Puffing black smoke

GMtb42 · Oct 18, 2012

I noticed since I got the tractor that it intermittently puffs black smoke at idle or full throttle.
Just a short puff but seems to happen quite regularly almost as if a injector is squirting more fuel every once in a while.
I changed the fuel filter thinking maybe it was the problem but it still does it, no worse or better, any ideas as to what may be causing it, bad injector, debris in injector, etc....

EssexBoy · Oct 18, 2012

It would be the injector pump and not a injector, and not something that you could do.

VictorW · Oct 18, 2012

If it seems like it's one cylinder giving that "one puff" of smoke intermittently, I would think it's an injector and not the pump. Others, who may have had a similar problem, hopefully will post their repair. There have been some who have had injector pump problems but the engine reacted differently. Is it under warranty? I would start with the injectors but the hard part is which one being that it is intermittent.

DT86 · Oct 18, 2012

VictorW said:
I would start with the injectors but the hard part is which one being that it is intermittent.

I agree start with the injectors. Pull them all and have them tested. It's pretty cheap.

JD5210 · Oct 18, 2012

Close to your question. When going from an idle to increased RPM my tractor (99 JD 5210), would give off a puff of smoke. I started using JD fuel conditioner and after a few tank fulls the puff of smoke went away and the tractor now starts with just a flick of the engine.

Something to consider before pulling injectors.

ritcheyvs · Oct 18, 2012

Maybe injectors, definitely not the IP. Possibly clogged air filter. Black smoke is unburned fuel. A little smoke (often white) on startup is no big deal. Black smoke at high power settings is either poor fuel atomization (injectors) or choked air supply (clogged air filter). Note this is at high power, not just high RPM. In normal operation the governor constantly increases and decreases the amount of injected fuel to maintain a fixed RPM. Smoke puffs occur when the governor demands more fuel.

I'd try an injector cleaner before any disassembly. Diesel Purge is a favorite with old Mercedes Diesel owners:
http://www.dieselgiant.com/injectorcleaning.htm

Soundguy · Oct 18, 2012

if it was on my machine.. I'd change the filter and fill it with a injector cleaner like power service, then do a standard 'double dose' on the tank, and then service the air filter.

if the IP has a oil lubed cam box.. I'd service it and make sure it was not fuel thinned.

I'd also check the engine oil to make sure it was not fuel thinned.

thinned oil in the IP can cause issues.

thinned oil in the crankcase can lead to oil consimption and reduced lube.

post back

GMtb42 · Oct 19, 2012

Thanks Vic, my thoughts as well. No,no warranty.

GMtb42 · Oct 19, 2012

Soundguy said:
if it was on my machine.. I'd change the filter and fill it with a injector cleaner like power service, then do a standard 'double dose' on the tank, and then service the air filter.

if the IP has a oil lubed cam box.. I'd service it and make sure it was not fuel thinned.

I'd also check the engine oil to make sure it was not fuel thinned.

thinned oil in the IP can cause issues.

thinned oil in the crankcase can lead to oil consimption and reduced lube.

post back

Will try that and see. The oil/air/fuel/hydraulic filters I just changed and didn't notice any thinning in the engine oil.
Bought used so don't know history behind a lot of things, fuel filter was very dirty, not clogged but had particles of look like rust or scale from something, fuel container/dispenser maybe.

VictorW · Oct 19, 2012

I too would try a diesel injector cleaner first and usually it doesn't hurt anything if you add a little more. You mentioned that there was some rust or scale in the fuel filter bowl. Hopefully the filter caught all of it but if some made it through, that could make an injector hang up now and then no matter what the engine speed is. Probably the worst part is injector cleaner may not disolve that type of contaminent. If small enough, it may break up and get pushed through. It looks like a new injector is @$90. If the problem continues, it might be better to have them cleaned and set. Although I guess you could just buy one and keep changing positions until the problem stops.

Jesse masterson · Oct 21, 2012

I wouldn't worry about it , I have a Massey that's done that for 20 years.

GMtb42 · Oct 26, 2012

Will watch and see if it gets worse and if not just keep using until I can get a chance to maybe clean the injectors.

Soundguy · Oct 26, 2012

put some liquid cleaner inthere!

GMtb42 · Oct 30, 2012

Now the thing is producing heavy black smoke for a few seconds at start up and then at full throttle initiation.

Soundguy · Oct 30, 2012

hows the air cleaner look.

black smoke is unburnt fuel.

Coyote machine · Oct 30, 2012

GMtb42 said:
Now the thing is producing heavy black smoke for a few seconds at start up and then at full throttle initiation.

Have you done anything to change the symptoms? Added any cleaner or?

CJONE · Oct 31, 2012

Try the cleaners first, run it hard. If that does not fix it you more than likely have a messed up injector tip, either dirt,worn or partially plugged. Like soundguy said cheap to check. The pump would be the last step. Fuel improperly atomized will not burn completly. And like was said if it is constant have you checked your air filter? CJ

seacap04 · Nov 1, 2012

Ditto what CJONE said. Clean system and check air cleaner first. Then injection tips.

GMtb42 · Nov 1, 2012

Yes injector cleaner, have already replaced air and fuel filter first thing, will run it a bit longer and see if injector cleaner does anything before tearing into the injectors, I do however feel that it is a injector that one may have gotten some trash in it, from the looks of the old filter it would be a good assumption.
I do hope the cleaner works though.
Has anyone torn into the injectors? I have done automotive injectors and the one on the tractor look simpler than them. Any tricks or things to watch for?

GMtb42 · Nov 1, 2012

CJONE said:
Try the cleaners first, run it hard. If that does not fix it you more than likely have a messed up injector tip, either dirt,worn or partially plugged. Like soundguy said cheap to check. The pump would be the last step. Fuel improperly atomized will not burn completly. And like was said if it is constant have you checked your air filter? CJ

Yeah, not constant, I have replaced filter and did revisit the filter housing yesterday just to make sure nothing was askew, which there wasn't.
I do hope it is the injectors and are only dirty and will clean up with added cleaner.