The BEST HVAC system for your home, hands down

[JethroB]

Sigarms, can you expand a little more about propristarty internet thermostats or alternatives a little more for my feeble mind? I’m on the fence about putting a system in my 750 sq. ft. red steel shop at the moment. I want to be able to preheat or cool before I go out there, 100 feet away. I have strong wireless internet available out there. KISS works best for me. I sort of realize I’m basically trying to condition a tin can in the sun for a few hours at a time. I am also an investor in our power company .
thanks

 

[Sigarms]

We have used ours and its worth it.

Joke to you but not to us.

It's not a joke to me, I don't bother with them and most guys I know don't as well.

If it was with American Home shield with your HVAC system, I would love to hear any "Great stories".

I get the insurance aspect (like any, you have good and bad stories), but the hoops they want the contractor to jump through for approval really isn't worth the time and effort.

 

[Sigarms]

Sigarms, can you expand a little more about propristarty internet thermostats or alternatives a little more for my feeble mind? I’m on the fence about putting a system in my 750 sq. ft. red steel shop at the moment. I want to be able to preheat or cool before I go out there, 100 feet away. I have strong wireless internet available out there. KISS works best for me. I sort of realize I’m basically trying to condition a tin can in the sun for a few hours at a time. I am also an investor in our power company .
thanks

Are you running ductless or will it be a ducted system?

Is the shop well insulated? If it isn't, it really is worth the money since you plan on heating and cooling it.

A wi-fi thermostat generally uses a proprietary app to access the thermostat remotely from your phone.

Assuming it's going be no more than 2 stage heat 2 stage cool, hard to go wrong with the Honeywell T6 / TH6220WF2006 or Ecobee3 Lite.

Honestly, the KISS method IMO would insulate it well, and just keep it bearable in the winter and summer by running a 7 day programable t-stat and just over ride it if you plan on spending any time for a while in there. Looks like your from the south east, so although heating may be important from time to time, you shouldn't be running your strip heat that much.

Depending on how "open" that shop is without insulation, I'd be afraid you'd be throwing money away on a system added the time to bring the conditioned area to your desired temp and keeping it there depending on how much time you'll spend there.

Me being old, I don't care to control my system remotely, added I've been stuck on jobs where the homeowner said they have great wi fi and it wasn't as great as they thought. Out in the country jobs. That said, it's YOUR money and I learned a long time ago never try to convince someone otherwise, just note the potential issues in the signed proposal

 

[Torvy]

It's not a joke to me, I don't bother with them and most guys I know don't as well.

If it was with American Home shield with your HVAC system, I would love to hear any "Great stories".

I get the insurance aspect (like any, you have good and bad stories), but the hoops they want the contractor to jump through for approval really isn't worth the time and effort.

We had that when we first moved in. We always insist on one year paid by seller when moving into a new (to us) house. The problem for us was with our pool pump. It broke down in the 1st 30 days we were here. They would not cover it because it was supposedly due to lack of maintenance. That would make sense if we had been there for awhile. We had something else fail in that first year, too. All I remember about that transaction is we had to pay the 'trip charge' which was 95% of the cost. I'm just glad I didn't pay (directly) for that 'service'.

Insurance is usually a good thing...extended or 3rd party warranties are more often a sucker's bet. Too many ways for them to decline.

 

[JethroB]

Are you running ductless or will it be a ducted system?

Is the shop well insulated? If it isn't, it really is worth the money since you plan on heating and cooling it.

A wi-fi thermostat generally uses a proprietary app to access the thermostat remotely from your phone.

Assuming it's going be no more than 2 stage heat 2 stage cool, hard to go wrong with the Honeywell T6 / TH6220WF2006 or Ecobee3 Lite.

Honestly, the KISS method IMO would insulate it well, and just keep it bearable in the winter and summer by running a 7 day programable t-stat and just over ride it if you plan on spending any time for a while in there. Looks like your from the south east, so although heating may be important from time to time, you shouldn't be running your strip heat that much.

Depending on how "open" that shop is without insulation, I'd be afraid you'd be throwing money away on a system added the time to bring the conditioned area to your desired temp and keeping it there depending on how much time you'll spend there.

