Land Pride vs Alamo Flail
- Thread starter tpetty
- Start date
- Views: 7684
AGTtactical
Silver Member
- Joined
- Sep 16, 2018
- Messages
- 200
- Tractor
- Kubota SVL95; Kubota L6060HST
You are incorrect... they are made in the US in Kansas, just like the previous poster said.
leonz
Super Member
Hello AGTactical,
When I chatted with the gentleman from Landpride at that time(2014) he was embarrassed to say that they were Maschio orchard and vineyard shredders. I told him that there was no need to be embarrassed as they will sell very well and they did sell very well.
Landpride imported the Maschio Vineyard and Orchard Shredders from Italy with the Landpride paint and decals UNTIL they decided to begin making them here which was around the time that Landpride was purchased by Kubota.
The Maschio orchard and vineyard shredders are built to the much higher European CEMA agricultural safety standards for farm machinery and implements of all types.
I am correct in saying that they were imported into the United States until the designs changed for the three mowing width models. I knew then that they were no longer reselling the Maschio Orchard and Vineyard Shredders wearing Landpride paint as the Maschio units sold by importers here in the United State are still of the same design and manufacture.
When I chatted with the gentleman from Landpride at that time(2014) he was embarrassed to say that they were Maschio orchard and vineyard shredders. I told him that there was no need to be embarrassed as they will sell very well and they did sell very well.
Landpride imported the Maschio Vineyard and Orchard Shredders from Italy with the Landpride paint and decals UNTIL they decided to begin making them here which was around the time that Landpride was purchased by Kubota.
The Maschio orchard and vineyard shredders are built to the much higher European CEMA agricultural safety standards for farm machinery and implements of all types.
I am correct in saying that they were imported into the United States until the designs changed for the three mowing width models. I knew then that they were no longer reselling the Maschio Orchard and Vineyard Shredders wearing Landpride paint as the Maschio units sold by importers here in the United State are still of the same design and manufacture.
Last edited:
AGTtactical
Silver Member
- Joined
- Sep 16, 2018
- Messages
- 200
- Tractor
- Kubota SVL95; Kubota L6060HST
What are the much higher European safety standards you speak of? Where are you getting this from? Or is this more speculation like your theory on the aerodynamics of side slicer blades?
aczlan
Good Morning
- Joined
- Mar 7, 2008
- Messages
- 17,540
- Tractor
- Kubota L3830GST, B7500HST, BX2660. Formerly: Case 480F LL, David Brown 880UE
Good question, especially since CEMA appears to be an association of agriculture manufacturers which lobbies the EU to set the standards governing the equipment that they make, not a governing body that directly sets said standards (per: Comite Europeen des groupements de constructeurs du machinisme agricole - Wikipedia ).
Aaron Z
AGTtactical
Silver Member
- Joined
- Sep 16, 2018
- Messages
- 200
- Tractor
- Kubota SVL95; Kubota L6060HST
Exactly Aaron...it’s been my experience that anytime someone starts spouting about Europe, they really don’t have a clue. I have lived and worked in Europe and over 50 other nations in my life, and usually they are following, not leading, the US. And I say that as a person who greatly admires some European nations, and even married a Danish gal. I’m just getting a little fed up the flail snobbery of a guy who doesn’t even own a tractor and has a towed 40 year old lawn flail. Several posts back, he was recommending Landpride...now apparently they aren’t safe enough?
leonz
Super Member
Hello and good morning AGTactical,
IF you feel I offended you I offer you a sincere apology. Please do not assume I am being a snob about flail mowers of any particular manufacture or discounting or insulting the European Union or its people.
I am certainly glad that you were able to live in Europe and experience it as well.
As far as CEMA is related to this what I was referring to was the full width piano hinge steel plate front guards on these smaller flail mowers.
I am unsure if any flail mower manufactured in the United States uses the piano hinge front guards to reduce the chance of any object bouncing forward and hitting a pedestrian, the tractor in use or the operator.
