Today, would you buy an EV vehicle.

[Garson]

We've watched how technological advances have quickly changed our world in the last few decades. Yes, there are obstacles to switching vehicles to a new energy source but man always finds ways to improve.

EV adaption hinges on battery efficiency and that is improving very quickly. One decade from now fossil fuel vehicle production will be rare and EVs will be the norm. Once EVs take market share their price will drop below traditional vehicles. The EV has so few parts and so little to go wrong that it's just a matter of time and a few more tech advances. Their reliability and performance improvements over fossil fuel engines will demand respect. There is no gamble with EVs. They're a sure bet. American car manufacturers have already committed to that.

 

[Surshot]

I will buy an EV when hell is over crowded by Donk politicians to the point that no one else can get in. About the same time the hinges frost over and freeze shut.

 

[RoyJackson]

In every way, cheap energy makes America stronger. The free market should operate to determine the demand for EV's.

Right off the bat, if the "powers that be" demand we comply, they must set the example...
No more Air Force 1...no more thirsty limousines and SUV motorcades...totally unnecessary

 

[CH4Ohio]

There is no gamble with EVs. They're a sure bet. American car manufacturers have already committed to that.

EVs have never had to stand on their own business case. With 30% subsidies, some people have installed solar panels and some people have purchased heavily subsidized vehicles. The government has all but forced manufacturers to build EV models.

Edit / addition -- And the government has drastically distorted the free-market with the PTC, grants, subsidies, and overall policy initiatives.

There is very much a gamble as long as their existence depends on the support of our tax dollars.

 

[Pleease]

Interestingly, Elon Musk pointed out a few months ago that the government didn't build gas stations and the current infrastructure. The free market did that and stimulated the economy in the process.

The government didn't finance Henry Ford and heavily subsidize a transition to cars. The free market did that and stimulated the economy in the process.

Every dollar that flows through the government loses much of its value due to waste and corruption and is stolen from a taxpayer that would have spent it much more efficiently. The government has been subsidizing (heavily) wind and solar renewables for 30 years and they're still only a blip on our total energy spectrum because they aren't reliable.

Until the government backs out and stops trying to drive us toward a "solution" that simply doesn't fit, we'll continue to waste our resources and tax dollars. There's no way that America can bring industry and manufacturing back when the government is doing everything it can to inflate wages and the cost of energy that underpins everything.

Absolutely - 100% agree. Markets find solutions for virtually every big and little problem....if we let them.

Our national budget and economy get screwed up when the government thinks it's in charge of the markets, and especially when it tries to "be" the economy. Borrowing and spending trillions of dollars creates an artificial "sugar high", and makes about as much sense as personally borrowing big $ to put new big-screen TVs in every room when you're already underwater financially. It's ridiculous and ultimately destructive.

 

[Scrambler82]

I am not sure if I have posted in this on this thread or not BUT, I'm not a fan of the EV Vehicles, not to say I wouldn't buy one to save the environment.
My problem is with their methods of advertising and the government play games with the numbers.
When the requirements for the EV will really shine is when we have high output solar panels and there is solar panels on the roof of vehicles that can maintain the vehicles operation in sun or clouds. As it stands the electricity companies are pumping out high levels of toxins and it will increase with more electrical vehicles.

Also, the cost of the vehicles, this needs to be lowered considerable, a lot of people will not be able to buy an electric vehicle at the going and presumed HIGH prices of the future... I for one will not spend 50K for a new Truck, little lone 60K$, 70K$ +, for an electrical one.

Our system is screwed up, instead of working on high efficiency solar or wind recharging system both mobile on the vehicles or charging station, in conjunction with the development of these EV Vehicles, the manufacturers, along with the government, are developing vehicles that our existing system can not support. We need the support for these vehicle to be a high priority before they become a absolute !

If the prices were lower, I might consider an F150 or the Elon Pickup but NOT right now !

 

[Larus]

With many manufacturers now advertising ev, even in trucks (Ford Lightning, CyberTruck, Rivian) would you invest in an EV vehicle? If everything moves to electric, when do you think you would switch to an ev -- or maybe Hybrid. The future of gas and diesel looks questionable.

