Hillside brush cutting power and stability 425/1430/1445

   / Hillside brush cutting power and stability 425/1430/1445
  • Thread Starter
#61  
I met with a contractor who said he could cut my overgrown hillside with his Cat299d and forestry mulcher for $185/hour. He can clear out the small trees that have grown up, and once it's back to a manageable condition, then I need to find a long term solution for maintaining it.

I checked another area for slope. It was 18 degrees at the top and 25 degrees at the bottom of the hill. In my mind, that eliminates the PT425 unless I changed out the wheel motors and installed a larger engine. By then it's probably better to buy at least the 1430 instead.

One question is whether to buy a 1430 for maintaining this slope and continue to use my Kubota Mx5200 for maintaining the less hilly areas or possibly sell the MX and use the money towards the 1445. The fields are bumpy. I don't see any ground speed advantage between either the 1445 or the MX, and I'm currently using a 6' cutter anyway. If the PT 1445 doesn't have a DPF system, that would be an advantage over the MX, IMO.
 
   / Hillside brush cutting power and stability 425/1430/1445 #62  
Ventrac front lift system
I would stay away from Ventrac/Steiner machines and I say this by experience. Their lift system is very limited in max height and the attachments are run by a single V-belt. The ground clearance is very limited, more like a tractor designed for lawn maintenance.
I would suggest you read read read old post here. Stuff like how often do you change attachments? To help in your decision, you should know how hard it is to attach a heavy 3pt implement on your MX, compare that to the PT quick disconnect.
IMHO I think the PT 1445 would be your best choice

Here is an old post compare 3pt to front quick attach:

Having some experience under my belt, I am even more convinced now than I was when I began looking at tractors a year ago that the design of compact tractors, for us weekend diggers as opposed to real farmers, is all wrong. It is a design that has devolved, in an anti-Darwinian fashion, from a series of historical compromises and from blind mimicry of grandpa's agricultural tractor.

Here is a list of the design flaws and the obvious remedies:

1. The 3ph is an abomination. It is an historical industry compromise that, like all compromises, is a mediocrity at best. It is the interface that has launched a thousand hernias (and a googolplex cursewords). It needs to be replaced by the kind of simple, 30-second attachment interface that skidsteers have.

2. Mowers should be on the front of a tractor. This is so for both finish mowers and brush mowers. It is also so for snow blades and snowblowers. Having any of these in the middle or back of the tractor is inefficient, clumsy, and puts you in the hospital for with neck problems in addition to your hernia. The solution is having fully independent attachment interfaces on both ends of the tractor. Thus, for example, you could have the mower on the front and the FEL on the back as your "regular" set-up. This would also have the virtue of eliminating the need for clunky, useless counterweights for the rear of the tractor such as weight boxes, concrete-filled cans or trendy boxblades.

3. This naturally means you should be able to swivel the driver's seat around and drive in either direction. Thereby, your FEL or hoe would then be in front of you for proper operation, with the mower (or other useful implement) then becoming the "rear" counterweight.

4. The power connection to the attachment interfaces should be hydraulic, not mechanical. Just one-second quick-connect couplers. No more dangerous, twirling pto shafts to to catch your lovebead neckaces and choke you to death. No more clumsy, heavy implement shafts. No more lining up splines, or fiddling with collars and buttons.

5. All wheels should be the same size. Small front wheels are (for us weekend diggers) a largely useless artifact of agricultural crop row navigation. Might as well put sundials on tractors. Having equal wheel sizes would have many benefits. There would be a larger tractor footrprint and hence greater overall floatation. There would be less scuffing of lawns and imprinting in soils, and less sinking into wet soils and mud, because it is the small front tires that are the primary culprits in these matters. You could change tire sizes without worrying about differing 4wd circumference ratios between the front and rear wheels. You could fill all four tires for more traction and stability, and be driving an overall more weight-balanced vehicle. You would have better traction in 4wd, which should be significant in mud and snow applications.

6. Because mowing is a primary activity of compact users, these tractors should all articulate. This means they pivot in the middle to promote ease of turning and driving.

7. They should be significantly cheaper than they are. Why should a small compact tractor cost more than a compact car? Tractors are 1930 technology, for goodness sakes, and have relatively few parts. Something is wrong. They are way overpriced.

