value leader EF155 flail mower rotor replacement.

[rocco611]

the rotor pulley snapped on my EF155 flail mower. I contacted Betstco in Oregon , they can't supply a replacement, I would have to buy a new mower. I attempted to drill out the plug welds and remove the stub shaft from the rotor only to find that it is also welded around the inset face then machined. I contacted a local machine shop and they informed me that if I repaired it as designed they would not be able to balance it, due to the small diameter of the end shafts (one inch O.D) and the fact they are inset into the rotor housing. the shaft is supported by two UC205 radial insert bearings the housing of which mount inside the side plates of the flail mower and fit inside the recess of the rotor shaft. the one inch shaft steps down to about 13/16 where the pulley is mounted. The center of the shaft is drilled for the grease fitting , then cross drilled at the bearing location, that is where it sheared off. I am thinking of building a new rotor, with 1 1/4" stub shafts then mounting the bearing retainers on the outside of the mower side plates. this way there is no need to drill and cross drill the shaft, I dont have to inset the stub shafts then machine the end of the tube for the bearing housing to fit in. much simpler to build, the shop can balance it . I am not worried about the increased width .suggestions appreciated.

 

[tomplum]

That's one you just about have to see. The balance issue has me confused. You may be right that it may be best to start from scratch. So did you get into something with this or is it just a sketchy set up?

 

[rocco611]

That's one you just about have to see. The balance issue has me confused. You may be right that it may be best to start from scratch. So did you get into something with this or is it just a sketchy set up?

A family member borrowed it, said he didnt hit anything. It looks sketchy , same shaft diameter as a 3hp Briggs and Stratton with the added weakness of the the center hole, cross drilled and a lubrication groove all the way around . soft mild steel as well. I don't know about the balancing process at the shop, I am going to send them a autocad drawing once I come up with a new design, they said from that they would be able to tell me if they could balance it. I called a couple drive line shops, they said they couldn't do it at all.

 

[ddbackhoe]

If I owned one, I believe I would be contacting the Oregon Attorney Generals office and file a complaint. Bestco clearly indicates on their website that parts are available. They also imply through the manual that all parts are available. If in fact these parts are not purchaseable, they may be in violation of a consumer protection law (lemon law, etc.). Its free and doesn稚 hurt to find out.
Parts |
http://betstco.com/Betstco_Manuals/FH-EF_FLAIL_MANUAL.pdf

Consumer Protection - Oregon Department of Justice : Consumer Protection

 

[rocco611]

If I owned one, I believe I would be contacting the Oregon Attorney Generals office and file a complaint. Bestco clearly indicates on their website that parts are available. They also imply through the manual that all parts are available. If in fact these parts are not purchaseable, they may be in violation of a consumer protection law (lemon law, etc.). Its free and doesn稚 hurt to find out.
Parts |
http://betstco.com/Betstco_Manuals/FH-EF_FLAIL_MANUAL.pdf

Consumer Protection - Oregon Department of Justice : Consumer Protection

My mower is long out of warranty. I talked with the owner of the company, he said he purchased the company from someone else and no longer supported the "ValueLeader" brand products that were sold by the previous owner. I get what your saying, and now that I think about it, I feel a bit guilty , like I have some obligation to make an effort to get the company to correct the design problem if that hasn't been done already. if the new rotors are the same, I dont think I would pay money for one. I really try to avoid getting into legal issues and am not here to bash the Betsco. I am looking for Idea's from fabricators here that might have a better solution to the rotor problem. thanks for the links though, I will definitely look into it.

 

[ddbackhoe]

I talked with the owner of the company, he said he purchased the company from someone else and no longer supported the "ValueLeader" brand products that were sold by the previous owner. I get what your saying, and now that I think about it, I feel a bit guilty , like I have some obligation to make an effort to get the company to correct the design problem if that hasn't been done already. I really try to avoid getting into legal issues and am not here to bash the Betsco. I am looking for Idea's from fabricators here that might have a better solution to the rotor problem. thanks for the links though, I will definitely look into it.

Add some more pics and we’ll see what we can come up with. My first thought (similar to yours) is to weld on a new stub with a different type pillow block bearing. You could then make an improvised mock up to balance your own shaft with an electric motor and a belt.

Filing a complaint with the AG office doesn’t get you into legal issues per se. They will just tell you what decision they made based on your complaint. Personally, I think all of these places importing china mowers (value leader, town sunny, victory, etc.) shouldn’t just be allowed to say, “Sorry bout that, I can get you a whole new mower” and when you purchase a business there can be some assumption of liability from the previous owner.

 

[rocco611]

Add some more pics and we’ll see what we can come up with. My first thought (similar to yours) is to weld on a new stub with a different type pillow block bearing. You could then make an improvised mock up to balance your own shaft with an electric motor and a belt.

Filing a complaint with the AG office doesn’t get you into legal issues per se. They will just tell you what decision they made based on your complaint. Personally, I think all of these places importing china mowers (value leader, town sunny, victory, etc.) shouldn’t just be allowed to say, “Sorry bout that, I can get you a whole new mower” and when you purchase a business there can be some assumption of liability from the previous owner.

