Comparison Yanmar lawsuit.

[js5020]

This is only my opinion,,, Any refurb yanmars you see for sale ( from now on) will be from Fredricks or a Fredricks dealer. You will probably see some of the used (VN refurbs )ones for sale from time to time. As far as the dealers that sold VN refurbs, I believe they are all gone

Well from what Ive read losing the VN "refirbs" will be a good thing. I guess we will just have to wait a bit and see what developes and if this avenue can make a comeback. Hopefully they can keep pricing in line with value.

 

[kenmac]

Well from what Ive read losing the VN "refirbs" will be a good thing.

I don't have a problem with it. I know when I was in the 1st stages looking at a Yanmar. I looked at the same tractor(3110D) at a VN refurb dealer...It was the same price as I paid for the Fredricks tractor. I think as the new tractor prices rise because of the new tier4 EPA engines. A refurb yanmar should still remain a good value

 

[DavesTractor]

The grey market thing, even if the market was absent any interference from Kubota or Yanmar, was on a downward trend for a while. When newcomers to the market (and I use that term with no disparaging intentions) started competing with the JD and Kubota brands, it gave us a lot of good options on new tractors. I think it caused JD and Kubota to keep some economy type tractors in their lineup. Mahindra, Kioti, LS, Branson, TYM, helped even the JD and Kubota buyers by trying to keep a lid on price increases. At the same time, the dollar exchange to the Yen became very unfavorable. A tractor that did cost an importer $4000 was suddenly $5500, or even more. Add a loader to a $5500 20 year old Yanmar, do a service and fix everything, add a ROPS, perhaps replace some tires and there is not much margin for the dealer to sell this for under $9k. Enter a new Mahindra/LS or whatever with a good warranty, good parts availability and power-steering, R4 tires, ROPS, and so on for $11-12k ish (at the time, a little higher now) for the 20-24HP units, and it was a perfect storm that I think made the grey markets not really such a good deal. Save $3k, get a 20 year old tractor, often without PS and with rice tires? And financing isn't always so attractive either on greys. There are of course examples where the greys are a good deal. I am just generalizing.

I think Yanmars are great tractors by the way. I recently bought a mini-excavator, a track loader and a couple of new forklifts for the business and all have Yanmar engines and they really are hard to beat.

The dollar-yen exchange is a little better now and Fredericks may be able to buy in large enough volume that he can make these a good deal. I wish him well.

 

[js5020]

The grey market thing, even if the market was absent any interference from Kubota or Yanmar, was on a downward trend for a while. When newcomers to the market (and I use that term with no disparaging intentions) started competing with the JD and Kubota brands, it gave us a lot of good options on new tractors. I think it caused JD and Kubota to keep some economy type tractors in their lineup. Mahindra, Kioti, LS, Branson, TYM, helped even the JD and Kubota buyers by trying to keep a lid on price increases. At the same time, the dollar exchange to the Yen became very unfavorable. A tractor that did cost an importer $4000 was suddenly $5500, or even more. Add a loader to a $5500 20 year old Yanmar, do a service and fix everything, add a ROPS, perhaps replace some tires and there is not much margin for the dealer to sell this for under $9k. Enter a new Mahindra/LS or whatever with a good warranty, good parts availability and power-steering, R4 tires, ROPS, and so on for $11-12k ish (at the time, a little higher now) for the 20-24HP units, and it was a perfect storm that I think made the grey markets not really such a good deal. Save $3k, get a 20 year old tractor, often without PS and with rice tires? And financing isn't always so attractive either on greys. There are of course examples where the greys are a good deal. I am just generalizing.

I think Yanmars are great tractors by the way. I recently bought a mini-excavator, a track loader and a couple of new forklifts for the business and all have Yanmar engines and they really are hard to beat.

The dollar-yen exchange is a little better now and Fredericks may be able to buy in large enough volume that he can make these a good deal. I wish him well.