I bought a new truck in 2021. Things are changing. The V8 engine is almost a thing of the past. When do you think, as you shop for a new vehicle, you will consider EV as your best choice? Will that happen when you want to keep your truck 6-8 years and gas stations might become difficult to find?

Then there are EV tractors.

Just curious. Thought this when looking for a new truck.

No. There is no advantage as I see it. The carbon footprint used to manufacture and "fuel" these vehicles is often greater than with fossil fuel vehicles. Much of that charging electricity is made with coal. Second, the impact to the environment is great. Lead acid batteries are a real problem. The problem was moderately small in the days of diesel and gasoline fueled vehicles, but has become great with EVs requiring dozens of batteries. If you run out of power away from a charging source, you cannot simply walk to a fuel can, fill it, and get fueled up.

Now, what are the advantages? I don't get it.

We need to carefully evaluate what environmentalist are doing. It appears to be a lot of nonsense to me and I am a realistic environmentalist. This entire EV move is very suspicious. Why are the environmental activist being quiet about this? Did you know that most of the waste you recycle goes into a landfill? Did you know that the screens on most of the cell phones manufactured today cannot be recycled simply because of the way they fuse them shut? Do you know that Oregon and Washington big city dwellers on the coast are so oblivious about where their food comes from they are trying to ban the use of diesel fuel? Have you noticed that most of the fuel cans redesigned by environmental activist do not avoid spills and some do not work reliably resulting in more spills?

I will stick with gasoline and diesel until someone with good sense comes up with a better plan.

 

[garydstuart]

With many manufacturers now advertising ev, even in trucks (Ford Lightning, CyberTruck, Rivian) would you invest in an EV vehicle? If everything moves to electric, when do you think you would switch to an ev -- or maybe Hybrid. The future of gas and diesel looks questionable.

I bought a new truck in 2021. Things are changing. The V8 engine is almost a thing of the past. When do you think, as you shop for a new vehicle, you will consider EV as your best choice? Will that happen when you want to keep your truck 6-8 years and gas stations might become difficult to find?

Then there are EV tractors.

Just curious. Thought this when looking for a new truck.

I recently (March 2022) received my Rivian R1T and absolutely love it...coming from a Chevy 2500HD, Duramax, LTZ, extended cab/bed. This is our 4th EV (2010) and also own a Chevy Bolt and awaiting a sedan (EV) recently ordered for my wife. Range anxiety is really a thing of the past...my first EV (Nissan Leaf) had about 95 miles on a full charge...my R1T gets 315+ (highway at ~70mph...more in the city) and my wife's car is rated at 516 miles per charge. In the 12 years we've been driving (not exclusively) EVs, we've had to go the shop 1x (wife backed into a palm tree and busted the tail lamp)...NO maintenance (at least our experience). After her delivery, we'll be down to 1 gas vehicle (besides my heavy equipment)...a Sprinter Van I use for motocross competitions. As background, we live in Nashville and have a farm...I'm retired, but also rent my personal heavy equipment through a small business (ERBO - www.equipmentrentalbyowner.biz). More than you needed for sure...but, wanted to provide my experience and a little background...we won't go back (ICE)...ever.

 

[Pleease]

After a considerable wait, I took delivery of a Tesla Model S Long Range (408 miles) last September. It is fantastic! No regrets. The most fun to drive car I haver ever driven! I have a CyberTruck on order and look forward to it's replacing my Chevy Silverado 2500 Diesel. I only wish I had it now!

With today's fuel prices, I love not having to buy fuel. My solar array allows me to charge overnight at home without any additional cost.

Having your own solar power is a very different scenario than buying electric at whatever market price from what's basically a monopoly. Well done.

408 miles seems pretty great. Have you driven on a long trip, and if so how tough was it to find recharging stations, and how long did it take to charge?

How difficult/expensive (don't mean to pry on $) was it to set up the solar array, and where did you put it?

TIA

 

[garydstuart]

No. There is no advantage as I see it. The carbon footprint used to manufacture and "fuel" these vehicles is often greater than with fossil fuel vehicles. Much of that charging electricity is made with coal. Second, the impact to the environment is great. Lead acid batteries are a real problem. The problem was moderately small in the days of diesel and gasoline fueled vehicles, but has become great with EVs requiring dozens of batteries. If you run out of power away from a charging source, you cannot simply walk to a fuel can, fill it, and get fueled up.