Me being old, I don't care to control my system remotely, added I've been stuck on jobs where the homeowner said they have great wi fi and it wasn't as great as they thought. Out in the country jobs. That said, it's YOUR money and I learned a long time ago never try to convince someone otherwise, just note the potential issues in the signed proposal

Thank you for taking the time and your suggestions. I need to strongly consider upgrading the insulation first vs. a brute force system. My HVAC guy used the analogy of trying to cool a 15 passenger Ford van , not everyone is going to be happy. He roughly estimated a 4 ton split system and hang the air handler on the C channel just inside with a simple 45 degree duct off the top and blast away. (Oddly to me, he said a 5 ton was only $200 more.) He said that would make it somewhat bearable but not ideal given our summers. I think I’m looking for a reason NOT to do this. I really do hate to lose another summer not being able to tinker a few hours several days a week. We rarely get below 30 in winter.

Not to pester you but here goes:

25x30 with 11 ft walls, one open room, concrete floor
3” of vinyl backed fiberglass insulation currently on walls & ceiling
Rollup metal garage door, south facing to boot
One man door
Southwest Georgia
Four fiberglass skylight panels to add to the problem

JB

 

[kenmac]

Thank you for taking the time and your suggestions. I need to strongly consider upgrading the insulation first vs. a brute force system. My HVAC guy used the analogy of trying to cool a 15 passenger Ford van , not everyone is going to be happy. He roughly estimated a 4 ton split system and hang the air handler on the C channel just inside with a simple 45 degree duct off the top and blast away. (Oddly to me, he said a 5 ton was only $200 more.) He said that would make it somewhat bearable but not ideal given our summers. I think I’m looking for a reason NOT to do this. I really do hate to lose another summer not being able to tinker a few hours several days a week. We rarely get below 30 in winter.

Not to pester you but here goes:

25x30 with 11 ft walls, one open room, concrete floor
3” of vinyl backed fiberglass insulation currently on walls & ceiling
Rollup metal garage door, south facing to boot
One man door
Southwest Georgia
Four fiberglass skylight panels to add to the problem

JB

You could probably get it comfortable to do some work in your garage.
I use to heat and cool a 24x42 with 10 foot walls, R11 in the walls and none in the ceiling, 20 foot standard roll up garage door, when I wanted to work in the garage in winter and summer,
Most times, I just opened the door and had one of the large fans going, and that did fairly well as far as being able to work in mine.

Keeping your shop fairly comfortable with A/C when you're working in there from time to time is doable

After selling and moving to the farm. I now have a 40x80 shop with 14' tall sides and about 20' tall in the center. I don't even try to heat and cool this shop LOL

 

[kenmac]

Yes.

I'll also bet you used 15% Stay-Silv flat brazing rods.

Don't tell me You have seen people use something different ! LOL.

 

[Sigarms]

Insurance is usually a good thing...extended or 3rd party warranties are more often a sucker's bet. Too many ways for them to decline.

I guess ultimately why I don't like them is they honestly don't seem to have the homeowners best interest at heart as to what should be done to fix the problem correctly the FIRST time (at least pertaining to HVAC).

The other "behind the scene" issue is the guys who get stuck having to deal with the home warranty industry because they can't stay busy enough, and they have to deal with the headache of dealing with a 3rd party. If you've been in business a decent amount of time, do good work and have a good customer referral base, generally you get smart enough to pick your headaches.

 

[Sigarms]

Don't tell me You have seen people use something different ! LOL.

Don't you know stay-silve 15% is overpriced and you're only brazing a joint together?

 

[Sigarms]

My HVAC guy used the analogy of trying to cool a 15 passenger Ford van , not everyone is going to be happy.

Honestly it sounds like you're in good hands, I already like him as he's being honest.

Sounds like a good opportunity to find a scratch and dent sale for the application.

The juice may not be worth the squeeze, but if hanging the air handler, I'd look at the possibility of running a square to round off the supply (square connection to the air handler then round pipe off that connector) and then run round pipe if it can be hanged as well. This way, you can at least put the air in the areas you generally find yourself. Pipe should be insulated, and after metal, insulation, fittings for supply outlets, as mentioned, it may not be worth the time and money.

Depending on what's in the shop and how dirty it gets in there, I'd look at least at perhaps something like a custom return box with that would take a 2" filter, bypassing the sometimes pain in butt internal 1" filter rack that some air handlers do have.