Student Loan Debt?

[LD48750]

Just think how much cheaper an education would be if we didn't pay coaches $50M for short term contracts.

 

[Torvy]

Sad truth is these universities need the construct of loans to stay afloat and need to lobby to keep them

$100 a credit hour in a cheaper area to live for 60 hour associate at a community college or pay $3-500. Plus room.and board. To go to a university.

Not remotely true. The vast majority of universities are non-profit and have huge endowments. They are constantly building new stuff because they cannot make a profit they are 'reinvesting' rather than lowering costs. They also have broadened out to have full courses for things that are unnecessary or at best would warrant a free one-time lecture on the mall. They still lament to lawmakers that they need more. Like most bureaucracies, they bloat over time. The trimmings of academia, like tenure and paid sabbatical add to the unnecessary costs. Remember when there were colleges? Now, almost all of them are universities. Bigger, not better.

Rent and groceries around universities are almost always cheaper than living on campus. Many, if not most, require students to live on campus the first year or two. 4 kids, 4 different universities in 2 states. Always cheaper to live off campus. After the required on-campus stint, the only ones that remain in the dorms are RAs and rich foreign students. (And some athletes because they have bigger calorie needs).

 

[two_bit_score]

Just think how much cheaper an education would be if we didn't pay coaches $50M for short term contracts.

Wow, what a can o' worms that could open up.

The "Flutie Effect"? It's when athletic accomplishments increase exposure and, subsequently, enrollment.

Alabama paid Saban $130 million over 16 seasons but Alabama Chancellor Robert Witt has argued "it was the best investment" Alabama ever made.

 

[jyoutz]

It uses both. My 4th kid is in her Sr year at Tech. All 4 kids had this issue. They use net wealth, essentially, to determine how much you can afford, not income.

Tuition rose as a direct result of an uptick in fed/state student loans. More money chasing the same quantity of 'education'. Simple supply and demand stuff. This has zero to do with inflation.

If the government has any interest in paying for education, it is in exchange for service like any other employer. One reason they could get military recruits was for GI Bill. Why bother with the risk and hassle of service if the country will give you a loan and not make you pay it back?

They must have changed the grant application. When my sons were entering college 10 years ago, the application form we filled out only asked for the adjusted income from the previous filing year.

 

[ultrarunner]

They must have changed the grant application. When my sons were entering college 10 years ago, the application form we filled out only asked for the adjusted income from the previous filing year.

Can’t say… all 5 are in University now… 2 Freshman year at UC Davis and 2 soon to be graduating and 1 in the middle.


Of the 5, two have scholarships… one athletic and one both academic and athletic…

The athletic scholarships are rigorous with a huge time commitment and lots of travel…

If one makes it to the Olympics, I will post on TBN.

The irony is in just about any other country in the world she would be Olympic qualified but the US is one of the few where the competition is more than intense!

 

[Torvy]

For most of those bigger schools, the football program pays for itself and the rest of the athletic programs. For some, basketball is similar in that regard.

The schools with the biggest academic scholarships were all big in NCAA sports. 'Bama, OU, Kentucky all offered my kid a full ride (no athlete). Strictly on academics. That money was available because the athletic programs made so much money (and they needed to improve academic results for the school overall).

 

[Torvy]

They must have changed the grant application. When my sons were entering college 10 years ago, the application form we filled out only asked for the adjusted income from the previous filing year.

 

[ultrarunner]

^^

View attachment 847880

Exactly my understanding and most intrusive in every sense…

Surprised they don’t ask grandparents and uncles and aunts?

My brother said the University knows more about his financials than any entity and it’s not optional even being no assistance requested and later granted.

Owning the farm and farm equipment did them in…

 

[Hay Dude]

For most of those bigger schools, the football program pays for itself and the rest of the athletic programs. For some, basketball is similar in that regard.

The schools with the biggest academic scholarships were all big in NCAA sports. 'Bama, OU, Kentucky all offered my kid a full ride (no athlete). Strictly on academics. That money was available because the athletic programs made so much money (and they needed to improve academic results for the school overall).

Few D-1 football teams are profitable. Fewer than you would think.

 

[Mtsoxfan]

Years ago when UCONN was invited to a bowl game in Buffalo, they were given by NCAA(?) millions of $$$. They spent it all and then millions more in that one trip, inviting everyone and their brother who was connected, paying for it all.
It was my belief that sporting teams earn money from the NCAA, and they keep it in sports programs, spending frivolously at times, because they know the university will be supplying more money. There is much less money in academia beyond tuition.

 

[jyoutz]

View attachment 847880

Didn’t used to be that process. But it’s been over 10 years since we did this.

 

[Torvy]

Few D-1 football teams are profitable. Fewer than you would think.

While it is true that only about 25 programs show a profit on paper, that is for all of their NCAA sports. You also have to remember that a lot of it is accounting games as the school's are "non-profit". It also doesn't include the increased tuition revenue as successful programs attract more students. There is also a lot of hidden revenue. If Georgia, for example, sells shirts that just say "Georgia" without reference to the athletic teams, it is not considered sports revenue. But we can all figure out how many more shirts are sold because they have a good FB team.

NCAA Finances: Revenue & Expenses by School - USA TODAY

Which are the most profitable college athletic programs in the country? See a ranked listed, including total revenue and expenses. Brought to you by USA TODAY.

sports.usatoday.com

Lots of articles out there showing how football pays for all of the other sports. Few examples where other sports bring in more revenue.

