LS or Kubota

[LS Tractor Owner]

Yes, but the used market seems to be even more higher priced than the new market. Now, IF you can find a suitable unit, is it pristine condition or has it been used / abused and has hidden problems?

Warranties beyond the first 2 years cover only the drivetrain and emissions. Look at the 'fine print' (if you can find it), there are many exclusions to both of those components.

 

[jyoutz]

I have to ask, Johannesburg MI is a rather small and incredibly random place in Michigan to choose for an example unless you live there. Are you a local also?


So as to not totally derail this thread, I'll add my 2 cents. Unless you're dead set on buying new, look at lightly used 2-4 year old units which most will still have warranty left. I picked up a 2019 massey 1740m Hydro cab for just under $24k out the door a few weeks back. All the quotes I'd gotten from local dealers were $38-42k for a new 35-40hp cab Hydro with loader and front blower. So even with ordering the mid pto kit and front blower, I'm still $8-12k under buying new.

That’s rather rare today. Most of the used units I looked at before buying new last year were not much less than new.

 

[Torvy]

Didn't Dolly Parton sing a song about that or something similar a few decades ago?

I prefer the advice from the Stones...Paint it Black.

 

[rScotty]

SNIP...... Unless you're dead set on buying new, look at lightly used 2-4 year old units which most will still have warranty left. I picked up a 2019 massey 1740m Hydro cab for just under $24k out the door a few weeks back. All the quotes I'd gotten from local dealers were $38-42k for a new 35-40hp cab Hydro with loader and front blower. So even with ordering the mid pto kit and front blower, I'm still $8-12k under buying new.

It took me a lot of years of being involved with mechanical things to to figure out that buying near new with some warranty left was the "sweet spot" for our own mechanical & vehicle purchases. We've bought our last 3 cars, 2 trucks, and two tractors that way.

That gets me the largest dollar piece of depreciation, benefit from the work the original owner has done dealing with accessories & any manufacturing issues, and there is still a bit of warranty for comfort.
"Near new" also typically comes with complete service records and the manuals are all there.

Plus there is still discussion online about new and recent models as people discover things they like or don't.
rScotty

 

[5030]

I operate the same way, let the first owner/buyer/leasee take the depreciation hit and then buy when the factory warranty is still in force. I don't care if some stranger sat in the seat one bit.

 

[rScotty]

I operate the same way, let the first owner/buyer/leasee take the depreciation hit and then buy when the factory warranty is still in force. I don't care if some stranger sat in the seat one bit.

Amen to that.
What's embarrasing is how long it took me to figure out buying that way was best for us.

It's not just the money savings, all the rest of it is just as important - more so, if it is something we plan to keep.

Like anything, it helps to understand what it is you are buying. If it's an area I'm not knowledgeable about, I do the same as is common practice for fuying houses, boats, land, and airplanes - I hire a professional surveyor to give me another perspective. In fact, I'm doing that more and more these days.
rScotty

 

[TimberFarm]

Yes, but the used market seems to be even more higher priced than the new market. Now, IF you can find a suitable unit, is it pristine condition or has it been used / abused and has hidden problems?

Warranties beyond the first 2 years cover only the drivetrain and emissions. Look at the 'fine print' (if you can find it), there are many exclusions to both of those components.

Biggest thing I noticed when looking at used machines that really took me by surprise:
Almost without exception, dealers post up photos of the used tractors and they are absolutely filthy! I was shocked that here is a dealer asking top dollar and the tractor looks like somebody just dug it of the mud. They take a photo to show hours and you can't even see the numbers clearly because there is so much dirt on the dash itself. Then they have the nerve to say, " Really clean one here. Get it now before it's too late!"
I know tractors are getting dirty because they are used in dirt. But a one or two year old machine as rough as the majority looked, tells me who ever had this first beat the crap out of it. Makes wonder if they ever even checked a fluid level, let alone changed it. I would never in a million years try to sell something without cleaning it up.
Couple that with the high price wanted, and it just pushed me to go new.

 

[ptsg]

Biggest thing I noticed when looking at used machines that really took me by surprise:
Almost without exception, dealers post up photos of the used tractors and they are absolutely filthy! I was shocked that here is a dealer asking top dollar and the tractor looks like somebody just dug it of the mud. They take a photo to show hours and you can't even see the numbers clearly because there is so much dirt on the dash itself. Then they have the nerve to say, " Really clean one here. Get it now before it's too late!"
I know tractors are getting dirty because they are used in dirt. But a one or two year old machine as rough as the majority looked, tells me who ever had this first beat the crap out of it. Makes wonder if they ever even checked a fluid level, let alone changed it. I would never in a million years try to sell something without cleaning it up.
Couple that with the high price wanted, and it just pushed me to go new.

We can also look at it the other way. A washed and cleaned tractor can hide a lot of stuff too. Specially leaks and even cracked housings since it's hard to spot the leakage.

 

[IndyJay]

4 wheel drive is overrated you are not living until only 1 is on the ground lol

Remember to leave the brake pedal link off so that you can brake to get traction to the one still on the ground. Very important in these situations. You still want to at least feel like you still have some control.

 

[IndyJay]

My foot sure don't like the Kubota pedal push
with the toes and to back up down with the heel
The two pedals side by side made my foot very
happy. No time to condition my foot to something
it don't like!

willky

The reason some kids today can't drive a stick... they looked down and saw three pedals and realized they only had two feet... they thought they were being pranked.

