you're only dealing with excess humidity, you can monitor humidity levels easily these days to see whether a DIY vapor barrier is working or not working.

Keep in mind that many homes have terrible air intrusion between the sill and foundation block because zero effort was put into insulating this area when the homes were built. Manual J won't tell you if your home is abnormally leaky. That would require a pressure fan test.
 
   / Critter Proof Foundation Vent Screens?
  • Thread Starter
#16  
Home is on a hill top knoll and sitting on crushed rock from when the dozer scraped off the top of the hill… no trees as the hard pan is just below the surface.

The electric use of 8 kWh per day is basically a freezer and refrigerator, a load of Saturday wash and mostly light cooking… lighting is LED.

The standard practice here when a home is sold is the Pest Control report will add foundation vents… never seen any removed or sealed.

Same with new roofs… continuous ridge vents an more eve vents for longevity of the roof.
 
   / Critter Proof Foundation Vent Screens? #17  
It took a crew of five working diligently 8+hours a day six days to do ours, but that included ripping out the old ducts, including duct boots. Unlike @2manyrocks, I'm going to suggest that this one is for the pros, at least until you've experienced a few. There's a lot to go wrong.

Like what?

Well the basic issue is that if you have dead space, you run the risk of humidity and mold. Then there is the potential issue of separate radon abatement below the membrane.

So before the vents are sealed, you have to get the under house drainage sorted out, perimeter drains if needed, barrier walls, sump pump, radon abatement, etc., then you need to put a water and vapor proof layer down. Standard LDPE is quite porous to water vapor, and won't cut it. There's inside of the foundation needs to be sealed, and then the membrane brought up to beyond the height of the perimeter foundation, and sealed to the house perimeter joist above the sill. Any obstacles, like piers and footings need to be sealed in the same way, and all of the floor seams need to be sealed with vapor barrier tape. Insulation can be added after the membrane is up, and then sealed both to prevent air intrusion, and to prevent cold spots that might be condensation points.

With that done, the vents are sealed, but the space needs to stay dry going forward. That means either a dehumidifier, and all that goes with it (power, drain pump, remote humidity monitor, overflow alarm, and noise isolation), or you need to divert some airflow from the house to keep the humidity down, and have a method for return air. Pros and cons to both. If one has a dehumidifier, a circulation fan is needed, but often not installed. I have never found dehumidifiers to be reliable, and constantly in need of maintenance. If I could have installed it in the space above, I might have considered it, but not in my crawlspace, but it depends on the access. If it is like @ultrarunner's 5' high space, with a drain, I think having a dehumidifier might be a different story. I don't, so I didn't put a dehumidifier in, but I did put multiple humidity and temperature monitors and we will see how it goes. So far it tracks the house closely, reinforcing the idea that there is a fair amount of air exchange between the inhabited space and the crawlspace.

@dieselscout80 there are arguments both ways on the insulation, but if it were me I would, and did, leave the insulation on. I wanted some control over how much heat or cooling was going into the space. I would bear in mind that most ducts have pitifully little insulation on them (R2-3.5 in many installations), so they are going to leak and absorb a fair amount of heat. If the crawlspace gets humid and you have uninsulated ducts, you run the risk of condensation, mold, and corrosion.

I have found one, repeat one, HVAC professional in my general area, which is not small, who can actually do an accurate Manual J. Seriously. After striking out, I gave up trying to find one, and then found an energy specialist who was also an architect, who actually knew how to do one. Most of the better HVAC folks load up a number of assumptions about "average homes" for your house and call it done. Might be close, but probably won't be. The typical person just eyeballs it. (X thousand sq.ft. mean Y tons of cooling and NN thousand BTUs of heating.) I would not consider doing one until after you have an accurate energy audit, and fixing all of the identified issues. So, by all means consider doing a Manual J, but GIGO. There's a great YouTube video by a couple of HVAC professionals that gets into why one should not trust a Manual J without getting quite a bit of specific data on the home from a series of other tests.

All the best,

Peter
I agree with Peter on Manual J calculations. While it is the gold standard and is required in many contracts, most HVAC folks here in KY simply don't normally do it. When I was doing calculations for an older home I was working on in KY, I bought the software and did it myself. It does take some time, but it's not that hard. My estimates for heat loss/gain were much more accurate than the pros. The results of those calculations give you a real baseline from which to proceed.

Why more pros don't run this calculation, like they used to, is beyond me. They give educated guesses, but they're still guesses...
 
   / Critter Proof Foundation Vent Screens? #18  
Most of the residential HVAC installers I've dealt with roughly estimate the tons required to heat and cool based on total square footage, but then oversize to make sure they aren't called back because of inadequate heating or cooling later. Then I've seen commercial installs where engineers refused to spec systems without first running pressure tests to determine actual building leakage.

As for Ultrarunner's situation, manual j probably doesn't matter if you live somewhere where it's sunny, 72 degrees F, and low humidity all the time.
 
   / Critter Proof Foundation Vent Screens? #19  
I was going to suggest 1/4" hardware cloth, but apparently your critters are more determined than ours. It keeps them out of the greenhouse here. Maybe double or triple layer it until you get a more permanent solution?
I have to agree with this suggestion. I live in the country and often have to fight off things that want to get inside ... I have used 1/4" hardware cloth for years, attached to a securely anchored frame to stop intrusions through vents.

I even stopped a determined groundhog once - while strong, they cease chewing when they hit steel... Unfortunately, they can tunnel under many foundations - then you use other means (Conibear traps).
 
   / Critter Proof Foundation Vent Screens?
  • Thread Starter
#20  
The pros in my experience upsize so no comebacks complaints not enough heat or cooling.

Brothers first home was cookie cutter 1948 slab tract home. Being on a slab he had no critter issues.

His wife wanted A/C so it fell to me.

Neighbors all had new electric service with new A/C… and the systems were all much larger.

What they didn’t do was pull interior sheet rock to insulate, replace all exterior windows and doors, add attic insulation and have a big shade tree to block summer afternoon heat.

We also put on a new roof and added lots of vents…

I went with a much smaller unit so no service upgrade and it worked beautifully and the variable blower provided gentle air flow… when he added on 320 square feet the unit still worked well as a set and forget…

Even the dealer said I was going too small based on what he had sold in the area…

It was a Tempstar and was 15 years old when they sold the place…

Now they have lots of critter encounters at the ranch but the owl boxes seem to really work…
 
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