I think your generalization is/was spot on, or atleast thats pretty much how I perceived it when I was looking semi seriously a bit back, I dont think many (including myself) are going to "buy in" just to save 2 or 3 K over new but then I suppose getting much less for a used gray machine leaves the reputable retailer with little or nothing for his efforts and we all have to eat.

 

[California]

... my opinion,,, Any refurb yanmars you see for sale ( from now on) will be from Fredricks or a Fredricks dealer.

I think you're right. And it looks like only Fredricks can list on Ebay. I just posted the following in another thread but I think it should be noted here in this 'lawsuit' thread:

Apparently Yanmar is still filing Ebay VERO takedown notices which make a copyright-infringing auction disappear.

Two Yanmar auctions I had in my Ebay 'watch list' disappeared. This is in contrast to the 'auction ended' banner on an expired (or sold) listing.

In both of the disappeared auctions the grey-market model number was in the auction title. But an auction for a 2210BD wasn't affected, apparently because its model is named only within the detailed description.

Fredricks' auction for a YM1610D remains listed. And as always, auctions for US-model Yanmars are allowed.

 

[kenmac]

I think you're right. And it looks like only Fredricks can list on Ebay. I just posted the following in another thread but I think it should be noted here in this 'lawsuit' thread:

Apparently Yanmar is still filing Ebay VERO takedown notices which make a copyright-infringing auction disappear.

Two Yanmar auctions I had in my Ebay 'watch list' disappeared. This is in contrast to the 'auction ended' banner on an expired (or sold) listing.

In both of the disappeared auctions the grey-market model number was in the auction title. But an auction for a 2210BD wasn't affected, apparently because its model is named only within the detailed description.

Fredricks' auction for a YM1610D remains listed. And as always, auctions for US-model Yanmars are allowed.

Well, Does that mean that I can or cannot list my Fredricks tractor on E Bay ?

 

[Neat 1500]

Well, Does that mean that I can or cannot list my Fredricks tractor on E Bay ?

Good question, it makes me wonder how that affects other parts of the world like mine?

 

[Coldwater]

whats ebay???? we stop selling on there years a go. we now sell on graiglist for free. y pay ebay? now there a lot more parts for for all grays out there. not just yanmar

 

[kenmac]

Coldwater, did the yanmar Lawsuit affect you're selling / importing yanmar tractors ? Did yanmar come after you like he did the others ?

 

[Coldwater]

no they did not...no affect at all. selling are importing.....but i did not sell as a recanditionor. i am a as is from the farms tractors

 

[bruce60]

Thanks. Interesting.

 

[clemsonfor]

now your in the loop and up to snuff!!

 

[bmaverick]

Well, Does that mean that I can or cannot list my Fredricks tractor on E Bay ?

I would suppose to try the Fredricks on eBay. List the Yanmar with the Fredricks VIN plate. Maybe even have the title as Fredricks Yanmar YMxxxx. Look at the Fredricks ad and mimick since yours is a Fredricks unit.

 

[bmaverick]

... A tractor that did cost an importer $4000 was suddenly $5500, or even more. Add a loader to a $5500 20 year old Yanmar, do a service and fix everything, add a ROPS, perhaps replace some tires and there is not much margin for the dealer to sell this for under $9k. Enter a new Mahindra/LS or whatever with a good warranty, good parts availability and power-steering, R4 tires, ROPS, and so on for $11-12k ish (at the time, a little higher now) for the 20-24HP units, and it was a perfect storm that I think made the grey markets not really such a good deal. Save $3k, get a 20 year old tractor, often without PS and with rice tires? And financing isn't always so attractive either on greys. There are of course examples where the greys are a good deal. I am just generalizing.

The dollar-yen exchange is a little better now and Fredericks may be able to buy in large enough volume that he can make these a good deal. I wish him well.

