IF You are a Tractor Operator in your ROOKIE Season.

[AxleHub]

Another recent experience. You're going down an incline with something rather substatial in the frl bucket or forks. You're trying to feather the up/down on the fel so you keep it relatvely clear of hitting the ground as you get close to bottom and you notice you're getting closer to ground than you want so you pull back more on the joystick. Time right then for a reality check . . Because you're going slow you're not noticing the ground was getting cliser to the fel load because . . Your rear wheels are lifting.

The wirst thing to do is . . . Pull back on joy stick . . .you want to recognise you didn't misjudge the distance . . but the rears lifted ever so slowly so jam the joystick forward to stabilize the tractor.

It was so skow developing you don't feel the movement but you see the ground. Its a whole lot safer keeping the load lower to reduce the tip. And by the way . . Don't brake because that exagerates the tip . . Just let off the hydro pedal and push that joystick forward.

It can happen so easy and you are ALMOST at the bottom. Its when you wish you had put more rear ballast on lol . . But not so funny if you don't react quickly.

Hill Street Blue used to gave the ""watch start meeting" in every episode and the tall older sergeant always used to end each update session with "and hey. . Let's be careful out there".

 

[BigBoyToys]

This is my Rookie Season. I just picked up a B3030 and starting out easy with it. I'm digging a monolithic slab for a new storage building. Ground is flat and fairly easy digging. Before starting I go through a mental safety check making sure things are set properly and nothing is in the way. Tractors are certainly fun but can be dangerous.

 

[paulfun9]

Another recent experience. You're going down an incline with something rather substatial in the frl bucket or forks. You're trying to feather the up/down on the fel so you keep it relatvely clear of hitting the ground as you get close to bottom and you notice you're getting closer to ground than you want so you pull back more on the joystick. Time right then for a reality check . . Because you're going slow you're not noticing the ground was getting cliser to the fel load because . . Your rear wheels are lifting.

The wirst thing to do is . . . Pull back on joy stick . . .you want to recognise you didn't misjudge the distance . . but the rears lifted ever so slowly so jam the joystick forward to stabilize the tractor.

It was so skow developing you don't feel the movement but you see the ground. Its a whole lot safer keeping the load lower to reduce the tip. And by the way . . Don't brake because that exagerates the tip . . Just let off the hydro pedal and push that joystick forward.

It can happen so easy and you are ALMOST at the bottom. Its when you wish you had put more rear ballast on lol . . But not so funny if you don't react quickly.

Hill Street Blue used to gave the ""watch start meeting" in every episode and the tall older sergeant always used to end each update session with "and hey. . Let's be careful out there".

AVOID this entire scenario by simply baking down the hill as proper technique that is clearly written in most manuals!

 

[AxleHub]

AVOID this entire scenario by simply baking down the hill as proper technique that is clearly written in most manuals!

You'd need to do some explaining for me to understand this idea. . It would seem that backing down I could be in a siilar situation but with even less control and worse safety options ????

 

[dieselcrawler]

Heavy loaded bucket is uphill if you back down, which alters the center of gravity. How much ballast you have on the rear makes a big difference also. If no ballast, rear tires lift more easily than say, with a large brush hog hanging 6' out the back.

 

[Baby Grand]

Axle...good thread...many things worth remembering. Basically, when I realize I'm in a hurry, I try to hit half speed...impatience leads to problems with heavy equipment.

Good point and one that I've had to learn the hard way.

Along the same lines: focus on the job and control who has access to the job site.
Nothing worse that being distracted by someone who just has to talk to you while you're doing something that really requires your full attention. Same goes for talking on the phone while operating equipment. I turn my cell phone off until I can take a break in the action.

 

[k0ua]

You'd need to do some explaining for me to understand this idea. . It would seem that backing down I could be in a siilar situation but with even less control and worse safety options ????

No, he was correct. Backing down will totally eliminate the light rear end and loss of control scenario that most of us that have been operating for a long time have experienced.

Do this thought experiment: Forget about the load in the bucket, Just imagine a steep incline, now go down that incline forwards, Where is the weight transfer? A large portion of the tractors weight is transferred to the front wheels by virtue of the incline. Now back down that same incline. Now much of the weight of the tractor is transferred to the rear wheels because of the incline angle. In this case a percentage of the weight is still transferred to the lower set of wheels, but in going down backward it is the rear wheels that are lower. So far so good?

Now put that heavy load in the bucket, and go down forward, now not only do you have the weight transfer of the weight of the tractor making the rear wheels lighter and the front end heavier, but you also have that load prying up the rears by using the front wheel pivot point as a fulcrum.

