Tractor or skid steer? Just bought 150 acres.

[rjman]

Why not put in a road like loggers do? They just bring in a large excavator use the material from the ditches on each side of the road to build up the road, they dig holes and bury the stumps right in the roads, same with large rocks, and when they are done they have a hard packed road that tractor trailer trucks can drive across to pick up the wood. Over time the stumps will rot and settle a little, but it takes many years for that to happen. If you just need access, this would work for you and a good operator would be in and out in 2 - 3 days. If you want to make the driveway fancy later this would get you by until then.
Now that you have access, go get your tractor.

 

[OzarkChris]

Agreed. While I would love to hire these things out - they would get done faster and likely better - I just can't do that for everything.

Was quoted $30k to do the entrance, drive, and level the barn site. And that is $30k was dirt work, plus $20k for the gravel. I can't fit that into the budget. I am better off buying a cheap dozer, doing it myself, and selling the dozer when I am done.

But my current thought process (based on all of the comments here) is to buy a tractor - and rent a dozer for 1-2 weeks. I'll be out $3500 in rental fees - but will have the right tool for that job. And $3500 in rental fees is much better than hiring it out at $30k. So I still see a big savings going that route.

A question or three I haven't seen yet, but should be asked. 1, When it comes to a dozer, have you actually ever used one? I ask, because if you haven't (or have only a couple of hours on one) it may take you much, much longer than your neighbors are giving you time to be finished, AND you could really screw things up for your property - you said they would give you 2 weeks. 2. Are you comfortable in making the initial sloping of the drive for runoff (goes back to question 1) and 3. Maybe I'm wrong, but it sounds like you are possibly implying that the boarding (of critters. I'm guessing) is part if your business plan with the bank. Have you ever done this before? Hay in the off season can be pricey and depending on the types of critters the other kinds of feed can really eat into your budget. I won't even begin with Antibiotics, wormers, etc, etc.

Please don't get me wrong, I'm not suggesting you might be in over your head, just some advice from an old guy that's been around the block a time or three.

 

[ggmoney]

I own both. I would make a deal with a local guy to split the hay if he cuts and bails it. 50/50 split is common. That is most of your tractor work.
Get a skid steer with a post pounder and grapple and you can do some real work.

 

[Gord Baker]

IMO
#1: hire out (get it done quick and right)
#2: hire out (get it done quick and right; figure out how to maintain it later)
#3: hire out (get it done quick and right)
#4: depending on time and dollar budget; either hire (masticator) or DIY (either tractor or CTL)
#5: you're buying an attachment either way for this, but either works
#6: tractor

Tractor for many other tasks; CTL may well come in handy as well.
I think the real answer lies in the "what else are you going to use it for" section.
Be prepared for "both" being a very valid answer lol

My opinion too. Everything will take twice as long and at 3 times the cost estimate. Why fence in a pond?

 

[perfdoc]

Alarm bells are ringing. This should be a warning sign telling you that this farm purchase is a bad idea. You can't afford the lifestyle you want. Mow 150 acres? WTF, you are sunk before you even begin. YOU can't afford to maintain 150 acres of park land. You can't afford even the fuel and maintenance costs for the equipment you want let alone break downs and repairs buying older equipment in your budget.

Run Forest, Run!

I agree! Purchasing 150 acres and doesn’t seem to have a clue or can make his own decisions.

 

[Pecosbill7]

I need help figuring out what to buy!

Please tell me what YOU would do! And how YOU would approach this project.

We just bought a 150 acre farm (all crop land). All of it is rolling hills - nothing terribly steep, but not flat either.

In the next year or so, I need to:
1. Cut and grade an entrance from the road (about 50 ft of wooded area next to the road). Need to install culvert, etc. for road access.
2. Grade and install a 1/2 mile long driveway. Everything except the entrance is through the middle of a field - rolling hills - with 1 extra culvert needed
3. Grade a 60'x120' pad for our barn.
4. Clear 2.5 miles of fence line that is currently extremely overgrown honeysuckle (think 50 years of honeysuckle growth)
5. Pound about 1200 5-6'' round posts into the ground (quoted over $70k just to pound the posts, so I'll be doing this myself.)
6. Standard maintenance of pasture - so mow about 150 acres

We plan to hire someone to come in and seed hay - so roundup and a seed drill. We plan to hire that job out to someone who knows exactly what they are doing. Currently all weeds, so will hopefully be pasture and hay fields by this time next year.

