What would you do?

[MasseyWV]

After looking at used tractors for several months, and going back and forth between the idea of buying an older Massey 135 tractor or some other smaller tractor, I am starting to believe that a smaller tractor is what I want to ultimately buy.

However, most smaller used tractors seem to cost nearly as much as new ones, which means, at least to me, that buying a new one makes much more sense. Financing is not an option and I simply don't have the cash to buy a new tractor right now so it's looking like it might be best for me to put my tractor shopping on hold for now.

My primary reason for wanting a tractor is to maintain my gravel driveway which badly needs new gravel to be added to it. I had planned on paying to have the gravel hauled from a nearby local supplier a few miles away as I have always done in the past but it gets very expensive in a hurry, mainly due to the ever increasing cost of diesel fuel. I also occasionally have manure, fill dirt, mulch, and other materials hauled, which only adds to the cost of any given project.

That said, I have been thinking about buying a tandem axle dump trailer so I can haul everything myself. I do have an 18' carhauler trailer, but it's not designed for those sorts of tasks and unloading it takes forever by hand.

Given my situation, would you...

A. Get a tandem axle dump trailer now and a new tractor later.
B. Get a used tractor now and continue to pay to have material hauled.

 

[bigbull338]

After looking at used tractors for several months, and going back and forth between the idea of buying an older Massey 135 tractor or some other smaller tractor, I am starting to believe that a smaller tractor is what I want to ultimately buy.

However, most smaller used tractors seem to cost nearly as much as new ones, which means, at least to me, that buying a new one makes much more sense. Financing is not an option and I simply don't have the cash to buy a new tractor right now so it's looking like it might be best for me to put my tractor shopping on hold for now.

My primary reason for wanting a tractor is to maintain my gravel driveway which badly needs new gravel to be added to it. I had planned on paying to have the gravel hauled from a nearby local supplier a few miles away as I have always done in the past but it gets very expensive in a hurry, mainly due to the ever increasing cost of diesel fuel. I also occasionally have manure, fill dirt, mulch, and other materials hauled, which only adds to the cost of any given project.

That said, I have been thinking about buying a tandem axle dump trailer so I can haul everything myself. I do have an 18' carhauler trailer, but it's not designed for those sorts of tasks and unloading it takes forever by hand.

Given my situation, would you...

A. Get a tandem axle dump trailer now and a new tractor later.
B. Get a used tractor now and continue to pay to have material hauled.

if you haul enough gravel manure an other stuff.then id go ahead an buy the dump trailer if it would pay for its self in 5 to 7yrs.

 

[TripleR]

Is renting a tractor an option?

We have a dump truck, but last year I paid to have stuff hauled as the cost of fuel and my time made the difference in cost fairly small as one of the bigger dump trucks can carry twice what ours will.

Sometimes there just doesn't seem to be a really good option.

 

[MasseyWV]

Is renting a tractor an option?

I neglected to mention it above, but if I went with the option of buying a dump trailer, I would continue to rent equipment as needed until I eventually purchased a new tractor.

 

[Raspy]

I hate the idea of renting a tractor. It means you can't use it for all the small things that constantly come up. I use mine all the time.

Hauling gravel yourself, on your own tandem axle dump trailer is very limited. When I get loads to my place, they come out with a dump truck and trailer rig that would take me many trips to equal.

Third thing is, get the right size tractor without thinking bigger is always better.

Mine is a 29 horse New Holland I bought new and I love it. It has developed my whole place from bare ground with the septic tank, leach field, driveway, main power service ditch, land clearing, foundation, setting steel posts for the new house, general forklift duties, etc. It moves gravel, trailers and building materials around the place constantly.

We recently had a forest fire that came to about 1/4 mile from my house. I wasn't home, but if I was the tractor would have been up there clearing land at full throttle. Now I leave it in the yard and the key in it, just in case I or a neighbor needs it in an emergency.

And I can haul it behind my pickup on a tandem axle trailer that is only 68" inside wide.

I say get your own tractor asap and you will never regret it. Order gravel and have it dumped on your place.

 

[MasseyWV]

I hate the idea of renting a tractor. It means you can't use it for all the small things that constantly come up. I use mine all the time.

I'm not fond of the idea of renting equipment but I've been doing it off and on for many years so I figure a few more won't hurt. In this case, I wouldn't actually be renting a tractor because noone rents them in my local area. Well, that's not true, one place does have a little Terramite but I've learned from experience that unless I need a backhoe, it's usually better to rent the larger stuff, which doesn't cost much more to rent. I'll probably start by renting a dozer to grade my driveway since that's what needs to be done first.

Hauling gravel yourself, on your own tandem axle dump trailer is very limited. When I get loads to my place, they come out with a dump truck and trailer rig that would take me many trips to equal.