Having been on sabbatical from this forum for several months, I am pleased to observe that there is now an American-made product that cures most of these problems and meets most of these objectives: the Power-Trac, courageously purchased by Willington pizza. Having reviewed the Power-Trac on their website, it is obvious that there is no sane reason anymore to purchase the historically-flawed compact tractor.
 
   / Hillside brush cutting power and stability 425/1430/1445
  • Thread Starter
#63  
Once Ventrac and Steiner are removed from consideration due to having limited deck lift capacity, that doesn't leave many tractors with 30 degree slope operation capacity in the USA other than PT to the best of my knowledge.

I tend not to change implements very often. The grapple and box blade stay on the L2501. The 6' rotary cutter stays on the MX. I might get an attachment plate to continue using my existing grapple, but would have to flush the hydraulic fluid out of it. The box blade is a necessary implement to maintain my hillside gravel driveway and is a good counterweight to the grapple on the L2501.
 
   / Hillside brush cutting power and stability 425/1430/1445 #64  
I get what your saying, I have been there. To me, don't take offense, but you are not using your tractors to their full capabilities.
I made a PT to skid steer quick attach and now I can buy implements off Fbook or roadside. IMHO if you do do-diligence on the price you pay for used attachments, you should be able to resell at just about the same price or with inflation, more. So it is good to have whatever you need. You didn't mention forklift forks. How do you get buy without them? Snow bucket for firewood, leaves, debris-makes it like a utility carrier. Then the more odd stuff like rock bucket, 4in1 bucket, tooth bucket, rotating log grapple, lift boom, 3pt adapter, etc. All money in the bank. And with the PT, a <1 min change (if no hyds).
It helps when you can see the bucket edge or fork tips from the seat like on the PT, you tend to want to use the stuff more. I hated having to stand up to watch the forks enter the pallet then sit down quick and hit the clutch before the tractor starts pushing the pallet along the ground.
 
   / Hillside brush cutting power and stability 425/1430/1445
  • Thread Starter
#65  
Except for mowing the hillsides, I suppose my needs are simple.
 
   / Hillside brush cutting power and stability 425/1430/1445 #66  
I did a video about 20 years ago. I timed how long it took me to drop the forks and pick up a bucket.

Less than 15 seconds, and I never got off the seat!

I did another video of changing a powered implement. It added about 15 seconds to the task to get off the seat and connect 2 hoses.

I used to dread changing 3 point implements on my old IH2500b. I'd plan tasks around what implement was mounted on the tractor at the time, to avoid having to change them.

With the PT quick attach, I've changed implements 20+ times in an afternoon. I actually get a little smile each time I do it.
 
   / Hillside brush cutting power and stability 425/1430/1445
  • Thread Starter
#67  
You were ahead of your time as an early PT youtube influencer.
 
   / Hillside brush cutting power and stability 425/1430/1445 #69  
As to the wheel motor seal, I remember reading a White motor is supposed to run at no more than 50% capacity for the first few hours. I don't remember how many hours...seems like 5 hours. That would be pretty low though. At one point, Kubota recommended limited use for the first 50 hours. I bet 90 percent of users don't follow the factory recommendation. For a home owner using a mower or tractor two or three hours on the weekend, that's a long time to resist giving it the beans.
 
   / Hillside brush cutting power and stability 425/1430/1445 #70  
Regarding other alternatives, take a look at Avant Tecno. They're WAY more expensive than a PT but do have diesel engines in their smaller versions. And, I'd bet they are more sophisticated than a PT wrt design, hydraulic filtration, lift capacity, etc... They can be found used on equipment trader. I've been tempted to consider one for some time since I REALLY like full time four wheel drive articulated machines with the attachment out front. However, the 425 is so fantastic that I've never bothered. And, since I bought my latest ones used, they came with a LOT of attachment. Some, I've never used and don't think they were ever used...like a snow blower, sweeper, salt spreader and some others. I really need to trade or sell these items as I'll never use them. I have so many that I've run out of space to store them and a couple sit outside (e.g., the snow blower).
 