But go down backward, and now the weight transfer helps the lower wheels in this case the rear set, to be heavier, but of course the load is still prying down using the front axle as a fulcrum but even some of its weight is transferred to the lower rears. You can use some of your vector calculations from high school to figure out how much. Of course the front wheels are never going to get light enough to cause a loss of steering with that big load sticking out in front of them. But the rears are going to be heavier than going down forwards, and your overall stability will be better.. Really...

 

[AxleHub]

No, he was correct. Backing down will totally eliminate the light rear end and loss of control scenario that most of us that have been operating for a long time have experienced.

Do this thought experiment: Forget about the load in the bucket, Just imagine a steep incline, now go down that incline forwards, Where is the weight transfer? A large portion of the tractors weight is transferred to the front wheels by virtue of the incline. Now back down that same incline. Now much of the weight of the tractor is transferred to the rear wheels because of the incline angle. In this case a percentage of the weight is still transferred to the lower set of wheels, but in going down backward it is the rear wheels that are lower. So far so good?

Now put that heavy load in the bucket, and go down forward, now not only do you have the weight transfer of the weight of the tractor making the rear wheels lighter and the front end heavier, but you also have that load prying up the rears by using the front wheel pivot point as a fulcrum.

But go down backward, and now the weight transfer helps the lower wheels in this case the rear set, to be heavier, but of course the load is still prying down using the front axle as a fulcrum but even some of its weight is transferred to the lower rears. You can use some of your vector calculations from high school to figure out how much. Of course the front wheels are never going to get light enough to cause a loss of steering with that big load sticking out in front of them. But the rears are going to be heavier than going down forwards, and your overall stability will be better.. Really...

I see three issues with this concept that would make me nervous. I understand the weight tranfer isdue, however:..

1. With the pallet load or bucket load in the front moving scenario . . I understand that I can use that fel load to push down on the ground to make a "front outrigger" effect that I can't do if I'm backing down. As long as I'm not going fast I can force a slowing down and stability braking even on wet grass. (Going fast of course would create a potential slingshot turn over). When backing down I'm forced to have my load much higher because of the land position and angle. And a much higher load seems to expose the issue of negative leverage issues.

2. If I'm backing down an incline with a heavy load . . if I start to break loose . . the load becomes like a heavy semi trailer that wants to jack knife around the tractor . . And it could cause a spin that then becomes a sideways turn over.

3. If there is something at the bottom of the hill and I'd break loose . . Going down forward gives me some bumper protection that I would not have going backwards. Going forward also allows my seat belt to be a benefit where backing down my seat belt is not my friend.

Now in all my 3 concerns shown speed is my enemy and if I break loose I'd think I want to have backup methods to quickly and safely reduce speed without spin. I see where backing down might reduce the chances of breaking loose . . but once that happens . . I see no methods of backup.

Can you show me where I'm in error ? Thanks.

 

[check]

No, he was correct. Backing down will totally eliminate the light rear end and loss of control scenario that most of us that have been operating for a long time have experienced. Do this thought experiment: Forget about the load in the bucket, Just imagine a steep incline, now go down that incline forwards, Where is the weight transfer? A large portion of the tractors weight is transferred to the front wheels by virtue of the incline. Now back down that same incline. Now much of the weight of the tractor is transferred to the rear wheels because of the incline angle. In this case a percentage of the weight is still transferred to the lower set of wheels, but in going down backward it is the rear wheels that are lower. So far so good? Now put that heavy load in the bucket, and go down forward, now not only do you have the weight transfer of the weight of the tractor making the rear wheels lighter and the front end heavier, but you also have that load prying up the rears by using the front wheel pivot point as a fulcrum. But go down backward, and now the weight transfer helps the lower wheels in this case the rear set, to be heavier, but of course the load is still prying down using the front axle as a fulcrum but even some of its weight is transferred to the lower rears. You can use some of your vector calculations from high school to figure out how much. Of course the front wheels are never going to get light enough to cause a loss of steering with that big load sticking out in front of them. But the rears are going to be heavier than going down forwards, and your overall stability will be better.. Really...

I always have either the backhoe, the snowblower, or the box scraper on, so my tractor is almost always balanced. In fact, I would not be comfortable doing any front end loader work without one of these implements on the rear of my BX 25.

And let's not forget to mention that you should always be in four-wheel-drive when you are traveling downhill, so that you get full four-wheel breaking.

 

[k0ua]

The way I see it, you can still drop the FEL on the ground for a brake going backwards or forwards. While I have broke loose several times going forward, I have never broke loose going backwards. Some of your other points may have some merit, but I still think if you back down the hill, you are mitigating risk.