LS or Kubota

[Cahaba Valley Farm]

I like to see how the manufacturer solved the little problems that you learn to recognize as being common to any type of manufacture.

Please explain.

 

[jrsavoie]

Yes, the first LS dealer I purchased from was 500 miles to the north of me. After using that 25hp SCUT for work that everyone said a 50hp machine would be needed, I was impressed. Was it slower? Yes. Was I in a rush? No. Did it ever need to go back to the dealer? Not for a single problem.

I have heard people bring up the subject of "resale value".... well of course a JD or Kubota is going to bring a higher "used price".... but they cost 15-20% higher to begin with. I sold my LS SCUT for $500 less than what I paid for it after 2 years and 220 hours of use. That equates to costing me $2.27 per hour of use (plus fuel).

When I purchased my second LS, I got a great deal from another dealer that was 550 miles to the south of me. I don't have any immediate plans to sell it right now, but I did find out that I could now sell it for about $2-3K more than what I paid for it. I have this one for 2 1/2 years and 340 hours.... Again, never had to go back to the dealer, never had a problem.

Between both of these tractors, I saved over $15K vs. buying Kubotas. Buying JD would have cost even more.

I know of 3 other LS owners locally, including a plumbing contractor using his LS commercially. All 3 purchased AT LEAST 500 miles away, one of them purchased 1465 miles away from the dealer. He had one problem... a loader cylinder was leaking. The dealer shipped him a new cylinder under warranty.

I wouldn't hesitate to get another Korean tractor from another distant dealer.

What is a LS?

 

[jrsavoie]

What's a TLB?eresting. I confess that actually seeing something makes a big difference to me...much more than price. I like to see how the manufacturer solved the little problems that you learn to recognize as being common to any type of manufacture.

No matter who is king of the market right now, it's a sure bet that someone else is going to come along and do it all better - and for less money.... at least initially. And a pretty good bet that ten years from now we won't have to guess who was the winner because it will be common knowledge. Maybe it's going to be LS this time around; I wouldn't know. There just aren't enough of them locally to compare.

I went with Kubota because I was looking for several features not common in tractors but common to TLBs.
Kubota makes a wide variety of machinery and that did impress me. Among those machines it turned out that Kubota was building a darn good compact TLB - and nobody else was making one at all. Still aren't. I wish they were. Competition always seems to make things better.

rScotty

What's a TLB?

 

[rScotty]

Please explain.

rScotty said:
I like to see how the manufacturer solved the little problems that you learn to recognize as being common to any type of manufacture.

Little things. Like how did they weld around behind brackets where it is hard to get a welding nozzle. How are the zerks positioned on the steering links so you can get too them but still be protected. How did they shape the exhaust manifold casting - that's a part that has to deal with a major temperature gradient while staying fastened and intact. Are the filters accessible? What about the battery? Is the dash sealed against water? Access panels? How are the hoses run?

In other words, I'm curious to see how much thought and quality went into making that tractor....To do that, I need to see one and operate it. Which means I am handicapped by needing a local dealer with machines on the lot.

LS = a brand of tractor made in S. Korea and sold in the USA.

TLB = Tractor/Loader/Backhoe. Its a type of tractor optimized for digging in the ground and carrying loads. It is made with a backhoe mounted and the 3pt hitch is an accessory. It is heavily built, short-coupled, & commonly seen doing construction work. More expensive. Lots of them are painted in shades of yellow.

Ag and Compact Tractors = the large and smaller tractors derived from farm tractors. Very versatile machines. JD, Kubota, LS, Majindra, Yanmar, New Holland and etc. The 3pt hitch is mounted solidly and accessories - like a backhoe - work around that 3pt hitch. These are machines optimized for work that involves pulling or a power take off (PTO). Brands have identifiable color schemes. Less expensive than construction machines, but able to do many jobs fairly well.

That's a nutshell & very general definition to help the newbie get started. Not intended to be exact.

rScotty

 

[jrsavoie]

rScotty said:
I like to see how the manufacturer solved the little problems that you learn to recognize as being common to any type of manufacture.

Little things. Like how did they weld around behind brackets where it is hard to get a welding nozzle. How are the zerks positioned on the steering links so you can get too them but still be protected. How did they shape the exhaust manifold casting - that's a part that has to deal with a major temperature gradient while staying fastened and intact. Are the filters accessible? What about the battery? Is the dash sealed against water? Access panels? How are the hoses run?

In other words, I'm curious to see how much thought and quality went into making that tractor....To do that, I need to see one and operate it. Which means I am handicapped by needing a local dealer with machines on the lot.

LS = a brand of tractor made in S. Korea and sold in the USA.

TLB = Tractor/Loader/Backhoe. Its a type of tractor optimized for digging in the ground and carrying loads. It is made with a backhoe mounted and the 3pt hitch is an accessory. It is heavily built, short-coupled, & commonly seen doing construction work. More expensive. Lots of them are painted in shades of yellow.