As of today, comparing a YM2610 with a FEL listed by Fredricks is $11,694 to an LS G3033 at $36,899 is 1/3rd the cost. The Fredricks has a 1-yr warranty too. LS has 3-yr warranty. These two CUT tractors are very close in functions and Hp.
Yanmar Ym2610d, 4wd, Loader, 31hp, Decatur AL - 110840060 - EquipmentTraderOnline.com
http://lstractorusa.com/compact-tractors/g-series/g3033

A co-worker got the LS pricing from a local dealer in Nashville.

 

[DavesTractor]

As of today, comparing a YM2610 with a FEL listed by Fredricks is $11,694 to an LS G3033 at $36,899 is 1/3rd the cost. The Fredricks has a 1-yr warranty too. LS has 3-yr warranty. These two CUT tractors are very close in functions and Hp.
Yanmar Ym2610d, 4wd, Loader, 31hp, Decatur AL - 110840060 - EquipmentTraderOnline.com
http://lstractorusa.com/compact-tractors/g-series/g3033


A co-worker got the LS pricing from a local dealer in Nashville.

I bet this one is actually a YM2610D, which makes it a 4wd, and it is roughly 30 HP. These were built in 1980'ish, so 34-35 years old. Tom Frederick's does a nice job on reconditioning. $11,694 is his price. And it is properly done with a ROPS, etc.

There is no way a 3033 LS is $36k. They are less than half that amount. Let's say $17k for a good shopper, just guessing. Compare that to $11,694 on the Yanmar for a more fair comparison. Then consider that a new tractor generally offers a longer warranty and lower rate financing and your choice of R4 tires and we have narrowed the gap further. And the LS (or Mahindra, or Kioti or whatever) will have features like dual hydraulic pumps, built in over riding clutch, a network of dealers and so on. Once you calculate all of this, it's a pretty small gap between the Yanmar and a new tractor.

Having said that, Fredericks sells new tractors as well and a guy could look at both on his lot and considering the budget and requirements of the job, he could get what fits best. But don't for a minute think they are 1/3rd the cost. More like 70% of the cost of new. Not enough savings for me to buy a 3 decades old tractor....even a high quality Japanese unit like Yanmar. But others may see them as a good deal. What's the saying, "your mileage may vary".

 

[clemsonfor]

i too think $36k for a korean tractor of that size is a bit high. You can buy a kubota for that amout and still have some left over i would think?

 

[aczlan]

There is no way a 3033 LS is $36k. They are less than half that amount. Let's say $17k for a good shopper, just guessing. Compare that to $11,694 on the Yanmar for a more fair comparison. Then consider that a new tractor generally offers a longer warranty and lower rate financing and your choice of R4 tires and we have narrowed the gap further. And the LS (or Mahindra, or Kioti or whatever) will have features like dual hydraulic pumps, built in over riding clutch, a network of dealers and so on. Once you calculate all of this, it's a pretty small gap between the Yanmar and a new tractor.

kcflhrc had a quote of $16,300 for one with a FEL in Jan 2014: http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/...sons/300302-ls-g3033-ls-g3038-comparison.html

Aaron Z

 

[bmaverick]

kcflhrc had a quote of $16,300 for one with a FEL in Jan 2014: http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/...sons/300302-ls-g3033-ls-g3038-comparison.html

Aaron Z

I'll ask him again on his quoted price.

Even at that lower price, The Fredricks Yanmar is still $4,600 in favor.

 

[DavesTractor]

I'll ask him again on his quoted price.

Even at that lower price, The Fredricks Yanmar is still $4,600 in favor.

Yep, $4600 less for a 34 year old tractor. A great deal to some folks, a poor one to others. Depends on your perspective.

 

[bmaverick]

Yep, $4600 less for a 34 year old tractor. A great deal to some folks, a poor one to others. Depends on your perspective.

Oh true. If the Yanmar is a VN type and not redone well as a restore, the pricier LS would do. But then again, the VN Yanmars sell for way less anyways.