Battery based electric vehicles of today and tomorrow.

[DieselBound]

Any way you look at it, the grid WILL become an issue at some point as we convert to an all electric society.

Power outages are quite frequent in many parts of the country. Do you stay home when the power is out because you can't charge your vehicle? After hurricane Katrina, the power was out in many areas for over a month. Most of those poor people survived using portable gas generators which are too small to regularly charge a vehicle while powering a house. Most homeowners have the ability to store gasoline but not electricity.

Yes, gas stations can't pump without electricity but after Katrina, FEMA brought in generator trucks to power gas stations. Tankers of fuel were also imported. You can't import electricity without a working grid. You can always run out to a gas station for a can of gas but you can't run to the power plant for a can of electrons.

A more important thing to consider is this: Enemies and terrorists could easily cripple an all electric society with a few well placed charges at key points on transmission lines.

Sadly, our grid is aging and vulnerable. Major changes need to be made before we are completely dependent upon it.

"Enemies and terrorists could easily cripple an all electric society with a few well placed charges at key points on transmission lines."

Or just incompetence (which has overwhelmingly been the case/reason)... BTW - Can we get out of the "terrorist" mindset lest we all become labeled terrorists? (say anything bad about "power" [as in people with power] and you're going to get that label) BTW2 - Careful about mentioning "strategies" lest you get on that List.

 

[DieselBound]

The fact there are unused electrons on a wire waiting to be used is the definition of storage.

Look at all those lines with holding capacity...

Immediately brought back fond memories of this (Philippines):

Good time to point out that there's another world out there (we're here wearing blinders). Reality awaits!

 

[DieselBound]

JFC...read it. Learn it.

There is 24.6 GWH of storage in the Grid.

https://www.energy.gov/sites/prod/files/2014/09/f18/Grid%20Energy%20Storage%20December%202013.pdf

I did post this a page ago, so there is no excuse for ignorance.

I'm electrically ignorant, but my limited understanding has to do with thinking about electricity as flows, as in if you stop the input flow output flow stops. I suppose that "storage" CAN actually happen, but it's a matter of for how long and I'm not thinking that, without the inflows happening -amperage not there to keep pushing the flow- the output end is going to drop off pretty quickly.

I might be looking at this from a different angle than what you're trying to convey. If you could help the less gifted among us understand I for one would appreciate it!

 

[Gale Hawkins]

Batteries are possible to repair, when this is everywhere you will find shops that serve batteries like you find shops that handle ICEs major parts.

Here I live there are many EVs and even the oldest keep on running, on a old leaf with a small battery you will notice reduced range but still very popular cars in the used markets, a lot of independent garages are training mechanics to handle the EV bit so you can get thing fixed whiteout going to the dealer. An EV is a very simple machine so lifetime will be long when used parts and knowledge is more common.

I agree in time EV repair will become a standard service in the USA like it is in your part of the world today. In the rural USA there seems to be a prevailing view if it is different it is bad. When it comes to the future of EVS it seems one can learn more talking to an 8-year-old than an 80-year-old. Some posting here are getting closer to the end of our earthly time cycle therefore that may color our view of the future that we do not paint with us being in the picture in a physical sense.

Why some think EVS are going to change the environment boggles my mind. Depopulating the Earth which we're in the process of doing is the only thing that I know would greatly change humans impact on the environment.

Some people fear the unknown. Other people spend their life time turning unknowns into knowns so they do not have to live in fear of the unknown.

The fact remains in 20 years from now the number of people making negative EV posts will decline for one reason or another.

 

[Gale Hawkins]

And what's the requirements to run a car workshop i US, I'm aware that this might vary a great deal. Her the normal route to become a mechanic is three years on technical school and two years as a apprentice with a exam on the shop floor that can take a long time, and of course a theoretical exam at end of the school.

EV knowledge is in the education as ICE barley have any sales anymore.


This is the way most trades educate people.

