Any M1 Garand experts here?

[dusty3030]

Yeah, lots of strange bedfellows during the war. Singer Sewing machine made rifles; Goodyear made F4U Corsairs. I'm sure there are lots of other examples.

JUST WW2 Stuff I can think of -

1903 Sprinfields were still in service made by Springfield and Rock Island Arsenal (both these names have been borrowed by modern companies with Zero relation to the old US Govt. facilities)
1903A1 Remington - between the wars
1903A3 Springfields (really a neat rifle) were made by Smith Corona and Remington

1917 "Enfields) were made at Winchester, Remington and Eddystone

M1 Garands for WW2 were made by Springfield (gov't arsenal, not the modern company of similar name) and Winchester. Post war International Harvester and Harrington and Richardson

M1 Carbine- Inland Div of General Motors, Winchester, Rock Ola, Underwood, Saginaw Steering Gear, National Postal Meter, IBM, Quality Hardware, Underwood and Standard Products

M3 "Grease Gun" - Guide Lamp Division of General Motors

1911A1 - Colt, Ithaca, Remington Rand (typewriter company) , Union Switch and Signal and a very very few by Singer Sewing machine.
Earlier 1911's were made by Colt, Springfield, Remington Arms.

Thompson was made by Auto Ordnance, Colt, and Savage

It was definitely a group effort by American industry! When you get in to crew served weapons, tanks, vehicles, planes, ships etc. the list goes on and on and on.

 

[MossRoad]

Rock-Ola the juke box people made carbines. You could really rock and roll with those. Singer the sewing machine folks made 500 of the rarest 1911 .45 pistols. They go for many thousands of dollars now due to the fact only 500 were made. It is estimated that there are only 5000 to 10000 of them in circulation today.

Either I'm going nuts or there's a huge counterfeit market for those singer 1911's. There're some missing or extra zeros in those figures somewhere.

 

[k0ua]

Either I'm going nuts or there's a huge counterfeit market for those singer 1911's. There're some missing or extra zeros in those figures somewhere.

It is amazing what some "artisans" will do to make a few thousands of dollars. If someone at a gun show offers you a "genuine" Singer, best look carefully. Many of the 500 were actually issued to troops, and lost or destroyed in warfare. Not sure how many actual ones are in collectors hands, but it is not all that many.

 

[MossRoad]

If you look at the history of Singer, they made norden bomb sights and M1s in the U.S. for us and they made weapons for the Germans in their German factories.

On a side note about Singer, they had factories in New Jersey, South Bend, Indiana, and somewhere in Illinois. They had their own railroad, the NJI&I (New Jersey, Indiana and Illinois).
The roundhouse is still here in South Bend, as is 1/4 of the huge factory (now dilapidated and falling down). During WWII, the South Bend Singer plant (which made about 10,000 sewing machine cabinets PER DAY!) switched to making wooden airplane parts, ammunition crates, and wooden buoys for the military.

Singer was also responsible for deforesting most of north central Indiana for those sewing machine cabinets during the late 1800's to early 1900's. It was unsustainable consumption of hardwood. That's why there's very few, if any, virgin forests in this area. Almost every large forest you see here is less than 100 years old. Kind of amazing that it grows back so quickly.

Link goes to pictures of the roundhouse and whats left of the factory.
Singer Sewing Cabinets, South Bend, IN

 

[dmccarty]

It's one of those "proof by performance" matters. An enemy soldier was betting his life that he was facing a lone rifleman who could not have another clip in place before the sound of the ejected clip hitting the ground reached his ears. I invite anyone who believes that legend to simply try it.

Yeah, I think the ping issue is nonsense. I don't think it would be heard in decent sized firefight, and even if it was heard, it only takes a second or so to reload. By the time and enemy soldier heard the ping and moved they would be a good target for a loaded rifle.

The US Army was the first Army in the world to adopt a semiauto battle rifle in 1937. Most other organizations were concerned that soldiers would fire their basic load too quickly and ignored the firepower advantage.