But the big question:
Do I buy a tractor or a skid steer (with tracks, so a track loader)? And buying one thing - keeping it for a year to complete all of the above jobs - and then selling it and buying something different - is something I am willing to do.

Budget of about $35-40k, including any needed attachments.

I can buy a track loader for about $30k, a bush hog for $4k, and a post pounder for $4k - and be comfortably under my $40k max. Going this route means I wouldn't be able to harvest my own hay, etc until I sell the track loader and buy a tractor. And bush hogging 150 acres with a track loader is going to be rough.

Alternatively, I spend $30k on a newer 60-70 hp tractor with a loader, $5k on a post pounder, $5k on a bush hog - and be right at my max. I would probably need to rent a bulldozer or track loader to do the driveway, etc - which would be about $2000/week. No idea if I can get it done in one week or not, but my guess is closer to 2 weeks.

And it might actually be better if I buy a cheap dozer ($10k?) and sell it when I am done with it. Then buy the tractor after I sell the dozer.

I need help making a decision! Any and all advice appreciated!

Keep in mind that you will always, always, always incur unexpected expenses. Things never go as you would expect. Unless your wife is solidly behind ALL of this the financial strain will likely cause a strain on your marriage.(ask me how I know!). And, it’s not just the money, but the time commitment. You have a wonderful resource in the land, and that’s something that local ag people need. Then reach an agreement with someone who has all the equipment to do the work with his equipment in return for him receiving a large share of what is produced. Next go get a good used tractor and a brush hog for small cleanups and then you and your wife go enjoy your land and each other..

 

[rScotty]

While I would love to hire out the first 3 jobs, we are stretching our budget to make this farm purchase possible. All of these jobs are going to need to be done with cash on hand - the barn build will be financed. And with the down payment for the farm and expected expenses, I simply can't afford to hire it out. We got it quoted - and just by DIYing the first 3 jobs alone, I am saving over $30k.

And you are 100% right - the real answer is the "what else" question.

A year from now, I will 100% need a tractor for the "what else," but I am really looking at the short term for now. Long term, I need a tractor. Short term, I don't know. Maybe the short term and long term answers are the same?

I understand you are needing to cut costs. Most of us do. What Ning and others are tryng to get you to see is that you will actually be saving money by hiring a lot of this done. Hire someone local and let them use their large tractor.

By hiring the earth moving tasks out, and and buying a slightly used compact tractor for all your other front end loader chores, you will actually save money.
If your budget doesn't show this, it needs revising.

A lot of people have walked in your shoes and will tell you the same, but like the rest of us you won't believe it until a few years have passed.

rScotty

 

[Fxfymn413]

Have you considered buying a new unit to take advantage of the financing packages that are offered? Kubota is currently offering 0% for 48 months for M models. Granted the purchase price is higher than an all cash deal, but it allows you to keep your capital and dole it out a little at a time instead of emptying the bank all at once. A $60K purchase for an M model works out to around $1300.00 per month and is a business write off.

As you know when you are operating a business it is not what you gross, but what you keep that matters. Capital equipment write offs are a big part of that. Ask your accountant what makes the most sense tax wise to do.

You can currently earn 5.25% on a pass book saving account so cash in the bank will help cover your expenses.

So what would I do? I'd buy a high hour used commercial TLB or small dozer (or both) for the heavy initial dirt moving and a new M series Kubota tractor to operate the farm.

In our area pretty high hour commercial machines go for pennies on the dollar because they are not reliable enough to use commercially and they have exhausted their depreciation value. Buy it, use it, sell it. Even with repairs it will pay for itself. I'm thinking of a commercial TLB such as an older Ford or JD product in the 10 to 15K dollar range. They are out there, you just need to look every day.

 

[2manyrocks]

It's easy to overestimate what a tractor will actually do and the time required to operate it until you start trying to do earthmoving tasks that require a dozer.

Have you actually estimated how long it will take you to mow 150 acres?

 

[Popgadget]

A CTL would be my choice for the earth moving and post pounding. And a tractor for everything else.
I also think that you have a unrealistic budget going forward.