 

[paulsharvey]

My 17 y/o son is looking at the loan stuff now. He is expecting to get 100% tuition paid from a state scholarship; BUT tuition is a relatively small portion of the expense of college. Wife had to talk to him and ask, exactly what are you planning? We are willing to keep you on the car insurance and cell phone plan, maybe help Some with books and all, but this is gonna be one you. He is wanting to go into nursing (BSN) and eventually to nurse anesthesiologist. Our advice was pretty simple; do community College to RN, then, self fund the rest; but he's hard headed and wants to go to a 4 year school. Wife and I don't feel an obligation (and don't really have the ability) to just pay for 'want to go to college'; and it's not our debt, so, you can advice all you want, but he's the one taking on the debt.

Wife still has a pretty decent bit of student loans she owes on, even though she got a Pell grant for tuition, but she went as an adult, and we used the loans to pay for day care, mortgage, ect, while she was in nursing school.

 

[Hay Dude]

Both my kids were on D-1 teams and their teams lost a prolific amount of money. This was not big time football or basketball.
The coaches both made well over 100K and got full state benefits for themselves and their families. I bet that’s worth 250K. Then there’s assistant coaches. Then there’s travel expenses, uniforms, helmets, cleats, etc. etc.
My guess is each program cost their respective universities about 1 million each.
When you attended the games, it was big attendance if 200 people came. I mean we would play Johns Hopkins at lacrosse and maybe 250 people watched, mostly students, who attend for free. My daughters field hockey team would play Ohio State and there was 35-50 people there lol.

Now put 20 of those money losing teams on each college campus in the USA, and you get the idea how much the football team has to make in ticket & TV revs to pay for all that.

 

[paulsharvey]

About the sports scholarships; Your not wrong But; one part your missing is the value of advertising a school gets. Let's take University of Maimi for instance; you have a very Small, private school, that frankly isn't rated highly; that the entire country has heard of, for 1 reason only, football. Notre Dame, same story; if it wasn't for football, it would be just some weird catholic college in the middle of nowhere. Saw a story, talking about 5he financial impact of Nick Saban, being something like $800M for Bama; the out of state enrollment has like tripled during his career.

 

[Hay Dude]

About the sports scholarships; Your not wrong But; one part your missing is the value of advertising a school gets. Let's take University of Maimi for instance; you have a very Small, private school, that frankly isn't rated highly; that the entire country has heard of, for 1 reason only, football. Notre Dame, same story; if it wasn't for football, it would be just some weird catholic college in the middle of nowhere. Saw a story, talking about 5he financial impact of Nick Saban, being something like $800M for Bama; the out of state enrollment has like tripled during his career.

No.
Notre Dame also has excellent mens basketball, mens lacrosse and other sports.
They compete at the highest level with the best in the country at almost everything, not just football.

Maybe what you should have said is “if it wasnt for sports, it would be just some weird catholic college in the middle of nowhere”.

Also, why is it “weird” to be a Catholic college?

 

[WM75Guy]

My 17 y/o son is looking at the loan stuff now. He is expecting to get 100% tuition paid from a state scholarship; BUT tuition is a relatively small portion of the expense of college. Wife had to talk to him and ask, exactly what are you planning? We are willing to keep you on the car insurance and cell phone plan, maybe help Some with books and all, but this is gonna be one you. He is wanting to go into nursing (BSN) and eventually to nurse anesthesiologist. Our advice was pretty simple; do community College to RN, then, self fund the rest; but he's hard headed and wants to go to a 4 year school. Wife and I don't feel an obligation (and don't really have the ability) to just pay for 'want to go to college'; and it's not our debt, so, you can advice all you want, but he's the one taking on the debt.

Wife still has a pretty decent bit of student loans she owes on, even though she got a Pell grant for tuition, but she went as an adult, and we used the loans to pay for day care, mortgage, ect, while she was in nursing school.

I did my RN to BSN program in18 months through Western Governors University (WGU Texas). It was a totally online program. It cost me around $12,000.

CRNA school requires a BSN and a minimum of 1 year of critical care experience, more is better. Once he has the RN license by the community college route and becomes employed, most large health care organizations will have a tuition reimbursement program to pay for an RN to BSN program. He can do it in 2 years or less, so in 4 years he still has his BSN, 2 years of RN experience, and a lot less debt. The health care organization I worked for had a program with Walden University that capped tuition at $5,000 a year for the 2-year RN to BSN program. That was the maximum tuition reimbursement available from the employer, so the RN to BSN program was free to the employee.

 

[ljjhouser]

There are a lot of reasons to pay school tuition. ONE of them is to qualify for a job with a higher income. I am a retired teacher and that is the only way i got raises. And that has nothing to do with who is smarter. The purpose of the student loan was to permit students to get education they wanted, then pay them back when they worked (at increased income). Seems like today, many don't want to work and repay their loans.

Of course, the most education DOES NOT always mean the higher pay. MANY people in the trades industry (who are also very educated), made significantly more than a teacher --- and deserve it.

 

[Torvy]

No.
Notre Dame also has excellent mens basketball, mens lacrosse and other sports.
They compete at the highest level with the best in the country at almost everything, not just football.

Maybe what you should have said is “if it wasnt for sports, it would be just some weird catholic college in the middle of nowhere”.

Also, why is it “weird” to be a Catholic college?

One of my younger son's middle-school opponents plays DL for Notre Dame.
Notre Dame is Catholic on the surface. It was Catholic once upon a time.

The real Catholic colleges are not that well known. Ave Maria, St. Mary's, Franciscan of Steubenville and even UDallas are much more Catholic.

 

[Hay Dude]

I got no problem at all with student loans.

I DO have a problem with the government being involved and doing their usual screwing of their citizens by picking winners & losers.