The John Deere finish flail mower my father had a full width rubber sheet secured in front of the flail mower shroud just as my first lawn genie and second lawn genie does.
Some manufacturers of large walk behind European and Japanese snowblowers also use a full width piano hinge front debris guard to reduce the chance of ice being ejected from the front of their 2 stage snow blowers while they are in use.
As far as Europe goes, my mother and her entire family came from war torn Europe after the war was over and emigrated here as my maternal grandmother was born in the City of Chicago and was an American Citizen.
My father was part of the post war occupation having been stationed in Bavaria from 1945 until 1953 and in his army career he was required to do many jobs including interrogating refugees seeking asylum in the German prison camps and overseeing labor details consisting of German POW's and German citizens that were marking assigned border locations along the east west border sector in southern Bavaria where he was stationed.
Please do not assume that I am not recommending Land Pride flail mowers and or I am recommending to anyone contemplating purchasing a flail mower to avoid them when examining what brand, type, model or cutting width of flail mower or any mower for that matter that one would, could or should purchase for an individuals mowing needs.
I have only mentioned what I have learned and used as a renter, user and owner of flail mowers for the last forty years to the members of the forum as many have had absolutely no experience nor knowledge of flail mowers and or how they operate.
I have mentioned many times in the past of how my father used his ford jubilee and his 7 foot finish cut john deere finish flail mower to knock down 12-15 foot goldenrod and heavy brush stumps when reclaiming the 12 acres of wet pasture many years ago.
He spent many many hours per month taking care of his property as he wanted many nice flower beds, flowering shrubs and evergreen shrubs for my mother to enjoy and he wanted the entire property as a whole to look nice as it was visible from his road frontage.
Quite often he needed to stop mowing and remove the dust screen from the radiator to clear off the chaff and fine dust from mowing after mowing 100 feet some times as the pollen and fine dust from the air from all the brush that he was mowing down to reclaim it caused the water temperature in the engine became to high and he needed to clean the chaff screen.
When he reinstalled the chaff screen he removed the Duetz oil bath precleaner to see how much dust it collected and to decide whther he needed too return to the shop to clean it and pour in fresh motor oil to catch 95-99% percent of the intake air before it entered the carburetor on the ford jubilee he used.
(I used and serviced the oil Duetz Farr Oil bath precleaners we used in the mine where I worked for 20 years and they are the best type of air filter for gas or diesel engines in my opinion as it is impossible to clog the filter mesh that is used to create these air cleaners and when paired with a secondary dry cartridge air filter they allow the end user to increase his air filter cartridge life for an internal combustion engine.
Oil bath air cleaners were the first air cleaners used for the early American and German made automobiles and they were used for a long time until engine designs changed making the engine larger and the engine compartments smaller).
My father wanted his entire property to look nice and he wanted to mow the old pasture down bring it down to a much more manageable 12 acre lot to mow and after the brush was mowed down to the sod at a 2 inch height of cut after a week of mowing it.
After this was done he mowed 4 acre sections every 2 weeks to keep the former crop land that was turned in to pasture by the previous owner as he owned polo ponies while he was still working as an airline pilot and he kept them on this property from 1953-68.
This is where I spent 10 years of my life growing up learning about dairy farming from a nice neighbor and mowing the 4 acres we had mowed with a International Harvester Corporation 12 horse Cub Cadet lawn tractor with a belly mower and single stage snow thrower.
I wish I still had that original IHC cub and the single stage snow thrower as it was a real workhorse with its Kohler engine. The current 2 stage snow thrower and deere tractor I own are not even worth comparing in quality as They use RAD made attachments that are junk and I can say that from the personal experience of ownership.
I can and will tell you that these manufacturers that switched to a 2 stage belt driven snow blower did it because they wanted more horsepower under the hood and this brought them to the horizontal engine class with electric or mechanical spring tensioned clutches.