My driveway is over 1000 feet long and since I have no way of hauling gravel in any significant quantities without having to unload it by hand, I've been waiting until I need large quantities and buying between 80 and 100 tons at a time. However, ordering that much gravel at a time comes with a hefty pricetag. Having a dump trailer would enable me to get much smaller quantities as needed which would still cost the same per ton, and the immediate financial impact would be lessened because I would only be buying 3 to 10 tons at a time. Sure, I would have to make several trips, but I am only about 5 miles from the gravel company so it wouldn't be that bad because the trips wouldn't have to be made all at once. In fact, I could even time my trips to coincide with other trips to town, thus killing two birds with one stone.

Third thing is, get the right size tractor without thinking bigger is always better.

Getting the right size tractor is exactly what I want to do. No matter how I try to justify it to myself, the larger tractors, newer or older, are just overkill for my modest needs. Buying a dump trailer has always been part of my long-term plans, I would just be rearranging things a bit.

 

[dodger454]

Tri-axle can bring 20-24 tons at a clip and runs about $300 delivered.(West Pa price)If your nice to the driver they will usually "tailgate" the load so you don't have a lot of gravel moving to do.Buy the tractor and get to work

 

[MasseyWV]

Tri-axle can bring 20-24 tons at a clip and runs about $300 delivered.(West Pa price)If your nice to the driver they will usually "tailgate" the load so you don't have a lot of gravel moving to do.Buy the tractor and get to work

The tri-axle trucks my local gravel company uses max out at 23 tons per load which runs about $450 to $500 depending on many factors, including fuel costs.

I'd love to buy a new tractor now but I simply can't afford it, and finding a decent used one, the size I want, and in my current price range, is proving to be a futile effort. Buying a dump trailer would be considerably cheaper than a tractor and it would enable me to get some real work done now.

My current situation (wife's cancer) dictates that I be extremely careful with money, so I'm simply trying to do the best I can with what I have to work with.

 

[TripleR]

Out of curiosity, what does a dump trailer cost and how much total weight will you have loaded?

 

[MasseyWV]

Out of curiosity, what does a dump trailer cost and how much total weight will you have loaded?

The kind of dump trailer I would buy costs $3000 - $5000 and would have a GVWR of 10000# which means I could safely haul approximately 7000# or 3.5 tons. If I were able to locate a good used dump trailer, which is unlikely, it would cost less. My tow vehicle is a 3/4 ton Ford F250 Superduty truck.

 

[TripleR]

I can see your conundrum. We are lucky to have a good rental place 18 miles away where we can get a Kubota GL3240, back hoe, mini excavator etc. for about $250 per day or weekend. We have some nice tractors now, but for years didn't have one then bought a well used 54 Ford NAA and used it for a lot of years. My brother is a mechanic, so we could get one in need of work and fix it up.

 

[Soundguy]

here's my take.

buy a cheaper used tractgor.. like that massey 35/135 or a ford from 39-64 usually find all these in the 1200-4500 range.. with the 135 being the one that kicks it into the 3500-4500 range.. the 35 and the fords should be in the 2-3 range for a good one..

then.. use plywood and lumber and build sides / box on yer trailer fer haulin material..landscapers do it here all the time.. especially if ya got stake pockets for 2x4... then you are set..

After looking at used tractors for several months, and going back and forth between the idea of buying an older Massey 135 tractor or some other smaller tractor, I am starting to believe that a smaller tractor is what I want to ultimately buy.

However, most smaller used tractors seem to cost nearly as much as new ones, which means, at least to me, that buying a new one makes much more sense. Financing is not an option and I simply don't have the cash to buy a new tractor right now so it's looking like it might be best for me to put my tractor shopping on hold for now.

My primary reason for wanting a tractor is to maintain my gravel driveway which badly needs new gravel to be added to it. I had planned on paying to have the gravel hauled from a nearby local supplier a few miles away as I have always done in the past but it gets very expensive in a hurry, mainly due to the ever increasing cost of diesel fuel. I also occasionally have manure, fill dirt, mulch, and other materials hauled, which only adds to the cost of any given project.

That said, I have been thinking about buying a tandem axle dump trailer so I can haul everything myself. I do have an 18' carhauler trailer, but it's not designed for those sorts of tasks and unloading it takes forever by hand.

Given my situation, would you...

A. Get a tandem axle dump trailer now and a new tractor later.
B. Get a used tractor now and continue to pay to have material hauled.

 

[Raspy]

Massey,

Soundguy is right about putting sides on a car hauler or other low sided trailer. I did it with mine before getting a dump trailer. I cut a low spot to back it into, blocked the rear end for support and drove my tractor right in, to unload it.

But I soon realized the time and fuel to get such small loads was not very productive. However, I do realize the constraints we all live within. My project is going slower that I want because of the cost. Perhaps you could even put off the gravel work until next fall. If you get the tractor now you can work on the driveway at your leisure instead of being on the clock with a rental unit.

 

[jenkinsph]

I can't tell you which to buy first but imo it would depend on whether I could find the best deal on a tractor or a dump trailer. In my case I bought several tractors before buying a dump trailer. Years ago I had a 6yd dump truck though and don't wan't another one.

