Timberline 25 shingles going bad

[Billy Bee]

I built my house in 1995 and installed Timberline 25 laminated shingles, the kind that look like cedar shakes. The roof has developed a couple leaks, and I had a roofer come to repair them. He said they have been having problems with these shingles leaking right through the shingle. Apparently they deteriorate and allow water to migrate through. These are 25 year shingles and only 20 years old. I have inexpensive 3 in 1 shingles on my barn that are 30 years old and no problems. The Timberlines were supposed to be one of the best at the time, and I thought I would get more than 25 years out of them. Anyone else have or heard of these problems? Looks like a complete reroof this summer as the roofer said more leaks will pop up and they are nearly impossible to locate.

 

[KB9UDE]

Shingles are not made of the same quality that they used to be. I recommended steel roofing but that may or may not suite your style. There are several styles and quality of steel roofing also.

 

[KennyG]

Just curious - what are the slopes on the problem roof and the good roof. I've always heard that a shingle on a low slope roof (1 in 3 or 1 in 4) will almost never reach its "life". While a shingle on a steep roof (1 in 2 to 1 in 1) will usually exceed its rated life.

 

[Gary Fowler]

I have always heard that anything more than 4/12 pitch on a gravel embedded asphalt shingle will cause the gravel to wash off quickly and then the shingle to deteriorate from sun exposure. This being in the deep south and not exposed to snow for 4 months out of the year where steeper pitched roofs are required to slip the snow off.

 

[Billy Bee]

Just curious - what are the slopes on the problem roof and the good roof. I've always heard that a shingle on a low slope roof (1 in 3 or 1 in 4) will almost never reach its "life". While a shingle on a steep roof (1 in 2 to 1 in 1) will usually exceed its rated life.

The 3 in 1 shingles on the barn have a 4/12 pitch and they are not failing. The house with the Timberlines is a 5/12 pitch.

 

[teejk]

A builder told me that some manufacturers no longer put a life rating on their products. Too many variables (freeze/thaw, etc.) and they have all had some issues. I bought a house that had fiberglass base shingles and several of those lost the entire coating at 10 years so it looked like white rags blowing in the breeze. Dunno what to tell you to do. Steel is expensive but maybe worth it.

 

[Toyboy]

We just had our place re-roofed because of a hail storm. We have a 10-12 on garage and 8-12 on house. I had them put ice & water guard within 2' of peak on both bld. instead of traditional underlayment.

 

[coralhead]

I put steel on all of my buildings. The price was a bit more but goes on a lot quicker. When the cost is calculated in to replace the roof in 20 years the steel makes a lot more sense to me. I also am able to do steel by myself.

 

[teejk]

I put steel on all of my buildings. The price was a bit more but goes on a lot quicker. When the cost is calculated in to replace the roof in 20 years the steel makes a lot more sense to me. I also am able to do steel by myself.

I helped a guy install steel over shingles last year. Was a "snap" interlocking panel system installed over a thin layer of foam (looked like carpet backing). It went down quick other than the valleys...also had to plan ahead to avoid walking on it. I see that steel is now available in patterns that look like shingles.

 

[Rustyiron]

They are actually calling metal roofing "green". I think because of the life expectancy over asphalt based roofing. Lot's of choices out there in steel roofing these days.

 

[EddieWalker]

Did you contact the manufacturer? Is it GAF? Is the roofing company still around the installed them?

I don't know that particular shingle, but find it hard to believe that the shingles are failing due to age at only 20 years. Roofs are very simple, but if you cut one corner, things go bad quickly.

Do you have trees over your roof that have been dropping branches on the roof? It's very hard to find a hole caused by a branch since they hit, create the damage, then bounce or slide down the roof.

Was this new construction or where the shingles installed over existing shingles? existing paper? When the roof was installed, was the existing roof completely removed and the decking inspected? I'm in attics all the time and it's shocking to see what the decking is like in some homes. In places, there is no decking and the shingles are nailed to the felt paper with nothing else holding them in place!!!!

Leaks in roofs are most common around vents or other things going through the roof. Reusing old vents, or not sealing around them happens all the time. Skylights are horrible in so many ways, especially for leaking!!!!

How where the valleys done? Did they use metal flashing? Grace weathershield? Or just overlapped felt paper?

Leaves building up in a valley will lead to leaks in the valley. Same thing with leaves in the gutters. Water overflows the gutters and then gets into the soffits. Sometimes the water travels quite a distance before you see it. In fact, most leaks that you see in the house are not under where the actual leak i n the roof.

Pictures of the shingles would really help.

 

[Billrog]

I would guess if the roof is leaking it's because when the shingles were installed they never left enough side lap between one row of shingles and the next in places. I've seen this with the shake look shingles being installed because it's not that obvious by just looking at the roof. The minimum distance from the edge of one row of shingles to the next is right on the packaging generally 5.5" and I've seen them installed with 1.5" which will develop leaks.