And all car workshops must have a technical leader with a least a two years engineering degree in the field + experience.

There are no education requirements to operate Auto repair in the United States in a legal sense that I know about. The focus of leadership in the trades has not been on Education and training the next generation but getting max pay and benefits for the current employees and as you can see that has killed the ICE industry. The dumbing down of the United States has been very profound and very successful.

 

[Snobdds]

I'm electrically ignorant, but my limited understanding has to do with thinking about electricity as flows, as in if you stop the input flow output flow stops. I suppose that "storage" CAN actually happen, but it's a matter of for how long and I'm not thinking that, without the inflows happening -amperage not there to keep pushing the flow- the output end is going to drop off pretty quickly.

I might be looking at this from a different angle than what you're trying to convey. If you could help the less gifted among us understand I for one would appreciate it!

If a wire is hot (or a store of energy) it means it's connected to something somewhere energizing it. But remember, the grid is all connected and is load balancing. The main lines are always hot, to maintain that load balancing. Load balancing is what makes it all work. You might have power generated thousands of miles away filling gaps if a source is off line. That is why it's considered a store of energy.

Imagine if states did their own grid and generation. If the source(s) go down, there is no energy.

 

[Agvg]

Here you can't get government contracts on building infrastructure without having a system on apprentice training, even smaller builder firms have apprentices so young people can become well educated in the trades. You can't have focus on quality if you don't have quality in educating people.

 

[Gale Hawkins]

Here you can't get government contracts on building infrastructure without having a system on apprentice training, even smaller builder firms have apprentices so young people can become well educated in the trades. You can't have focus on quality if you don't have quality in educating people.

Old world quality was rejected by the USA unfortunately and especially in the last 50 years in a rush to achieve third world status by outsourcing our trades and technology.

We are forced to drop ICEVs in part because dealerships cannot service them because they are so complex being electro mechanical computers.

 

[Snobdds]

I agree in time EV repair will become a standard service in the USA like it is in your part of the world today. In the rural USA there seems to be a prevailing view if it is different it is bad. When it comes to the future of EVS it seems one can learn more talking to an 8-year-old than an 80-year-old. Some posting here are getting closer to the end of our earthly time cycle therefore that may color our view of the future that we do not paint with us being in the picture in a physical sense.

Why some think EVS are going to change the environment boggles my mind. Depopulating the Earth which we're in the process of doing is the only thing that I know would greatly change humans impact on the environment.

Some people fear the unknown. Other people spend their life time turning unknowns into knowns so they do not have to live in fear of the unknown.

The fact remains in 20 years from now the number of people making negative EV posts will decline for one reason or another.

I think you've missed the entire point here Gale. Nobody I have seen has once advocated for staying the way we are. It's kind of a known fact, society is always moving forward. It's a trope that ignorant people want to always regress...you play that card well here.

As I have said before, EV's are not the problem, it's all the things needed to support EV that are the problem. The benefits are not outweighing the costs here. From an economic stand point, mass adaptation of EV's would require holistic changes to our world at great great costs. The government is broke, where is the money going to come from to build networks of EV support things that may get replaced with a better tech in 15 years.

There is this misconception that EV is the generational future. EV is just the mechanism to move something, and that tech is always evolving. From a utilities stand point, they're broke too. Insurance on a utility is 50 million a year. Utilities break all the rules of economics and are never profitable, they always require government subsidies to function. Even old Musk understands this. He knows the only way his business expands is with thousands of charging stations. The problem with those little things is the power needed. It requires a dedicated wire coming off the a larger line.

So EV's are the it thing right now and a lot off youtube videos are super hyping them. But I know the business of the matter and it's going to be a monumental struggle to make the change.

 

[Agvg]

And the US might struggle a bit more than Europe, most of Europe are on 3 phase 400V except of course here, here it goes in 3 phase 240V on older installations like mine, newer are 400V. As I understand 3 phase are not default to all houses in the us.