Last summer I found a good deal on a 3 year old dump trailer from a local rental yard. I drove past it everyday and knew that it was rarely rented and the business owner was happy to sell it for about 1/2 the cost of new. Paint in the bed is still like new. This is a 6.5x14' tandem dump 14,000 lb PJ, bought this for $3800. It has proven to be a good deal so far and also has the double opening doors and slide in ramps. So you should be able to find a smaller one for less money too.

 

[Martian]

From a money stand point; I would see more financial sense in getting a tractor and saving the rental costs over getting the trailer and saving the delivery costs. I would imagine it would cost you a lot more to rent the tractor you needed all the time than to get a trailer and save the delivery costs. Around here, there's not much premium for delivery. As much as I'd like an old dump truck, or a dump trailer, it doesn't make as much financial sense because it won't save me as much as putting it towards a tractor (if I was in you situation) That's my $.02 anyway.

 

[MasseyWV]

Thanks for the great suggestions.

I should clarify that I haven't completely given up the idea of getting a tractor, I just may have to rearrange my priorities. The problem is that I have a $5000 maximum budget and can't spend much more than that.

My driveway has been somewhat neglected lately and is in bad need of repair so it can't really wait until the fall unless I want to risk allowing it to get even worse. Over the last year or two, I've been hauling gravel in the bed of my F250 truck, which can safely haul around 3500-4000# before it starts falling off the sides. And anyone who has hauled gravel knows that 2 tons of gravel doesn't go very far, especially when you're unloading it by hand. My 18' carhauler trailer is equipped with 2x4 stake pockets and as suggested, I do intend to build removable side panels for it, which would allow me to haul more gravel at one time but given the amount of material I need to haul, unloading it by hand is still very impractical, not to mention being hard on my already aching back.

Some of the work I need to do requires that I rent equipment regardless. It's difficult to explain, but there is an area immediately behind my garage that needs to be dug out and can only be reached by a backhoe or dug out by hand. Also, there are parts of my driveway that have drainage problems which will require the use of a dozer to dig up the sub-roadbed and regrade it so a proper crown can be established and maintained. I know a dozer is required because my father-in-law has tried to fix it with his Massey 135 but the sub-roadbed is simply too hard for it to dig deep enough. There is even one place that's going to require the use of a jackhammer to bust up a sizeable piece of a large sandstone boulder that is right in the middle of the road, causing a slight hump.

Buying a new dump trailer would max out my budget and force me to buy a tractor at a later date, but if I can find a decent used dump trailer, it would probably leave just enough money for me to consider an older model tractor like the Ford 8n or the TO-30 which are still larger than what I want/need but it would only be temporary so I could make due. Using a dump trailer to haul gravel will still be very limiting, but it will be much easier for me. I can haul gravel at my leisure and even time it so the gravel trips cooincide with other trips to town, thus saving gas by not making extra trips.

As you can tell, I'm in a tough spot and as a direct result recent events, I have to make some tough decisions. Fortunately, I am in no hurry, aside from needing to get my driveway fixed before the summer months arrive because our red clay soil turns into concrete when it dries out. That said, I should have plenty of time to get everything sorted out.

 

[Martian]

Also consider this, if you buy the 8N, it will depreciate a lot less in value over the coming years than a dump trailer may. You buy it for $3k and sell it for that same amount 5 years from now.

 

[jenkinsph]

I would also add that I don't use my dump trailer to haul large amounts of base course or rock for roadbeds. It is more efficient to have a tandem dump haul it in. Last month I had 36 yards of base course (3/4" to fines) delivered and tailgated for $818 with tax. Seems to me you are paying too much.

 

[MasseyWV]

Also consider this, if you buy the 8N, it will depreciate a lot less in value over the coming years than a dump trailer may. You buy it for $3k and sell it for that same amount 5 years from now.

Depreciation of the dump trailer wouldn't be much of a concern because I would intend to keep it "forever", barring any unforseen circumstances that might force me to sell it. I take very good care of my equipment so if I am careful to get a good one, it should last a lifetime.

Having a 10,000# low profile dump trailer would not only give me dumping capacity, but it would also allow me to haul smaller equipment like a skid steer, thus eliminating delivery fees associated with renting. My carhauler trailer is only rated at 7,000# which doesn't leave quite enough cargo capacity for a skid steer.

If I bought an older tractor like the 8n, I would try to get one that was more or less mechanically sound but looked a little rough on the outside, which should reduce the price considerably, thus allowing me to fix it up and perhaps even make a little money when the time comes to sell it.

I would also add that I don't use my dump trailer to haul large amounts of base course or rock for roadbeds. It is more efficient to have a tandem dump haul it in. Last month I had 36 yards of base course (3/4" to fines) delivered and tailgated for $818 with tax. Seems to me you are paying too much.

It's been a few years since I had gravel delivered and the amount I stated was only an estimate from memory. As I recall, I think it may have been somewhere around $13 to $15 a ton plus delivery & fuel surcharge fees. The rates are constantly changing so it could cost more, or less now. Knowing the economy, I have little doubt that it costs more now.

 

[Martian]

In that case would you consider selling the car hauler and use the dump trailer for everything? That would reduce your costs even more and might make more sense than a tractor.