Which is rather ironic since the USA did not want to go to magazine fed weapons in the late 1800s because they figured soldiers would fire too much ammo too quickly.

For example the USMC conducted service rifle trials in late 1940 and officially selected the M1903 Springfield. This decision resulted in logistical problems for the rest of the war when the USMC changed their minds after seeing Army units equipped with Garands in action on Quadalcanal.

When replacement Army units landed on Guadacanal and were fed piecemeal into the front lines, many a Marine took the unblooded solider's M1 and gave the solider their 1903. :shocked:

Later,
Dan

 

[MikePA]

Which is rather ironic since the USA did not want to go to magazine fed weapons in the late 1800s because they figured soldiers would fire too much ammo too quickly.

This same 'logic' was used by the Army to not adopt the Gatling gun until 1866, even though it was available during the Civil War and purchased by individual Union commanders. The same 'logic' applied to the Henry and its limited adoption during the Civil War.

 

[Garandman]

When replacement Army units landed on Guadacanal and were fed piecemeal into the front lines, many a Marine took the unblooded solider's M1 and gave the solider their 1903. :shocked:

Later,
Dan

Love to see the source of that information: sounds like typical USMC bluster.

I believe the Marine Raider Bns were the first ones to have Garands in their TO&E.

 

[bcp]

From about halfway down this page:
Marine Model M1941 Johnson Rifle - Armchair General and HistoryNet >> The Best Forums in History

" On August 7, 1942 the U.S. Marines land on Red Beach, Guadalcanal. They were primarily armed with Springfield rifles reportedly because of Marine Corps preference) with some M-l rifles sprinkled in as well. They also had a number of M-1941 rifles and light machine guns. Once the marines saw the advantages of the semi-automatic rifle, such as the M-1, they tried to obtain one by any means possible…. including midnight requisition.

In September, 1942 the Japanese attacked Henderson airfield and Johnson rifles and machine guns aided in providing firepower to repel the enemy.

In 1943, a Special Marine Corps Parachute Raider Battalion operated with three teams of three men per squad plus the squad leader. Each team was armed with one M-1941 Johnson LMG and two M-1941 Johnson semi-automatic rifles. It is presumed that the squad leader was armed with a weapon of his choice."

================================

From about halfway down this page:
http://m14forum.com/full-automatics/162359-rare-johnson-machine-gun-2.html


Caption:
Major H.L. Torgerson 1st Marine Corps Parachute Battalion. To his left is a Johnson Type R semiautomatic carbine,...

 

[dmccarty]

Love to see the source of that information: sounds like typical USMC bluster.

I believe the Marine Raider Bns were the first ones to have Garands in their TO&E.

Nope, read it in some of the accounts about Guadacanal. The first USA units that moved onto the island while there was heavy fighting underway and the army units were just fed into the lines along side the Marines. Most likely I read it in Lewis B Pullers biography, but it could have been Vandegrift's, and/or some of the many first person accounts I have read. The soldiers were put into the line at first and basically were attached to the Marine units. Some of the Marines just took the M1s from the soldiers. The situation was critical and it would have been stupid beyond belief to have tried to have done a relief movement by the USA of the USMC units. In the initial USA deployment I don't think they really had many units that could land. Every man who could fight was needed on the line in any case so the soldiers were initially just fed into the existing lines irregardless of service. Eventually, the rest of the USA units showed up and the regiment regrouped and started to take over from the Marines and the Marines thought highly of the unit. The Army units on Guadacanal got all of the glory, army wise that is, compared to the slaughter that happened at Buna. A battle nobody knows about because it was such a cluster due to MacArthur's usual antics. Buna was a far bloodier battle than Guadacanal but very, very few people have ever heard of it even though it was a critical battle.

Later,
Dan

 

[Threepoint]

How many would you like?

View attachment 432730

Wonder what year that ad is from. I see they wanted $15.95 for British Enfield .303s. Highway robbery. My dad bought two for me in 1963 from Hechingers Bldg Supply for $9.95 each. I sporterised one and kept the other in orig. condition.