Now, what are the advantages? I don't get it.

We need to carefully evaluate what environmentalist are doing. It appears to be a lot of nonsense to me and I am a realistic environmentalist. This entire EV move is very suspicious. Why are the environmental activist being quiet about this? Did you know that most of the waste you recycle goes into a landfill? Did you know that the screens on most of the cell phones manufactured today cannot be recycled simply because of the way they fuse them shut? Do you know that Oregon and Washington big city dwellers on the coast are so oblivious about where their food comes from they are trying to ban the use of diesel fuel? Have you noticed that most of the fuel cans redesigned by environmental activist do not avoid spills and some do not work reliably resulting in more spills?

I will stick with gasoline and diesel until someone with good sense comes up with a better plan.

I recently (March 2022) received my Rivian R1T and absolutely love it...coming from a Chevy 2500HD, Duramax, LTZ, extended cab/bed. This is our 4th EV (2010) and also own a Chevy Bolt and awaiting a sedan (EV) recently ordered for my wife. Range anxiety is really a thing of the past...my first EV (Nissan Leaf) had about 95 miles on a full charge...my R1T gets 315+ (highway at ~70mph...more in the city) and my wife's car is rated at 516 miles per charge. In the 12 years we've been driving (not exclusively) EVs, we've had to go the shop 1x (wife backed into a palm tree and busted the tail lamp)...NO maintenance (at least our experience). After her delivery, we'll be down to 1 gas vehicle (besides my heavy equipment)...a Sprinter Van I use for motocross competitions. As background, we live in Nashville and have a farm...I'm retired, but also rent my personal heavy equipment through a small business (ERBO - www.equipmentrentalbyowner.biz). More than you needed for sure...but, wanted to provide my experience and a little background...we won't go back (ICE)...ever.

Oh yea...and, they just dropped the price on the Chevy Bolt to $26,500 (before incentives...below $20k after)...the price points will come down over the next several years...the legacy manufacturers are targeting a $25k price point (entry level)...as evidenced by Chevy's recent (this week) price cut.

 

[v908]

At this time (current market) I would not buy an EV as a primary vehicle. I live in a rural area and often need to drive pretty significant distances so "range anxiety" is real for me. A plug-in hybrid might be acceptable, but again, it wouldn't be my primary vehicle. I have owned/driven hydrogen fuel cell cars (better option, if we'd just build out the infrastructure), hybrids, and EVs and felt significant limitations for all of them considering MY driving needs. I will not sell my '94 F350 4x4 Crew Cab, ever, as it has all the hauling and towing capacity that I periodically need. You can't load up a Ford Lightning with 2,000 pounds in the bed and pull a 18,000 pound trailer 400-600 miles in one day. I still need to do that periodically (though the gas is killing me!).

 

[garydstuart]

Oh yea...and, they just dropped the price on the Chevy Bolt to $26,500 (before incentives...below $20k after)...the price points will come down over the next several years...the legacy manufacturers are targeting a $25k price point (entry level)...as evidenced by Chevy's recent (this week) price cut.

Oh yea, oh yea...charge times for my wife's sedan are 0% to 80% in 22 minutes...we took our truck to Memphis (231 mile trip), stopped to eat just outside of Memphis and decided to plug in to "fill up" while we ate...I received a text message that charging was complete before we had our entrees. And...in 12 years of driving EVs, we've never once run out of juice. Charging stations are becoming more prevalent at hotels, offices, Starbucks, etc...and the technology in the vehicle tells you where you need to charge, for how long and how many stations are open or occupied. I promise I'm not an industry guy ...just sharing what I've learned over the past 12 years.

 

[GB540]

Like others I'm keeping an eye on the industry. But the range, life expectancy, and replacement cost all need to improve before I could consider electric.

As much as they'd probably love it, I'm not trading every few years to keep the battery in warranty. And despite their marketing, I need usable range at -20F more than I need rocket acceleration.

