Rotary plow or tiller

[bluesilver]

Hi, i have a question that i am hoping someone might be able to help me out a little with.
Our soil is pretty much a clay base soil and i kind of got into our soil a tad early,
I have left it alone for a few weeks to dry out more but the end result is hard lumpy dirt that doesn't really break up.
Lumps are kind of hard as in when you kick them they don't crumble, most either stay as they are or maybe just break in half if that makes any sense.

I was Just interested to know what anyone thoughts are on the best implement to maybe use, either the rotary plow to try and break them up or continue passes with a tiller.
I have been over it today with a tiller, but just end up with little lumps the size of either tennis balls or golf balls.
I think i may have damaged the soil for a few years trying to get onto it a tad early.

Any ideas or information would be greatly appreciated.
Cheers.

 

[Turbys_1700]

Here in NC back in the day before no-till we broke ground using moldboard plows in the fall and disc harrows in the spring for planting. If the ground was wet it didn't matter since it would freeze over the winter. If you work red clay in the spring you will have issues. My papaw told me as a young boy if you work red ground wet in the spring you will roll clods all year. About all you can do now is work it dry with the tiller. Best of luck.

 

[jcraftenworth]

Rotary plow to break unworked ground, tiller to work already broken ground. And if you have lumpy hard clods, the tiller is the only thing that can break them down, 1st gear rpms to the max!!!

 

[Ford850]

As the others have said, the tiller is best now. IF the lumps get too dry, then a light rain will help them crumble easier too.

 

[bluesilver]

Thanks for the replies, appreciated.
Yes i think i just got onto it a fair bit too early.
I wasn't sure if the rotary plow would cut up the lumps with its slicing action or not.
I will just have to wait until it dries out a lot more underneath and go over it with the tiller, it is very unseasonably wet this year for us, days are up in around 70 F and ground 2 inches is still wet

 

[leonz]

Hello bluesilver,

If you can buy some deep mined ag gypsum it will dissolve the clay.
The chemically rendered gypsum is more expensive and it will still work well.

 

[bluesilver]

Thanks for the reply, i am hoping not to have to use gypsum as it will alter the pH of the soil, as i am sure i will need quiet a bit to cover the 2000 sq ft area.
I have got it broken up a bit with another run over it with the tiller, but might just leave it until the crops have finished for the season in 6 months and put a good load of mushroom compost over it and till it all in for the winter.

 

[leonz]

Thanks for the reply, i am hoping not to have to use gypsum as it will alter the pH of the soil, as i am sure i will need quiet a bit to cover the 2000 sq ft area.
I have got it broken up a bit with another run over it with the tiller, but might just leave it until the crops have finished for the season in 6 months and put a good load of mushroom compost over it and till it all in for the winter.

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You can use lime to bring it back up to neutral if that is where you wish to keep the PH

 

[bluesilver]

I do appreciate the information and suggestions.
Only drama with Dolomite that i am aware of and could be wrong here is that it is CaMg(CO3)2,
(Calcium and Magnesium) Calcium being lime that raises the pH.
But do appreciate the input, looks like best option is Mushroom compost when the winter come around.

 

[wtractor80]

Hello I think that on land like yours the best solution is to use a rotary plough. It is more aggressive than a rotary tiller!

 

[RalphVa]

Good advice. Loved Tasmania the 2 times we visited. One time was dry. Second time, that mini Grand Canyon up north was about 1/3 to 1/2 filled with water.

I used a rotary plow on an old Gravely that I had when we first moved here. It turned weed infested, actually mostly heavy fescue grass, dirt completely over and left, or course, those mounds of dirt.

I broke them down with the rotary plow by making raised beds, just out of dirt. In the old days on our bigger farms, we'd break down the plow mounds with discs. A tiller would do something similar. I only ever had a very small tiller that I used on my little patches up around the house.

I only used the rotary plow once and then sold it. With no till, I've never used one again.

Ralph

 

[wtractor80]

Good advice. Loved Tasmania the 2 times we visited. One time was dry. Second time, that mini Grand Canyon up north was about 1/3 to 1/2 filled with water.