After the 1967 cub blew a head gasket dad decided to buy a larger lawn tractor and he traded it in for a 4 cylinder cub lowboy with the diamond tread turf tires and it was not built very well and in our situation we really needed a lawn tractor with a single stage snow thrower as we had a very, very, large steep sloped driveway that did not play nice when it came to snow removal as we had to deal with drifting and heavy snowpack.
The previous owner of the property had a IHC cub lowboy with a mott belly mounted flail mower and a belt to chain drive single stage snow blower and traded it in for the 1967 IHC cub, belly mower and single stage snow thrower.
Every Simplicity or Wheel Horse lawn tractor we owned after that worked as well or better as they also used single stage snow throwers and 12 horsepower engines which I believe were also Kohler engines.
The owners of flail mowers, whether they are municipalities or individuals that own orchard and vineyard crop shredders that may be boom mounted heavy brush mowers or fine cut flail mowers have a safer mower to use in all conditions and in the case of municipalities like the State of New York they only mow the dividers, ditches and shoulders once per year in August with their local NYSDOT labor force.
They always stop to put out the temporary mowing ahead signs at least a 1/3 of a mile ahead or at the nearest intersection coming from both directions or when mowing on a 2 lane one way road that is an interstate highway that passes through New York State.
to inform the motorist that there is active mowing ahead of them to warn them that they will need to slow down and or stop depending upon the traffic conditions as the 300 foot line of sight rules for traveling at speed require the pavement to be marked or supported with a traffic control device which may just be the
mowing ahead signage with red flags attached to the portable sign, a flag person, a trailer mounted remote control traffic signal or truck mounted traffic signal.
When the elder Mr. Mott left IHC he had a better idea for lawn and brush mowing and this was the verticutting method of mowing and he pioneered it with the small diameter flail mower rotor which was made from tubular steel.
The side slicer knife mounting system on the 36-60 inch cut Mathews Company Lawn Genies is a tool less mounting system that employs a steel mounting loop at each mounting station for the side slicers and thatching blades.
These larger diameter flail mower rotors employ a rolled two piece sheet steel weldment that is welded to the two flail mower rotor discs which also have the flail mower rotor stubs that were machined as one piece from what I remember of the parts drawings.
The rolled steel pieces were welded to the flail mower rotor stub end weldments and then the mounting stations were welded to the complete flail mower rotor.
The piano hinge weldments made from thick tube stock steel were welded on the flail mower rotor and the air paddles. The air paddles were made from thick steel sheeting and were mounted on the flail mower rotor with a steel rod held in place with cotter pins and each air paddle was mounted between two rows of mounting stations which were located on the rolled steel sheet.
The 4 rows of mounting stations for the lawn genies were created from strap steel that was pressed to create a center hollow and then the strap was welded to the flail mower rotor shell. the lawn genie required at least 2 additional mounting stations on the edge of the flail mower rotor to provide a full width of cut using one side slicer in each mounting station.
After this was done the flail mower rotor was balanced without the tool less mounting system and then tool less mounting station and then again with knife pairs or knife pair and thatching blades were installed and the complete flail mower was speed balanced and then installed in the specific mower that was ordered by the retailer from the Mathews Company.
A flail mower of any size employs the very same physics in operation no matter the size.
This applies to the original Mott Walk Behind Flail Mower which was the first belt driven 18-24? flail mower with the single mower handle or the widest 25 foot cut flail crop shredder from Hiniker or the largest 3 section folding flail crop shredder from INO made in Eastern Europe.
They all operate using the verticut method pioneered by the elder Mr. Mott. If the younger Mr. Mot had not died as a result of crashing his experimental airplane outside his fathers manufacturing plant things may have turned out much differently for flail mowers in general and they would have a much larger market share.
The issues of cost of construction with less expensive steel materials and the ease of construction with pressed/ formed steel decks for many rotary mowers is what drives mower manufacturing today for most all manufacturers.
I just tell everyone to do their homework with looking at flail mowers and snow blowers.