   / Hillside brush cutting power and stability 425/1430/1445
  • Thread Starter
#71  
The wheel motors are around $700 each. However, keep in mind, you would need to modify the wheel mount weldment slightly. The larger displacement wheel motors are about ½ inch longer. While you could use a spacer to make up the difference, I elected to cut out a ½ inch thick plate and weld it to the mount. This involved cutting a large hole and a bolt circle in the plate.

My modified 425 uses a 35-horsepower motor and larger wheel motors than used on the 1430. But still, it’s no “powerhouse”.
I searched to see if you had posted any more information on these upgrades, but didn't find any. I'm still curious what engine you used and if you actually see any improvement in the power available to run a brush cutter while also going uphill? Or does the increase in HP not matter so much if the pumps are still the same?

I'm guessing the 1430 and 1445 will be more stable due to the increased width and weight?
 
   / Hillside brush cutting power and stability 425/1430/1445
  • Thread Starter
#72  
Further discussion with PT, they recommended the wider tires for the PT 1445 for slopes around 30 degrees, but they are turf tires. I asked if the turf tires did better on slopes, and they are saying the wider turf tires are recommended on slopes. Any comments on that?

The 1445 diesel doesn't have the DPF mess on it, either.
 
   / Hillside brush cutting power and stability 425/1430/1445 #73  
I find turf tires to be better for pretty much everything except mud and deep snow.
 
   / Hillside brush cutting power and stability 425/1430/1445
  • Thread Starter
#75  
Evidently the standard tire is a 6 ply loader tire 10:00x16.5 that results in an overall tractor width of 56" but the turf tires are 4 ply 31-15.50x15 resulting in a width of 64" on the PT1445. I'm a bit concerned about poking a hole in the turfs and don't want to spend another $1,000 if not necessary. Even though I currently hope to have these slopes cut with a forestry mulcher, I anticipate that there will be some sapling stems remaining to poke a hole in my tires.
 
   / Hillside brush cutting power and stability 425/1430/1445 #76  
Evidently the standard tire is a 6 ply loader tire 10:00x16.5 that results in an overall tractor width of 56" but the turf tires are 4 ply 31-15.50x15 resulting in a width of 64" on the PT1445. I'm a bit concerned about poking a hole in the turfs and don't want to spend another $1,000 if not necessary. Even though I currently hope to have these slopes cut with a forestry mulcher, I anticipate that there will be some sapling stems remaining to poke a hole in my tires.
Wider stance and the flexibility of the 4ply tire will improve, ride, tip over risk, and only compromise traction at the extremes.

Chain, or non metal versions can replace the traction.

I've had great luck with gemplers ultraseal for ballast and puncture prevention.

I run a 425 convertered to Kubota 25hp diesel. Unstallable. Better rear end weight, quieter, better fuel consumption.

My pt 1850 slope mower is hard to beat on slopes but the 425 always surprises with its nimble traction and productivity. I matched/converted a 66inch heavy duty flail cutter from tractor pto to hydraulic on the 1850.
 
   / Hillside brush cutting power and stability 425/1430/1445
  • Thread Starter
#77  
Wider stance and the flexibility of the 4ply tire will improve, ride, tip over risk, and only compromise traction at the extremes.

Chain, or non metal versions can replace the traction.

I've had great luck with gemplers ultraseal for ballast and puncture prevention.

I run a 425 convertered to Kubota 25hp diesel. Unstallable. Better rear end weight, quieter, better fuel consumption.

My pt 1850 slope mower is hard to beat on slopes but the 425 always surprises with its nimble traction and productivity. I matched/converted a 66inch heavy duty flail cutter from tractor pto to hydraulic on the 1850.
Did you also change the wheel motors or does the diesel produce enough torque that you don't see a need?

IMO, putting a 25hp emissions exempt diesel in the 425 would really make it operate at a level comparable to all the diesel CUTs, but then it would stand out from them because of the front mount implements, the hydraulic powered cutters, the turning radius, and increased stability not to mention being user serviceable.
 
   / Hillside brush cutting power and stability 425/1430/1445 #78  
Factory wheel motors. It's the larger series pt started using.

Literally runs circles around our cuts.... For utility jobs.


Will get some more pics while apart for end of season service.
 
   / Hillside brush cutting power and stability 425/1430/1445 #79  
There in Virginia is a pt 1460 listed on facebook marketplace. in Virginia
 

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