WHY all this complexity?

[Utopia Texas]

Yes, And I have the option of taking the wood floor boards out and letting all the engine heat flow rearward in Winter. In Summer though with 100 degree heat and black seat covers it can get dicey.....

 

[Fordman1981]

last year a friend and his wife came over to show off his new Dodge Ram... 4-door, all souped up inside & out, with a short box. we went for a drive, the ladies in the back, when his wife says " honey, can you turn down the radio and turn up the heat " he darn near put us in the ditch! Everything is done through the touch screen, and you can't operate that without looking at it. Around here we have "distracted driver" laws, no texting, dialing, GPS programming, etc... only hands-free allowed. And then they allow these new vehicles with a complex menu system just to turn up the heater. Can't figure that out. Maybe next the auto makers need to put ALL functions on voice control, like turn up the heat, turn down the radio, turn on left turn-signal, slow down to 40mph, etc. :laughing: Pete

Just shows how little some people know. Rams have a big physical dial in the middle for radio volume. The heat or air temp have physical buttons as well. Yes you can do both via touch screen but ram did a good job having options to do it either way.

 

[ScottyChip]

Just shows how little some people know. Rams have a big physical dial in the middle for radio volume. The heat or air temp have physical buttons as well. Yes you can do both via touch screen but ram did a good job having options to do it either way.

Thanks Fordman, that was just what I was going to say, my new 2014 Dodge Journey with the 8.4" touch display also has the manual buttons for heat up/down, fan speed and radio volume. I am not a 20 or 30 something, but I am young or old enough which ever way you want to look at it to remember when computers were programmed with punch cards, then basic/fortran programming languages, then the 8088 basic PC's into the 286-386-486 etc to today and I agree it looks like Ram/Dodge/FCA has got it right with a nice mix. Lets hope us consumers can let every one else know that is what we are looking for.

 

[Garandman]

The 2 lever and 1 fan switch system I mentioned in my original post on my '85 Crown Victoria was simpler than the one your Express has and I preferred the controls in my Ford over the 3 knob system my Y2K GMC has.

All well and good but you said you'd not figured the system out in your 2008 truck?

 

[JDgreen227]

All well and good but you said you'd not figured the system out in your 2008 truck?

That was not my post....sorry that you thought it was.

 

[Diamondpilot]

Thanks Fordman, that was just what I was going to say, my new 2014 Dodge Journey with the 8.4" touch display also has the manual buttons for heat up/down, fan speed and radio volume. I am not a 20 or 30 something, but I am young or old enough which ever way you want to look at it to remember when computers were programmed with punch cards, then basic/fortran programming languages, then the 8088 basic PC's into the 286-386-486 etc to today and I agree it looks like Ram/Dodge/FCA has got it right with a nice mix. Lets hope us consumers can let every one else know that is what we are looking for.

Same with our 2012 and 2013 Fords.

I prefer the touch screen but there is two ways to do it if you desire.

Chris

Chris

 

[Industrial Toys]

As far as being supected of Trolling, I am not sure what that is about. Seems some people on forums are paranoid about trolls or something. They seem to see them everywhere!

My two new Dodge Dakotas and my 08 Sierra have precious little heat or air flow to the floor area! And I have no idea how the dual climate system works on the Sierra, nor do I want or need such crap. It just happened to come with the vehicle.

 

[JDgreen227]

As far as being supected of Trolling, I am not sure what that is about. Seems some people on forums are paranoid about trolls or something. They seem to see them everywhere!

My two new Dodge Dakotas and my 08 Sierra have precious little heat or air flow to the floor area! And I have no idea how the dual climate system works on the Sierra, nor do I want or need such crap. It just happened to come with the vehicle.

I done speak well for IT here, he ain't no troll and never has been. :laughing: Tell you guys something, lack of heat is getting to be a common gripe from owners of many newer vehicles today. My biased opinion is that because carmakers constantly keep reducing the size of the cooling system to save weight, less coolant and smaller radiators make it more difficult to get heat from a system. Remember when the average cooling system had a huge radiator and 18 quarts of coolant? Well, many of today's downsized systems barely have 8 quarts of coolant. Another issue is many cars today no longer have a radiator cap and it's next to impossible to bleed the air out of cooling system unless you know what you are doing. Had a lady friend visit us 2 weeks ago, her Pontiac Vibe was slow to heat because there was so much air in the system. Lotta causes for such a situation.