I always mention to a potential first time flail mower owner he or she can be blessed with a good used unit that is sold at a dispersal sale or an equipment auction and it would cost them less money to purchase.
As far as mowers and insurance go the insurance companies do not like them period as had to deal with many
injury claims from them as the early walk behind lawn mowers had no kill switches and caused many, many injuries; A family friend lost part of his right foot up to his instep when he slipped and his right foot went under the mower deck.
As I stated earlier, if I offended you I again offer you a sincere apology.
_______________________________________________________________________________________
"The only things that fall from the sky are Angels and Rangers."
IF you feel I offended you I offer you a sincere apology. Please do not assume I am being a snob about flail mowers of any particular manufacture or discounting or insulting the European Union or its people.
I am certainly glad that you were able to live in Europe and experience it as well.
As far as CEMA is related to this what I was referring to was the full width piano hinge steel plate front guards on these smaller flail mowers.
I am unsure if any flail mower manufactured in the United States uses the piano hinge front guards to reduce the chance of any object bouncing forward and hitting a pedestrian, the tractor in use or the operator.
The John Deere finish flail mower my father had a full width rubber sheet secured in front of the flail mower shroud just as my first lawn genie and second lawn genie does.
Some manufacturers of large walk behind European and Japanese snowblowers also use a full width piano hinge front debris guard to reduce the chance of ice being ejected from the front of their 2 stage snow blowers while they are in use.
As far as Europe goes, my mother and her entire family came from war torn Europe after the war was over and emigrated here as my maternal grandmother was born in the City of Chicago and was an American Citizen.
My father was part of the post war occupation having been stationed in Bavaria from 1945 until 1953 and in his army career he was required to do many jobs including interrogating refugees seeking asylum in the German prison camps and overseeing labor details consisting of German POW's and German citizens that were marking assigned border locations along the east west border sector in southern Bavaria where he was stationed.
Please do not assume that I am not recommending Land Pride flail mowers and or I am recommending to anyone contemplating purchasing a flail mower to avoid them when examining what brand, type, model or cutting width of flail mower or any mower for that matter that one would, could or should purchase for an individuals mowing needs.
I have only mentioned what I have learned and used as a renter, user and owner of flail mowers for the last forty years to the members of the forum as many have had absolutely no experience nor knowledge of flail mowers and or how they operate.
I have mentioned many times in the past of how my father used his ford jubilee and his 7 foot finish cut john deere finish flail mower to knock down 12-15 foot goldenrod and heavy brush stumps when reclaiming the 12 acres of wet pasture many years ago.
He spent many many hours per month taking care of his property as he wanted many nice flower beds, flowering shrubs and evergreen shrubs for my mother to enjoy and he wanted the entire property as a whole to look nice as it was visible from his road frontage.
Quite often he needed to stop mowing and remove the dust screen from the radiator to clear off the chaff and fine dust from mowing after mowing 100 feet some times as the pollen and fine dust from the air from all the brush that he was mowing down to reclaim it caused the water temperature in the engine became to high and he needed to clean the chaff screen.
When he reinstalled the chaff screen he removed the Duetz oil bath precleaner to see how much dust it collected and to decide whther he needed too return to the shop to clean it and pour in fresh motor oil to catch 95-99% percent of the intake air before it entered the carburetor on the ford jubilee he used.
(I used and serviced the oil Duetz Farr Oil bath precleaners we used in the mine where I worked for 20 years and they are the best type of air filter for gas or diesel engines in my opinion as it is impossible to clog the filter mesh that is used to create these air cleaners and when paired with a secondary dry cartridge air filter they allow the end user to increase his air filter cartridge life for an internal combustion engine.
Oil bath air cleaners were the first air cleaners used for the early American and German made automobiles and they were used for a long time until engine designs changed making the engine larger and the engine compartments smaller).
My father wanted his entire property to look nice and he wanted to mow the old pasture down bring it down to a much more manageable 12 acre lot to mow and after the brush was mowed down to the sod at a 2 inch height of cut after a week of mowing it.