 

[square1]

There is a class action lawsuit

 

[jfh28]

insufficient attic ventilation absolutely kills roofing shingles........go up in the attic on a nice summer day and that temp is what the shingles are feeling as well as the suns rays.......ridge vents don't work without adequate unblocked soffit vents to go with it....can't tell you how many times I've seen the insulation pushed up tight to the roof edge in the attic completely blocking the airflow........and roof hawks are worthless......best is continuous soffit vents and powered attic ventilation fans on a thermostat set.........keep the attic temp low and get a longer life out of the shingles.......plus your house stays cooler.........Jack

 

[EddieWalker]

A common misunderstanding is that venting an attic is to try and cool it off. The actual reason for venting is to keep the lumber and decking dry. Heat rises. Air entering the attic from the soffits is lower then where it leaves the attic at it's peak. Ridge vents are the best because they are at the highest point in the roof, but turbines and gable vents do the same thing. It's all about the air heating up in the attic so it moves from low to high. The airflow dries out the moisture that would accumulate there from condensation in the mornings.

Not having air flow will cause mold and rot in the wood. I've heard that it affects shingles, but I've never seen this myself. I'm not aware of moisture under a roof being the source of shingle failure. The paper under the shingles keeps whatever is happening in the attic separate from what's happening outside the roof.

 

[Oaktree]

I put steel on all of my buildings. The price was a bit more but goes on a lot quicker. When the cost is calculated in to replace the roof in 20 years the steel makes a lot more sense to me. I also am able to do steel by myself.

I did the same when I re-roofed my garage last summer. Materials cost was about the same, and the job went a lot faster. I just nailed strapping over the 40 year old shingles that were there...lotta time saved in not having to strip the roof, which would have been necessary with new shingles. I don't see why pro roofers charge a 50% premium for steel roofs when what little additional material cost is more than outweighed by less labor.

Snow slides right off now, saving me having to get up there and shovel/roof rake it several times each winter.

 

[Billy Bee]

Did you contact the manufacturer? Is it GAF? Is the roofing company still around the installed them?

I don't know that particular shingle, but find it hard to believe that the shingles are failing due to age at only 20 years. Roofs are very simple, but if you cut one corner, things go bad quickly.

Do you have trees over your roof that have been dropping branches on the roof? It's very hard to find a hole caused by a branch since they hit, create the damage, then bounce or slide down the roof.

Was this new construction or where the shingles installed over existing shingles? existing paper? When the roof was installed, was the existing roof completely removed and the decking inspected? I'm in attics all the time and it's shocking to see what the decking is like in some homes. In places, there is no decking and the shingles are nailed to the felt paper with nothing else holding them in place!!!!

Leaks in roofs are most common around vents or other things going through the roof. Reusing old vents, or not sealing around them happens all the time. Skylights are horrible in so many ways, especially for leaking!!!!

How where the valleys done? Did they use metal flashing? Grace weathershield? Or just overlapped felt paper?

Leaves building up in a valley will lead to leaks in the valley. Same thing with leaves in the gutters. Water overflows the gutters and then gets into the soffits. Sometimes the water travels quite a distance before you see it. In fact, most leaks that you see in the house are not under where the actual leak i n the roof.

Pictures of the shingles would really help.

Thanks for the reply Eddie. I have not contacted the manufacturer, it is GAF. There are trees nearby but none overhanging the roof. This was new construction, I used ice and water shield up 6 ft. felt, then shingles. A full ridge vent and eave vents, which I know are not plugged as I used baffles and blew in the insulation myself. There is only one valley, it has aluminum flashing, 90 lb. roll roofing, and the shingles were "basket weaved". No leaves in the valley, and no gutters, no leaks anywhere near the valley. Billrog: When I ran into a situation where there would be an unacceptable side lap, I would cut the previous shingle back [ before I nailed it to the roof] so that side lap would be sufficient. Square 1: Can you tell me more about the lawsuit? This is the third house I've built,and many reroofs for other people. I have been in construction most of my life. I didn't cut any corners. I thought I was buying top of the line shingles and disappointed. I am seriously considering going with steel as more and more homes in the area are using steel. These Mich. winters are brutal. My brother in law builds pole barns and knows his way around steel roofs, so I will probably go that way. Thanks for all your help guys, Bill

 

[dodge man]

This is my understanding in talking to various contractors. They had a few years of bad shingles about the same vintage yours were installed. I had a garage built, about 1998 as I recall. The houses on the house were probably 7 years older. The shingles on the garage failed much sooner, they lasted about 12 years. As mentioned above, enough roof vents is important. I probably had enough vents, but not enough to meet the warrant requirements. Like so many warranties, its really often tough to collect.

 

[Grateful11]

I'm old enough to remember when a bundle of shingles were about 50% thicker than they are now. They don't make them like they used to. We put Timberline on both houses here on the farm about 3 years ago, one has a 12/12 pitch, the other a 4/12 so if I live long enough I'll see which one last longer.

 

[Grateful11]

There is a class action lawsuit

I just got a "malicious attack warning" on that site, be careful. Chrome would not open it without me allowing it, I declined.