Ag and Compact Tractors = the large and smaller tractors derived from farm tractors. Very versatile machines. JD, Kubota, LS, Majindra, Yanmar, New Holland and etc. The 3pt hitch is mounted solidly and accessories - like a backhoe - work around that 3pt hitch. These are machines optimized for work that involves pulling or a power take off (PTO). Brands have identifiable color schemes. Less expensive than construction machines, but able to do many jobs fairly well.

That's a nutshell & very general definition to help the newbie get started. Not intended to be exact.

rScotty

I wouldn't consider myself a newbie to equipment. Maybe a newbie to new equipment.

The more I see, the less I want to do with anything that has emissions or EGR - which I consider emissions.

What brands are the LS tractors?

I've never seen a LS dealership

 

[charles todd]

I noticed the same thing when I shopped LS many years ago, but then I realized their loader arms were much shorter, and that definitely affects the rating. You really need to compare the loader curves to get an honest assessment across the different brands. And if reach/height is important, factor that in too. There can be as much as 12-16" variation in max height between the different brands.

Agreed.

My LS P7010C can lift a pallet of Redi-Mix out of truck or trailer.

80 LB x 42 = 3360 LB + pallet... I believe the 3500 LB rating.

CT

 

[s219]

That is not a valid way to check them out, because a small change in the lift cylinders, or hydraulic pressure can and will easily make up for the difference in length!

SR

No matter, the loader will still have a curve where lift force varies with height. Those curves need to be compared, not single numbers that manufacturers are quoting at different heights. The curves will take all factors into account including geometry and hydraulics.

 

[Sawyer Rob]

No matter, the loader will still have a curve where lift force varies with height. Those curves need to be compared, not single numbers that manufacturers are quoting at different heights. The curves will take all factors into account including geometry and hydraulics.

Depends on what you are worried about. I read your post that it was about comparing loader lift capacity, by how long the lift arms are.

I'm just saying it can be adjusted, higher or lower, with the psi of the hydraulics or size of the cylinders, so I don't worry about the loader arms for that comparison, between tractors.

SR

 

[rScotty]

I wouldn't consider myself a newbie to equipment. Maybe a newbie to new equipment.

I wouldn't either. Hopefully we are helping more than just ourselves.

The more I see, the less I want to do with anything that has emissions or EGR - which I consider emissions.

I sure do agree with that. Our 2007 M59 is Tier IV Interm - which means EGR. The EGR itself is minor, but I would have been happier without it. Still, it does have separate injection rather than common rail. So fuel timing is mechanical. To me that is good because it sidesteps what I see as the most important issue with the emissions

I do think that making machinery easy for an owner to do simple repairs is more important issue than whether it has emission controls or not. Someday everything will have emissions control. I have no control over that, but would like to see more things repairable instead of just being thrown away & replaced with new.

What brands are the LS tractors?

They seem to be built by the LS Tractor Company in Korea. Just like JDs are built by John Deere Tractor Company. Somebody's name.....

I've never seen a LS dealership

Neither have I. But there must be some. Apparently the tractors are good & well built. But everything needs some service. They are either designed to be maintained by the owner or by some dealer. If it's a dealer, I wonder if they have regional service reps? Service schools? Required training? Technical Manuals? Spares? All the things that go along with established dealerships.
If it's the owner who is expected to be responsible for those things, then I'd expect some sort of tech backup available. What is it and how is it working for the owners? By now we ought to know some of those answers.
Sounds like we have the same questions.
rScotty

 

[jrsavoie]

I wouldn't either. Hopefully we are helping more than just ourselves.

I sure do agree with that. Our 2007 M59 is Tier IV Interm - which means EGR. The EGR itself is minor, but I would have been happier without it. Still, it does have separate injection rather than common rail. So fuel timing is mechanical. To me that is good because it sidesteps what I see as the most important issue with the emissions

I do think that making machinery easy for an owner to do simple repairs is more important issue than whether it has emission controls or not. Someday everything will have emissions control. I have no control over that, but would like to see more things repairable instead of just being thrown away & replaced with new.

They seem to be built by the LS Tractor Company in Korea. Just like JDs are built by John Deere Tractor Company. Somebody's name.....

Neither have I. But there must be some. Apparently the tractors are good & well built. But everything needs some service. They are either designed to be maintained by the owner or by some dealer. If it's a dealer, I wonder if they have regional service reps? Service schools? Required training? Technical Manuals? Spares? All the things that go along with established dealerships.
If it's the owner who is expected to be responsible for those things, then I'd expect some sort of tech backup available. What is it and how is it working for the owners? By now we ought to know some of those answers.
Sounds like we have the same questions.
rScotty

I just did some searching and have no more info now than before.

Just getting ready to search Tym tractors