Again I'll keep an eye on things. Remember how awful the first battery tools were, now factories are running production with them.

 

[RoyJackson]

I just read where Elon Musk and Tesla is putting a freeze on hiring and plans on a 10% reduction in staff...doesn't bode well for the EV industry

 

[artf]

Nope. They are Version 1's and will have unusual bathtub failure curbs for design & premature part failures.

I avoid new model year 1 vehicles with gas engines. Why would I presume EVs rushed to market are somehow magically immune to automotive product design-build-maintain problems?

 

[OzarkChris]

When do you think, as you shop for a new vehicle, you will consider EV as your best choice?

I've commented on this on several threads here already, but here is my take in bullet point fashion.

1. I live 200+ miles from a fairly large city (Little Rock) and travel there several times a month for Dr's appointments.This stated I need a vehicle that will go at least 450-500 miles on a charge - because I will Not (and should Not be expected to) wait for 3-4 hours to charge a vehicle up when I still have that amount of time left to drive home.

2. I will not (and really can Not) utilize a "small commuter" car - my vehicle MUST be capable of carrying (inside the vehicle) at least 4 adults, 2 service dogs and at least one 500# wheelchair (the second 500# "Trackchair", can be trailer hitch mounted as long as we dont need a trailer).

3. Prices for low mileage 1 year old extended full size vans have already doubled since COVID - 2020 - I could find numerous Ford Transit passenger 350's or Chevy Express 12-15 pax vans with less than 25K miles for $20-25K, today (if you can find them) they are pushing $50K. New they are upwards of $70K.

Oh, BTW, after procuring said van, it still needs to be equipped/modified for ADA & wheelchair(s)

4. We currently have a hybrid (non-plugin) Rav4. Unfortunately, it doesn't meet specs for #2 above so it is the wife's car.

5. I'm not a climate denier, but I don't believe all the climate bs that is being pushed down our throats either. I believe this may be more cyclical in nature than man caused (I'm not saying man hasn't contributed to this, but that it is as much cyclical - if not more - than man caused). I also Do Not believe the world is going to end in my lifetime, by children's (or my next 5 generations) lifetimes.

6. Let's just agree that we have a 200+ yr supply of oil, gas & coal under our ground. That we could flood the market with oil & gas if we reduced regulations on oil, gas & fraking exploration, drilling & refining, opened up Anwr, offshore leases, etc and bring gas prices back down to ~$1/gal - where they were pre-COVID. Use this natural resource and supplement with green energy until such time that everything is in place to switch over.

7. Let's also discuss the issues with solar & wind production (and the disposal of said items). The amount of space required (some have indicated 1/3-1/2+ of our land mass, some have suggested taking away most, if not all of our water recreation and fishing habitat areas so floating solar panels could be used, etc - guess we don't need them dirty 'ol fish anyway).

8. Let's Not make "ALL" farming large corporate entities - I'm pretty sure those entities are the only folks that could afford to go all electric. Tax incentives are great, but "Only" if you make enough to use them.

Don't want to pull my soapbox out today - it's still recovering from my last use, so I'll end this - for now!

 

[BeemerJim]

With many manufacturers now advertising ev, even in trucks (Ford Lightning, CyberTruck, Rivian) would you invest in an EV vehicle? If everything moves to electric, when do you think you would switch to an ev -- or maybe Hybrid. The future of gas and diesel looks questionable.

I bought a new truck in 2021. Things are changing. The V8 engine is almost a thing of the past. When do you think, as you shop for a new vehicle, you will consider EV as your best choice? Will that happen when you want to keep your truck 6-8 years and gas stations might become difficult to find?

Then there are EV tractors.

Just curious. Thought this when looking for a new truck.