Don't pick on IT guy, I can vouch it's a LOT colder in Canada than where a lot of you yahoos live....:laughing:

 

[davrow]

Gotta put the techno-gadgets into historical perspective, too. Helps me cope, at least. Most youngsters today could not use a typewriter. That's okay, could you operate a type-setter? Do you know how to fence (sword, not chainlink)? What was 'necessary knowledge to get by' in any time period is totally irrelevant in the next.

I don't know any of the names for tack except halter. But I can operate a horseless carriage just fine.

 

[Garandman]

Gotta put the techno-gadgets into historical perspective, too. Helps me cope, at least. Most youngsters today could not use a typewriter.

Yeah, the country has been going downhill since the Army adopted the M1 Garand over the bolt-action M1903 Springfield in 1937.....

 

[txdon]

I can speak on the importance of GPS. I would rather people listen to a gps than have them searching for street signs not paying attention to the road ahead. How many of us have slammed on the brakes when the desired intersection caught us by surprise? GPS has probably saved some lives by alerting us which lanes we should be in and a good heads up of upcoming turns. Please don't be reading a map and drive.

3-16-2015
But a GPS also has a screen and can be just as distracting as a map.
Here a GPS cost a life:

"15-year-old Delia Ramirez was killed when the car she was a passenger in and a tractor-trailer collided at the intersection of Highway 130 and Parmer Lane. Police said that the vehicles collided when the tractor-trailer ran the red light at the intersection while the driver was looking down at his GPS."

Delia Ramirez Killed in Austin, TX Tractor-Trailer Accident | Wrongful Death News and Opinions

 

[Diamondpilot]

3-16-2015 But a GPS also has a screen and can be just as distracting as a map. Here a GPS cost a life: "15-year-old Delia Ramirez was killed when the car she was a passenger in and a tractor-trailer collided at the intersection of Highway 130 and Parmer Lane. Police said that the vehicles collided when the tractor-trailer ran the red light at the intersection while the driver was looking down at his GPS." Delia Ramirez Killed in Austin, TX Tractor-Trailer Accident | Wrongful Death News and Opinions

I guarantee you there were just as many deaths or more contributed to people looking down at a MAP.

Chris

 

[txdon]

I guarantee you there were just as many deaths or more contributed to people looking down at a MAP.

Chris

There are innumerable ways in which a driver can be inattentive.

looking at something or someone by the side of the road
looking at a map or a piece of paper
reading the newspaper or a book
changing the station on the radio
looking at a cell phone
texting
getting something out of the glove compartment
adjusting your seat
getting something out of your pocket
looking into the back seat or getting something out of the back seat
looking at your children to talk to them or reprimand them
eating or drinking while driving
putting on makeup, and
shaving

GPSs just adds to the list of distractions.

I can't find a specific case of a map causing an accident - they probably would not admit it anyway. I brought up the GPS because I just saw the fatality linked to the GPS on the news last week. I think they cause more accidents than maps now days because they sometimes confuse the driver. What the GPS says and what is visible does not alway match.
I gave easy directions to a twenty year old however he insisted on using his GPS. He put the correct address in his GPS and the GPS took him 50 miles out of his way and an hour late but he could not stop following the GPS even when I told him to turn it off and follow my directions.

 

[jejeosborne]

There are innumerable ways in which a driver can be inattentive.

looking at something or someone by the side of the road
looking at a map or a piece of paper
reading the newspaper or a book
changing the station on the radio
looking at a cell phone
texting
getting something out of the glove compartment
adjusting your seat
getting something out of your pocket
looking into the back seat or getting something out of the back seat
looking at your children to talk to them or reprimand them
eating or drinking while driving
putting on makeup, and
shaving

GPSs just adds to the list of distractions.

I can't find a specific case of a map causing an accident - they probably would not admit it anyway. I brought up the GPS because I just saw the fatality linked to the GPS on the news last week. I think they cause more accidents than maps now days because they sometimes confuse the driver. What the GPS says and what is visible does not alway match.
I gave easy directions to a twenty year old however he insisted on using his GPS. He put the correct address in his GPS and the GPS took him 50 miles out of his way and an hour late but he could not stop following the GPS even when I told him to turn it off and follow my directions.

You are complaining about gps taking you out of the way but I often remember my parents getting lost trying to follow a map. Spent hours on vacation stopping and asking for directions from locals. Gps has saved loads of fuel and made travel much more efficient.