I used a rotary plow on an old Gravely that I had when we first moved here. It turned weed infested, actually mostly heavy fescue grass, dirt completely over and left, or course, those mounds of dirt.

I broke them down with the rotary plow by making raised beds, just out of dirt. In the old days on our bigger farms, we'd break down the plow mounds with discs. A tiller would do something similar. I only ever had a very small tiller that I used on my little patches up around the house.

I only used the rotary plow once and then sold it. With no till, I've never used one again.

Ralph

Farmers also did it here in Italy (with discs). Usually I use also the Casorzo rotay disc plough for my walking tractor, but depend on the soil you have. I have medium hardness soil and it make a good job. Here I found a technical data sheet of my the rotay disc plough.

 

[jcraftenworth]

just to point out to the casual observer...rotary disc plow is not the same as the gravely style rotary plow. The gravely style basically gives the effect of plowing and then discing, but in one pass. On the 2 wheel tractor scale, it is the most efficient tool for breaking virgin soil, and the other primary use is building raised beds and hilling potatoes, corn, etc for weed control and growth benefits.

 

[RalphVa]

Here's a Gravely rotary plow.

Ralph

 

[wtractor80]

just to point out to the casual observer...rotary disc plow is not the same as the gravely style rotary plow. The gravely style basically gives the effect of plowing and then discing, but in one pass. On the 2 wheel tractor scale, it is the most efficient tool for breaking virgin soil, and the other primary use is building raised beds and hilling potatoes, corn, etc for weed control and growth benefits.

OK I understood, I was referring to what RalphVa says about it the plowing of the mounds with the disks...As gravely style rotary plow i usually use this:

 

[jcraftenworth]

Here's a Gravely rotary plow.

Ralph

The reason it's referred to as gravely style is because it was invented by the guy behind the gravely 2 wheel tractors. Nowadays most people in the USA that have a similar style plow have the Berta rotary plow, made in Italy. There really isn't a 2 wheel maker in america anymore, but the europeans and especially italians have taken the ball and run with it. Simply due to the scale of growing and land ownership in the USA vs Europe.

I just bought the berta at the end of last season, and was super impressed with the capabilities. It cost plenty but I don't regret it at all. It's not that big, but weight nearly 100 lbs! Very heavy duty and robust piece of equipment that does a lot for you on a small scale. Outside of trying to squeeze in a small 4 wheel tractor with tiller/bed former attachment into your garden, there's nothing else that can so effectively maintain a raised dirt bed growing system. And the problem with using a 4 wheel tractor is that even if you can find a setup that is compatible with your garden, you probably can't squeeze through after the plants are all in and growing, it's something you can only use at the start of the season. That could actually work out for bed maintanence as once a year is enough, but there are other implements you wanna use making the 2 wheel tractor the way to go throughout the growing season.

 

[freedomlives]

@wtractor80
Have you ever had a chance to compare the Berta rotary plow to the Casorzo? Given that, I think, any patents on the Berta would be over by now, does the Casorzo have technical advantages? (I have the Berta reversible, which I found someone selling used in Italy for a really low price).

 

[Code54]

The Berta reversible is top notch for sure but expensive. I been thinking of getting a rotary for my BCS (had one for a Gravely), do you all feel the Berta reversible is worth the extra money over the Berta non-reversible?

 

[freedomlives]

Well, the thing you have to consider is how you're going to be using it. One thing I've done a bit of is cutting terraces in a hillside. For this I would think reversible is almost essential. Likewise swales (long, ditchlike features), I wouldn't want to be going back to the other side each time.

But if you planned carefully, I think you could make raised beds in such a way as to not have to travel without plowing much.

I got lucky though-- the guy selling my reversible was selling for the same price as others were selling non-reversible ones.

 

[CADplans]

Either a rotary plow,, or a cultivator,,, can cause more problems than good, if used at the wrong time.

Clay is funny, my clay, if ever compacted into balls, will not go away without freezing,
here is my rotary plow,

Actually, I have 4 or 5 of these, as I seemed to buy them whenever I found them over the years,
I have two that are almost unused.

With my clay, you either wait for a freeze to break the clumps, or hand remove them.
Does the OP get soil freezing "down under"?