After this was done he mowed 4 acre sections every 2 weeks to keep the former crop land that was turned in to pasture by the previous owner as he owned polo ponies while he was still working as an airline pilot and he kept them on this property from 1953-68.
This is where I spent 10 years of my life growing up learning about dairy farming from a nice neighbor and mowing the 4 acres we had mowed with a International Harvester Corporation 12 horse Cub Cadet lawn tractor with a belly mower and single stage snow thrower.
I wish I still had that original IHC cub and the single stage snow thrower as it was a real workhorse with its Kohler engine. The current 2 stage snow thrower and deere tractor I own are not even worth comparing in quality as They use RAD made attachments that are junk and I can say that from the personal experience of ownership.
I can and will tell you that these manufacturers that switched to a 2 stage belt driven snow blower did it because they wanted more horsepower under the hood and this brought them to the horizontal engine class with electric or mechanical spring tensioned clutches.
After the 1967 cub blew a head gasket dad decided to buy a larger lawn tractor and he traded it in for a 4 cylinder cub lowboy with the diamond tread turf tires and it was not built very well and in our situation we really needed a lawn tractor with a single stage snow thrower as we had a very, very, large steep sloped driveway that did not play nice when it came to snow removal as we had to deal with drifting and heavy snowpack.
The previous owner of the property had a IHC cub lowboy with a mott belly mounted flail mower and a belt to chain drive single stage snow blower and traded it in for the 1967 IHC cub, belly mower and single stage snow thrower.
Every Simplicity or Wheel Horse lawn tractor we owned after that worked as well or better as they also used single stage snow throwers and 12 horsepower engines which I believe were also Kohler engines.
The owners of flail mowers, whether they are municipalities or individuals that own orchard and vineyard crop shredders that may be boom mounted heavy brush mowers or fine cut flail mowers have a safer mower to use in all conditions and in the case of municipalities like the State of New York they only mow the dividers, ditches and shoulders once per year in August with their local NYSDOT labor force.
They always stop to put out the temporary mowing ahead signs at least a 1/3 of a mile ahead or at the nearest intersection coming from both directions or when mowing on a 2 lane one way road that is an interstate highway that passes through New York State.
to inform the motorist that there is active mowing ahead of them to warn them that they will need to slow down and or stop depending upon the traffic conditions as the 300 foot line of sight rules for traveling at speed require the pavement to be marked or supported with a traffic control device which may just be the
mowing ahead signage with red flags attached to the portable sign, a flag person, a trailer mounted remote control traffic signal or truck mounted traffic signal.
When the elder Mr. Mott left IHC he had a better idea for lawn and brush mowing and this was the verticutting method of mowing and he pioneered it with the small diameter flail mower rotor which was made from tubular steel.
The side slicer knife mounting system on the 36-60 inch cut Mathews Company Lawn Genies is a tool less mounting system that employs a steel mounting loop at each mounting station for the side slicers and thatching blades.
These larger diameter flail mower rotors employ a rolled two piece sheet steel weldment that is welded to the two flail mower rotor discs which also have the flail mower rotor stubs that were machined as one piece from what I remember of the parts drawings.
The rolled steel pieces were welded to the flail mower rotor stub end weldments and then the mounting stations were welded to the complete flail mower rotor.
The piano hinge weldments made from thick tube stock steel were welded on the flail mower rotor and the air paddles. The air paddles were made from thick steel sheeting and were mounted on the flail mower rotor with a steel rod held in place with cotter pins and each air paddle was mounted between two rows of mounting stations which were located on the rolled steel sheet.
The 4 rows of mounting stations for the lawn genies were created from strap steel that was pressed to create a center hollow and then the strap was welded to the flail mower rotor shell. the lawn genie required at least 2 additional mounting stations on the edge of the flail mower rotor to provide a full width of cut using one side slicer in each mounting station.