I am an Automotive Engineer and the EV will never work for me personally due to the miles I drive per day. Also the ev are to new to the market and they have not done much research to longevity of the product, ie battery failure, battery life, battery deposal etc. Also how long will the power generation systems last, maintenance of them etc. I pull a trailer also and I am partial to Silverado so here is what I found out when comparing at the dealer. My truck LTZ 1500 is about $60,000 the comparable model EV is !2-15000 higher. My truck I get around 430 miles per fill-up EV on a great day, no accessories running and NOT pulling anything 300 miles; if I were to pull my trailer it would be around a 100 miles/charge. I travel from NC to Illinois every month 865 miles one way; takes me around 12.5 hours and 2 tanks gas. EV would be 3 re-charges and with a commercial charger station, if you can find one on the way, takes 3-6 hours/100 miles charge (so say 3) that's an additional 12-18 hours on my trip so maybe a 1-1/2 days to travel vs 12.5 hours. So in my travels to and from every day I travel I have not found 1 charge station in any gas station I have stopped in; I am dam sure to people against this change will not invest into it because there in no return on the charging. A typical commercial charge station depending on the location it's install can be between $3 and 8000, so the gas station who installs one will need to mark up the electrical cost to get some type of return on investment. All my engineer colleges just laugh at the approach the Administration is taking on ramrodding thru something that is evitable to fail.

 

[gckshea]

With many manufacturers now advertising ev, even in trucks (Ford Lightning, CyberTruck, Rivian) would you invest in an EV vehicle? If everything moves to electric, when do you think you would switch to an ev -- or maybe Hybrid. The future of gas and diesel looks questionable.

I bought a new truck in 2021. Things are changing. The V8 engine is almost a thing of the past. When do you think, as you shop for a new vehicle, you will consider EV as your best choice? Will that happen when you want to keep your truck 6-8 years and gas stations might become difficult to find?

Then there are EV tractors.

Just curious. Thought this when looking for a new truck.

In no uncertain terms...hell no. I can't buy into the lie of "clean energy," or any other excuses used that we need to abandon the petroleum ship. The "carbon footprint" of battery technology, from materials acquisition, transportation, storing, labor, sales, and too- soon reclamation and salvage....every step has petroleum involved in it. It is a false economy that our infrastructure already cannot handle. I will not EVER buy into the ********.

Our resources are already in a chokehold by the government. There's no way that Uncle Joe &Co. are ever going to loosen their grip. Read up on DEF/urea shortages...I don't see electrics (EVs) filling the trucking gap!

 

[CinderSchnauzer]

In a very practical sense, the Ford / GM EV trucks only exist on paper for anyone who is not already on a reservation list. Probably nothing for the next few years on the showroom floor at a somewhat reasonable cost. The $120K GM / Hummers are not an option for many. I now have a low miles L5P Denali with all the bell & whistles I need or want, so I can put a lot of diesel fuel in the tank for the price of a new EV.

Once everyone gets sucked into the EV scam, the days of a $15 recharge will be long gone, when they plug a device into the OBD port and start charging $x.XX per mile driven, not only to replace the current road tax on fuel, but, just because they can.

At this moment, if these was a low cost EV and cheap electricity continues, an EV with a 250 - 300mile range would be nearly perfect for about 99.9% of my driving needs. The recent near tornado that swept across Ontario leaving thousands without power for 8 - 10 days, serves to illustrate the folly of dependence on electricity to fuel your vehicle or to heat / cool your house.

 

[thorn]

I have a 2004 Prius that has 140,000 miles on it and it was our main car. I had to commute to a job further away for a while and got a 2017 Prius Prime which can go 30 miles on a charge. With incentives, it cost $23,000. Now I work at home. We drive it most of the time and get gas about once a month, about 1,000 miles/month. It's average mpg is 104. I was grumbling to my wife that it cost $32 to fill it up the other day. I also have a Tundra and have not filled it up in a while. I mostly use it to pull a trailer and get lumber, diesel etc now and then. It will be $100 or more to fill it up.

I installed grid tied 3kw of solar panels in 2007 on my garage which helps with the electric bill. A coworker gave me 10kw 10 yo solar panels, wire and 2 inverters. His roof got damaged from hail and he decided to buy new panels. I got the racks up on my barn roof. I need to put the panels up before it gets too hot. My BIL was going to help but he had surgery and doc said not to lift anything heavy for a while. I may try to get them up there by myself. I need to get my hay cut if the weather will cooperate.

There are hybrid inverters that allow you to create your own grid if the power goes out. Of course the sun has to be out and you have to manage your loads. Wind is another choice if you are in a good area for wind.