 

[DaBear3428]

Remember to leave the brake pedal link off so that you can brake to get traction to the one still on the ground. Very important in these situations. You still want to at least feel like you still have some control.

control is overrated, it is not fun until you hear the screech of metal on metal.

 

[Sawyer Rob]

Biggest thing I noticed when looking at used machines that really took me by surprise:
Almost without exception, dealers post up photos of the used tractors and they are absolutely filthy! I was shocked that here is a dealer asking top dollar and the tractor looks like somebody just dug it of the mud. They take a photo to show hours and you can't even see the numbers clearly because there is so much dirt on the dash itself. Then they have the nerve to say, " Really clean one here. Get it now before it's too late!"
I know tractors are getting dirty because they are used in dirt. But a one or two year old machine as rough as the majority looked, tells me who ever had this first beat the crap out of it. Makes wonder if they ever even checked a fluid level, let alone changed it. I would never in a million years try to sell something without cleaning it up.
Couple that with the high price wanted, and it just pushed me to go new.

IF I washed my tractors after every time, they got dirty, I'd have to hire a full-time person to keep them clean!

Does that mean I beat the crap out of them??

SR

 

[IndyJay]

IF I washed my tractors after every time, they got dirty, I'd have to hire a full-time person to keep them clean!

Does that mean I beat the crap out of them??

SR

One advantage of looking at a dirty, dusty tractor is that you can look for the wet spots in the dust. There are places where they should be and places where they should not be.

 

[Cahaba Valley Farm]

I have to ask, Johannesburg MI is a rather small and incredibly random place in Michigan to choose for an example unless you live there. Are you a local also?

No not at all. I was using that location as an example because I quoted shooterdon.

 

[Cahaba Valley Farm]

I operate the same way, let the first owner/buyer/leasee take the depreciation hit and then buy when the factory warranty is still in force. I don't care if some stranger sat in the seat one bit.

The question is how much of a depreciation hit are used tractors taking these days?

 

[Cahaba Valley Farm]

I hire a professional surveyor to give me another perspective. In fact, I'm doing that more and more these days.

A professional surveyor? Please explain.

 

[RobertEH]

Brand new (And I mean really new) tractor owner.

I was looking for something I could finance so I could hold onto cash. For me it came down to Kubota or LS. The LS dealer is 10 min away, the Kubota is 40 (so no big difference). Both seemed helpful and easy to deal with (I am in North Idaho)

I test drove the LS MT225HE and a Kubota LX2610HSD. The Kubota was quite nice, but as noted several thousand more than the LS. But when compared on financing, the price was +/-500 for both (0% on Kubota vs. 4.x% on LS). Kubota also filled the rear tires with ballast at no charge so I factored that in as well.

I generally liked the feel of the LS better. But what really pushed me there was the following:
-LS dealer had items in stock. Kubota was backordered with a guess of 6 months out - but the REALLY bad part for Kubota was that if I made a decision to go with them, they would not guarantee the price, or the financing UNTIL IT SHIPPED. The dealer said that was direct from the factory. Regardless I was in no way willing to commit to a purchase of something that did not have those two items locked in.


Of course when I went back to my LS dealer they were out of MT225HE's! I looked at the MT235HE and it was only 3K more on the exact same sized frame (Any larger of a frame would not work on my heavily treed property.) for an extra 10HP that seemed worth the money.

The FEL specs were also better. 66 inch bucket, 94 inch height, 1688 at the pivot pin vs. 88 inch height and 1067 at the pivot pin. (cant recall the FEL bucket width and it is not easily findable on the brochure.)

So far I could not be happier with the LS, but I only have about 40 hours on it (just got it in April)

 

[TimberFarm]

IF I washed my tractors after every time, they got dirty, I'd have to hire a full-time person to keep them clean!

Does that mean I beat the crap out of them??

SR

You did not read my post.
I said the dealer's have them on the lot like that.
You should see both my tractors right now. They are a mess. I washed them about two years ago.

But, I will be selling one of them, and when I do, you can bet I will NOT put it up looking the way it is now.

 

[rScotty]

A professional surveyor? Please explain.

A pre-purchase survey. Doesn't everyone do this? I can't imagine buying a used truck, sailboat, plane, or piece of land without a survey. Ten years ago I wouldn't have put used tractors in that group - but with prices so high I do today.

Maybe it is less common than I thought. If so, I bet that will change. There are about to be a lot of used tractors on the market.

Land Surveyors have turned surveying into a profession all its own with legal descriptions, markers, and licensing - but regardless of what the item is, there are usually people who specialize in it and some will do surveys. Some do nothing else.

One guy locally just does pre-purchase surveys on used RVs. Another only works on particular models of vintage motorcycle. Another surveys sailboats. Survey price is usually by the hour at standard rates. For a car or tractor, three hours seems about normal. What you get for that is a written report with standard disclaimers.

Hopefully the surveyor will be someone who is semi-retired and has a lifetime of experience with a particular thing ... or like I said, sometimes with a particular model.

It is very common in marine, aviation, buildings, and land transactions. Just one part of buying used.

There are plenty of companies who will write a warranty on a used machine. Sometimes I buy an extended mechanical warranty on a car. It's just like if buying a building lot I would buy title insurance. All these things absolutely do require a survey.

I'm feeling sort of alone on this.... Who else does this??

Anyway, it's recommended,
rScotty

 

[TimberFarm]

We can also look at it the other way. A washed and cleaned tractor can hide a lot of stuff too. Specially leaks and even cracked housings since it's hard to spot the leakage.

I would disagree. I know I can find more looking at a clean engine than a dirty one.
Easy to slap some mud over a crack to cover it up.