I will post some more pics soon. I built drivelines for my hotrods when I was a teenager, balanced them by taping washers to the shaft and driving the car, then moving the washer till the vibration went away. I would interested to know how to balance a flail shaft on the mower.

 

[ddbackhoe]

I will post some more pics soon. I built drivelines for my hotrods when I was a teenager, balanced them by taping washers to the shaft and driving the car, then moving the washer till the vibration went away. I would interested to know how to balance a flail shaft on the mower.

Start with a dial indicator, no knifes or attaching hardware. Weigh hardware and place matching numbers to opposing sides, apply power see what happens.

 

[ericm979]

The "Farmer's Helper" models Betstco sells now aren't the same design with interchangeable parts?

 

[ddbackhoe]

My first thought (similar to yours) is to weld on a new stub with a different type pillow block bearing.

Second thought, will a Mott one fit? Page3, Our Products - Flail MasterFlail Master

 

[metalbender]

My thought would be to remove the remaining bit of shaft, make an end plug to fit the rotor with an appropriate stub for the bearing. Being on the cente line, balancing shouln't be required. Does need to be dialed in while welding.

 

[rocco611]

update on the flail mower repair. I purchased some 1" diameter 4340 round stock and a short piece of 3" Diameter 1018 round to rebuild the end of the flail mower shaft. I reduced the diameter of the 4340 to fit both the bearing and the pulley bushing. I drilled a 1'"hole in the 3" round bar then cut a counter bore in it on the mill using a rotary table. After drilling the hole and cutting the counter bore I welded the 4340 shaft into the 3" round stock. I am now reducing the diameter of the 3" bar to fit inside the flail mower rotor where I cut the broken end off. once I get that fit into the rotor, I will mount the rotor with the new shaft in the mower then tack and adjust with a hammer and a dial indicator till it is straight. I am reluctant to center drill and cross drill the shaft for grease. even though the 4340 is stronger than the original mild steel part I am going to look for a location to drill bearing housing for a grease passage to the bearing.

 

[rocco611]

The "Farmer's Helper" models Betstco sells now aren't the same design with interchangeable parts?

I Called Betstco, the owner said he purchased the value leader company from the previous owner and no longer supported parts for that product line. he said parts from the Betstco farmers helper mowers were not the same. though the parts listing in the manual appears to be identical. he seemed a bit annoyed after the second time I called , so i didn't pursue it further. Figured I would repair it myself or spend a lot more money and buy something I could get parts for.

 

[rocco611]

My thought would be to remove the remaining bit of shaft, make an end plug to fit the rotor with an appropriate stub for the bearing. Being on the cente line, balancing shouln't be required. Does need to be dialed in while welding.

yes that seems to be the best Idea , I am working on the plug with the stub shaft now.

 

[ericm979]

I Called Betstco, the owner said he purchased the value leader company from the previous owner and no longer supported parts for that product line. he said parts from the Betstco farmers helper mowers were not the same. though the parts listing in the manual appears to be identical. he seemed a bit annoyed after the second time I called , so i didn't pursue it further. Figured I would repair it myself or spend a lot more money and buy something I could get parts for.

They appear to be generic Chinese mowers. I realize that each manufacturer makes changes but often many parts are the same. The previous owner of Betstco posted here at times and seemed like a decent guy. From what you report the new owner does not sound very helpful.

 

[rocco611]

I welded in the stub shaft this morning, runout is .030 on the end that I repaired, other end is .060 I guess that should be good enough as it did not vibrate before , being .060 out. there is .005 runout on the shaft where it attaches to the pulley. end play on the rotor shaft is .070 . This mower uses UC205 insert bearings , I am not sure where I should put the end play with these. I know ball bearing do not like to run under preload like taper bearings. I thought about running it at 0 endplay. suggestions ?


thanks

 

[metalbender]

Pic of the bearing mounting?

 

[rocco611]

here are some pics thought about spot facing and angle drilling where the sharpie marks are. not an Ideal location for a zerk though. there is a seal that goes on the outboard side of the bearing flange

 

[metalbender]

Looks like a heavy bit of kit. The bearing is in the assembly in third third pic? How will the lube enter the bearing from an outside zerk?

 

[rocco611]

Looks like a heavy bit of kit. The bearing is in the assembly in third third pic? How will the lube enter the bearing from an outside zerk?

I didnt want to drill the center then cross drill and groove the shaft to lube the bearing from the end of the shaft. that was the weakness that caused the failure. Even with the new 4340 steel shaft that method seems marginal at best given the small diameter of the shaft. yes the bearing mount is in the 3rd and 4th pic. Last night I spot faced the edge of the flange, tilted the mill 25 degrees forward and 20degree to the right. drilled into the cavity that is used to insert the bearing into the flange assy. I have to lube the bearing from under the mower now and the zerk is susceptible to damage from things flying around in the flails. but I mow two acres with it four times a year with grass blades , I am not mulching twigs or hitting rocks.
ehh, I have probably spent too much time fixing this thing, but I do like making chips on the lathe and mill I will post some more pics