I will challenge you on a scaveng has er hunt any day of the week, you use a map, and I'll use a gps. 99 times out of 100 I'll smoke you to the destination. I don't consider listening to my gps a distraction. I don't have to look for street signs, well alerted of upcoming turns, tells me which lane I need to be in, reroutes me around traffic and accidents, etc. As said, trying to read a map opened across your lap while driving would be more dangerous.

 

[thirdroc17]

Most of that electronic crap is there because it's high profit for the corporate CEO, and the American consumer no longer thinks for themselves. The ads say they "need" this crap, so they think they "need" this crap. Thus, corporate gets rich and the consumer goes on being gloriously ignorant sheep.

Unfortunately, this is the trend. Don't learn how to actually drive or park your car, let some electronic wizardry do it for you.

If you haven't guess by now, I hate that crap too. We have two vehicles that sit for most of the winter. One is old, I have to do nothing with it. The other is not so old, after the electronic crap drained the battery, it froze and broke last year, so I bought and run a float charger on it all this past winter. The battery was still dead this spring, the electronic crap drain was more than the charger could overcome, but at least it didn't freeze. So the procedure next year will be, continue to do nothing special with the older vehicle, the newer one, remove the battery and run float charger all winter, in spring, reinstall battery, go through the 5 minute procedure of convincing the computer it's ok to start the engine again because the battery was removed. PITA!!!

New and improved my butt. New, more complicated, and doesn't work as well is more like it, but highly profitable for big auto.


As for GPS, where is your sense of adventure? I've found more new things but taking the road less traveled, than I've went directly to. Look outside of the box.

 

[3930dave]

Read the EULA that comes with a stand-alone GPS.

They basically tell you to always have hardcopy maps available as a backup. Not necessarily a big deal if you are driving, but can be a big deal if you are on a boat, for one.

For better or worse, many people now have a Pavlovian response to what a screen tells them to do.

Rgds, D.

 

[txdon]

You are complaining about gps taking you out of the way . . .

No I am not. They take others out of the way. Out here in rural Texas there are streets with the same name and same zip code/town. Unless you know which county the address is in you are out of luck. The GPS does not always give a choice. I agree with you that listening to a GPS is less distracting than viewing it and it makes travel more efficient - but - it is still a distraction. The Ramirez family will attest to that.

I have listed a specific GPS distracted driver that caused a fatality. Can you list a specific one from map reading?

 

[Diamondpilot]

Read the EULA that comes with a stand-alone GPS. They basically tell you to always have hardcopy maps available as a backup. Not necessarily a big deal if you are driving, but can be a big deal if you are on a boat, for one. For better or worse, many people now have a Pavlovian response to what a screen tells them to do. Rgds, D.

I have not carried a hard copy of a map in a airplane in almost 10 years. I took 108# of charts off when the IPad became legal to use for navigation by the FAA.


The situational awareness increased 10 fold in the cockpit with real time portion overlaying charts both in the air and on the ground.


As for driving with a GPS vs a Map. I am a back roads guy. I programmed my GPS to take me the shortest distance, not shortest time. I found more neat new things this way. Last summer I drove from Cleveland to Indianapolis and was only on a main road or county highway for maybe 20 miles. The rest was all back roads, farm roads, ect.


Chris

 

[JDgreen227]

Read the EULA that comes with a stand-alone GPS.

They basically tell you to always have hardcopy maps available as a backup. Not necessarily a big deal if you are driving, but can be a big deal if you are on a boat, for one.

For better or worse, many people now have a Pavlovian response to what a screen tells them to do.

Rgds, D.

You must have something right there, my screen is telling me to respond to your post.....:laughing:

 

[Copperhead]

I drive commercially and go into many areas that I am not familiar with. I use a dash installed GPS, Google maps on my iPhone and laptop, and a Rand McNally commercial laminated atlas. I rarely have any issue going to any location I need to. The dash installed unit accounts for my vehicle size and regulatory restrictions, the iPhone keeps me up on traffic along the route, highway conditions, construction areas, detours, etc, and I compare any routes with what the atlas shows. I love all this technology. I just know its limitations and account for that. But, i probably will never use the navigation stuff included in the dash on my new 2015 2500HD. Most likely will just use the iPhone and atlas for any routes with the pickup.