After this was done the flail mower rotor was balanced without the tool less mounting system and then tool less mounting station and then again with knife pairs or knife pair and thatching blades were installed and the complete flail mower was speed balanced and then installed in the specific mower that was ordered by the retailer from the Mathews Company.
A flail mower of any size employs the very same physics in operation no matter the size.
This applies to the original Mott Walk Behind Flail Mower which was the first belt driven 18-24? flail mower with the single mower handle or the widest 25 foot cut flail crop shredder from Hiniker or the largest 3 section folding flail crop shredder from INO made in Eastern Europe.
They all operate using the verticut method pioneered by the elder Mr. Mott. If the younger Mr. Mot had not died as a result of crashing his experimental airplane outside his fathers manufacturing plant things may have turned out much differently for flail mowers in general and they would have a much larger market share.
The issues of cost of construction with less expensive steel materials and the ease of construction with pressed/ formed steel decks for many rotary mowers is what drives mower manufacturing today for most all manufacturers.
I just tell everyone to do their homework with looking at flail mowers and snow blowers.
I always mention to a potential first time flail mower owner he or she can be blessed with a good used unit that is sold at a dispersal sale or an equipment auction and it would cost them less money to purchase.
As far as mowers and insurance go the insurance companies do not like them period as had to deal with many
injury claims from them as the early walk behind lawn mowers had no kill switches and caused many, many injuries; A family friend lost part of his right foot up to his instep when he slipped and his right foot went under the mower deck.
As I stated earlier, if I offended you I again offer you a sincere apology.
_______________________________________________________________________________________
"The only things that fall from the sky are Angels and Rangers."
Last edited:
aczlan
Good Morning
- Joined
- Mar 7, 2008
- Messages
- 17,540
- Tractor
- Kubota L3830GST, B7500HST, BX2660. Formerly: Case 480F LL, David Brown 880UE
While a flail is theoretically safer, the real difference must not be much as last I heard, insurance companies for private contractors doing roadside mowing don't offer any discount for running flails rather than rotary mowers.
Once a year? Around here NYSDOT mows at least twice a year, sometimes three times.
Not sure how that or the following paragraphs that I didn't quote relate to the subject at hand (your claim that European flails are safer than US flails).
Aaron Z
AGTtactical
Silver Member
- Joined
- Sep 16, 2018
- Messages
- 200
- Tractor
- Kubota SVL95; Kubota L6060HST
So this is the one example you can quote to justify your previous broad blanket statement below?
Sorry, but that one item clearly doesn't mean Europe has "much higher safety standards". Many manufactures do not use piano hinges because they are more prone to damage and harder to replace...not because they are better. Most commercial heavy duty forestry mulchers use chains, as does my John Deere MH60. Hinged steel plate guards would make the unit less safe, not more, because they would very quickly bend or break off.
You aren't offending me...but its not good to make claims which are sometimes incorrect or exaggerated. You seem to have a tendency to assume you know a lot more than pretty much everyone else around here, which is amusing given that many of the guys here own and operate farms or business and have daily (and recent) experience with lots of modern heavy equipment (which is why I do a lot more listening than writing as there are guys whose knowledge level is astounding). You continually recommend very expensive high end flail mowers while criticizing the purchases of anyone who doesn't, while never purchasing or operating any of them yourself (sorry, a 40 year-old Lawn Genie towed behind a household riding mower around your house doesn't seem to be a huge amount of personal experience).
Its hard to tell if you are trying to help, or just trying to prove how much you know.
Last edited:
AGTtactical
Silver Member
- Joined
- Sep 16, 2018
- Messages
- 200
- Tractor
- Kubota SVL95; Kubota L6060HST
Good point Aaron...I was based at Newburgh NY for 4 years in the Marine Corps...my wife was based in near Atlantic City, NJ. For 4 years I drove the highways of that state every weekend to our house in ACY. Never saw grass with a year's worth of growth either.
Last edited:
