Tractor News Kubota - Made in the USA

   / Kubota - Made in the USA #41  
FWIW, our daughter-in-law works for a supplier to Honda, in Columbus, Ohio. From what I hear, they are all about quality and consistency, and the Honda autos that are produced are equal to any produced in Japan. I remember buying an American made Toyota some years ago, and was surprised to learn that the USA Camrys had a lower defect rate than those produced in Japan. No reason we can't build stuff as well as anywhere, given the right designs and materials. Consider that our California-based Haas cnc machining centers are world class.
 
   / Kubota - Made in the USA #42  
Building Kubota's here might not be a good idea. For me the reason to have the Kubota is because it's built in Japan under a Dr. Deming style of management, by Japanese workers. It would be a less desirable machine to me if it's made by some baggy pant, hat on sideways, crouch grabbing, listening to rap on the line guy, while he puts pistons into my block. No thanks. HS


Just a few stereotypes here ...

If only the world were so simple!
 
   / Kubota - Made in the USA #43  
Just a few stereotypes here ... If only the world were so simple!
. Yeah, seen the American assembly crews on the news in Ferguson, no thanks. Not a few stereotypes, just who lives there. HS.
 
   / Kubota - Made in the USA #44  
. Yeah, seen the American assembly crews on the news in Ferguson, no thanks. Not a few stereotypes, just who lives there. HS.

Your tax dollars "hard at work", so others don't have to. Good example of 3rd of 4th generation welfare.

bumper
 
   / Kubota - Made in the USA #45  
We have two Honda Accord's at work that are over 70% North American content. We purchased two Chevrolet Cruze turbodiesels and the percentage is actually lower, because the engine is made in Germany and the transmission in Japan.

Then there is the Subaru Outback we own. It was made in Indiana but the engine and transmission are from Japan. At the time, GM owned 25% of Subaru. Then in the financial crisis GM sold their stake in Subaru and a number of other foreign manufacturers. So was the Subaru more American when GM owned a chunk of them, and did the Subaru become less American when GM sold out?

Almost any equipment today anywhere in the world will say, "Assembled in ___________, from globally-sourced parts."
 
   / Kubota - Made in the USA #46  
Garandman,

Yup, I agree that's the case, parts and complete assemblies are globally sourced. The issue is, the US has allowed the outsourcing to go much too far. If we haven't already reached the tipping point, I'd be surprised. Our steel industry is decimated, most of our manufacturing base is gone in a very many areas, you have only to look at the shelves in most any hard goods store, most everything made in China.

This transition is not entirely the fault of US companies, part of the blame goes to unions, worker's standard of living expectations, EPA, Fed and state tax laws, and local rules, in short everything that came together to make it much more expensive to do business and make consumable goods here at home, and far less expensive to import. Over the past several years, China has been buying up us companies to obtain even more technology. Some of these companies will operate here providing jobs for now, some not, but corporate profits will, for the most part, still go back to China.

Many years ago, I heard that the US economy would become all about "information" and "service". Unfortunately, that leaves behind a large segment of our society that is ill equipped to find gainful employment in those sectors. Flipping burgers doesn't support a family and without aptitude, intelligence, and educaton, good luck getting a high tech job. Most of the unemployed and minimum wage earners are currently on handouts of one kind or another, and as you know, about 50% of the population gets government subsidies of one type or another and pays no Federal taxes. How long can this continue?

I own a small service sector company of about 20 employees. All the parts we use were once made in the US, now they designed here and made overseas or in Mexico. We have no equipment sourcing alternatives to "buy American" to help change this.

I personally believe that many US companies are acting like the bears in my back yard. They tear off the branches of our young apple trees to get at the ripe fruit now, not considering that the trees they destroy, to get the high fruit now, will not bare fruit in future years (actually I'm protecting the trees now with an electric fence after picking up a lot of torn down limbs). As a country, we are being short sighted in the manner we obtain consumables. With NAFTA and few trade barriers, we are picking low hanging fruit with cheaper prices from China, but we do so at our own peril in the long term. Just as our government cannot exercise the restraint to live within their means, the US consumer (on average), is not doing a whole lot better.

Yeah, I'm worried for my children and grand kids.

bumper
 
   / Kubota - Made in the USA #47  
I've never been a union member but have worked in union and non-union factories. If the union and management are adversarial, in general quality will decline. On the other hand in a non-union plant I have observed that during cutbacks during hard times people can be very sensitive to workers with a lot more experience being let go first, especially if the person is felt to be a good worker but doesn't always agree with the boss. Of course on the management side I have always had to contend with that, and in one plant it resulted in a vote to unionize all but the upper management at the time because the people felt they were being treated unfairly. This plant had recently had several key positions, including the top dog, filled with ex-Chrysler Corporation employees. The first thing the new manager had done was completely soundproof his office, and had a door closer added that was controlled by a switch under his desk. When he wanted to rake someone over the coals, he would call them into his office. When the door slammed behind them they knew they were in for a scream session. Quality sucked. By the way the special soundproof screaming office was mentioned to me to be part of the Lee Iacocca school of management.

My experience from the 1990's on was the non-union plants tended to pay more because they did not want a union in place. I am talking about skilled assembly labor. If the people are treated with respect and compensated fairly, they have no reason to unionize.

Buying a car listed as having 70% USA or North American content can be misleading. My last factory had an accountant who determined the foreign and domestic content. Say, for example, a final drive was procured from a supplier who assembled in Ohio. It would be listed as $xxx North American. The gears might have come from Italy, a very common gear source. The castings might have come from India, a very common casting source. Bearings may have been sourced from China, now one of the top bearing producers (they make super quality as well as super poor quality - you need to know what you are buying, not let the country name dictate). The final drive may be sourced worldwide but to the buyer it is sourced from North America.

For a short time I worked for a large US company that was so focused on cost that every week we engineering group managers had to meet with a group of executive vice-presidents and explain every engineering change that increased cost - even if the change was less than a penny. For example if an engineer made a mistake and specified a 1" bolt instead of the required 1 1/4" length, the change could not be implemented until a senior VP signed off. We were actually known to use our own pocket money to have someone run down to our hardware supplier and buy the proper bolts to keep the line running until a senior VP would sign off, after taking a tongue lashing of course. That's America. And people wonder why GM put out ignition switches that would have cost so little to function per customer common use (key chain with extra crap on it). The company to which I was referring is now owned by a large European corporation and friends with whom I keep in touch say things are quite different.
 
   / Kubota - Made in the USA #48  
Very true... rightly or wrongly, I've been known to pay for something needed and hope management agrees to reimburse.

Actually, for the first 20 years under the same CEO it was really appreciated as in going above and beyond.

The most recent CEO is only about stakeholder equity and even the the Landscape drip watering system had to be turned down until his wife visited and told him the landscaping was dieing...

I guess even CEO's sometimes have people they listen to... too bad more often than not... it is not the ones that have spent a career making the business viable...

Offshoring product is a real problem in that items become obsolete much quicker... we had old time American made hospital devices where I could call the factory and actually source parts for items decades old... good luck with that today... lucky if you squeak by with 10 years and that is buying at rollout.

Real shame to see 30k OR tables that are 10 years old with no support... of course the company has probably merged and been sold several times during that 10 years.

For 10 days I've been trying to get a quote on new Anesthesia Machines... maybe 35k each... have not had a single response from voice mails or e-mails to GE... crazy.

Just for kicks I will mention a friend that commented on my Kubota BX and asking why I didn't buy American John Deere...

Had to explain that my BX was more American than the comparable Deere.
 
   / Kubota - Made in the USA #49  
MHarryE,

Very telling. I know there are managers like that. I would never condone yelling at employees, or being disrespectful of them. Also, dignity being important, I never "ordered" an employee to do something, always asked them. (However, I'm quite sure they knew what my request meant :c). I once asked an installer to do something and he demurred, I told him that no was not an option and he repeated his objection. That was his last day at work. Always hated firing anyone, and was introspective trying to determine if there might have been things we could have done to prevent whatever issue from reaching that point - - seldom possible though.

We paid 100% of the employee's health care starting in '84, 75% kids and 50% spouse. Unfortunately, those percentages have dropped due to exploding health care costs. I'm sure we'll have to cancel the plans and dump everyone on the exchanges (if ObamaDon'tCare isn't repealed).

It's doubtless much harder to successfully start a small company now than back in '78 - - I continued on with the police dept for 2 more years back then, so we could pay the bills, not sure how we pulled it off, oh, I remember, long days and no vacations for 5 years. Kids run the company now as I'm trying to stay retired.

If a person is willing to work hard, and quit blaming stuff on everyone else, there's still lots of opportunity in this country. I remain optimistic that if we can get gumnt turned around, the American people and spirit are up to it.
 
   / Kubota - Made in the USA #51  
When we purchase something today we do not know where all the parts of the product were made. So instead of saying, "Made In The USA", product today should say, "Assembled In The USA".

U.S. content must be disclosed on automobiles and textile, wool, and fur products. There's no law that requires most other products sold in the U.S. to be marked or labeled Made in USA or have any other disclosure about their amount of U.S. content. Complying with the Made in USA Standard | BCP Business Center

It would be interesting to see "Tractors" included in the "Must Disclose" category.
 
   / Kubota - Made in the USA #52  
The focus on unions in these threads is curious. Unions only represent about 9% of the labor force. And companies off shoring production had little to do with unions, products got outsourced whether it was a union company or not. When labor costs are asymmetric as they have been, with labor costs pennies per hour in Asia, and maybe 3 dollars in Mexico, jobs are gonna go where they are cheapest.
 
   / Kubota - Made in the USA #53  
Having worked both Union and Non Union... I can see pluses on both sides.

The biggest Union Plus for me is knowing what is expected and knowing what to expect.

The Union Shop was a small Tool and Machine company... the boss was very generous on letting the Journeyman use the shop on Saturday mornings... some great projects came together.... Even after I had not worked there my toolbox was still there and I was able to fab little parts for the Hospital... always asked what I owed and whatever it was went into the shop Christmas party kitty...

The biggest surprise working in a Non Union Hospital Facility is the continual reduction in benefits... management just decides no more 401k or a use it or loose it PTO policy and that's the way it is.

Union Shops were once the rule in the SF Bay Area... very little left at all.

I will always consider Made In USA when spending...
 
   / Kubota - Made in the USA #54  
Great topic, and one that certainly brings forth opinions! Not sure about unions driving manufacturing off shore- my understanding of Germany is that their trade balance is positive (for them) and they are much more unionized than we ever were... and their health care system, like about all of the rest of the industrialized world, is what we should hope to have here, but don't. While its true that universal, government health care can have waiting lists, lack of service and so forth, like in the UK, what isn't being said is that they also have to opportunity to purchase private insurance and care... but even those barely getting by have basic care, unlike here, where the ER's provide way too much care, super inefficiently and at great, unnecessary expense. Take away union's power, and the vacuum is filled by greedy CEO's, the 1 percenters, and the burgeoning wealth at the top, while the once middle class disappears. Better quit before I get into more trouble!
 
   / Kubota - Made in the USA #55  
I don't know...

My county has Alameda Alliance that provides Health insurance for those of little means...

My European friends marvel at children from very low income families living on Section 8 getting a million dollars worth of surgeries at no cost for a heart defect at the nation's top hospitals... these are Doctors and nurses in from Germany, Austria and the UK...

One of the women I work with is a UK trained eye Doctor and she simply says the system is different... in the UK, many shun the basic universal coverage and pay extra to see their own doctors or simply pay out of pocket... whereas it is true a person needing glasses will eventually get them... it can take months or longer.

Another difference is much of the coverage is biased towards those that are young through their working years and is sharply curtailed for the elderly.

By that as it may... we now have the affordable Healthcare Act which means everyone will be covered under penalty with a sliding premium scale based on income...
 
   / Kubota - Made in the USA #56  
No one's said a word about (dumping) and what it has done to the US manufacturing base over the last 30 to 40 years. People can talk about how workers dress and look, but whats that have to do with people buying anything but american over the last 30 to 40 years, to the point that america doesn't have a manufacturing base anymore? When things were made here people said the japanese make the best so the company's went off shore, now its why doesn't the US make anything here. Everyone that bought japanese in the days when it was (The thing to do) are the ones that help put the US in the spot it's in now. I'm sure our grandkids will be better off now that they won't have to have the jobs that where thrown away in the last 4 decades, jobs that paid high taxes that paid for our infrastructure, armed forces, and all the other things taxes pay for. Think about it.
 
   / Kubota - Made in the USA #57  
^^^ And look how Japan has fared... don't here so much about them these days.
 
   / Kubota - Made in the USA #58  
^^^ And look how Japan has fared... don't here so much about them these days.


Their labor force said no more slave wages so the work went to Korea, China. The big companies don't care who gets the low wages, But we still have a broken manufacturing base here in the US. I don't care if Japan falls off the face on the world, I care about my country and the future of my grandkids.
 
   / Kubota - Made in the USA #59  
Quality - auto buyers haven't gone foreign because of price. The owners talk about the quality, reliability. During the 1980's the company at which I worked went all out to duplicate the Japanese quality method, championed after WWII by American Edwards Deming. I ended up taking more Deming lecture series (videos shown in our cafeteria every noon for daily refresher). Using the methods we realized how bad our quality really was. Our machinists (this was a union shop) went far beyond expectations to produce outstanding parts once they learned, and suppliers who wouldn't change were replaced. Quality shot upward and the pieces of bankrupt Allis-Chalmers are now alive in AGCO. I wouldn't know if the same processes are in place because I left for more money - I can be bought.

Health care - say what you want but I spent 3 years living in France and our medical needs were taken care of immediately and for no cost. Later I injured myself in Norway guiding a final drive into place. I gritted my way through it not wanting to visit a doctor in a country where I was an engineering observer and possibly not supposed to be working so I waited until I returned to the US and saw the workman's comp doctor. After analyzing my MRI he declared me a fool for not immediately going to a Norwegian hospital where the care exceeds anything they could do for me in the US, and at no cost because I was legally in Norway. As it is I lost the use of 25% of my left arm the doc said could have been repaired over there immediately.

Obamacare increasing costs? During the time between 2000 and when I took early retirement in 2009 the portion I paid for insurance jumped every year, by as much as 40%, benefits were reduced! co pays were increased. They stabilized at the 2008 rate until I reached Medicare age. Funny thing how so many people around me struggle with hip and knee pain until they reach Medicare and then visit regularly until their problem joints are replaced. I don't know if you would really call Medicare socialized medicine since I paid premiums for 44 years. Still it is listed as an entitlement. Entitled? Darn right! I worked my butt off for those 44 years.
 

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