Diesel versus gas maintance

   / Diesel versus gas maintance #31  
I was under the impression that it was better to idle a diesel for a minute or two than to turn it off and then start it back up but anything more than 3 or 4 minutes and it is better to turn it off. This is if you are just running in to get something and it doesn't need to cool off. Is this true or would it really be better to turn it off no matter how soon you will starting it again?

Ed
 
   / Diesel versus gas maintance #32  
If you are not in the driver's seat/operator's station, shut it off - that is *best* for it.
 
   / Diesel versus gas maintance #33  
If you are not in the driver's seat/operator's station, shut it off - that is *best* for it.

That is what I was wondering. I read somewhere that there was more wear on the engine turning it off and then starting it back up vs letting it idle for a minute or two but don't know how true that is. I know on the 2008 and newer turcks with the DPF idling causes lots of problems but what about the pre DPF trucks? What is your take on this?

Ed
 
   / Diesel versus gas maintance #34  
If you are not in the driver's seat/operator's station, shut it off - that is *best* for it.

Possibly, but as a few have mentioned that for 5/10 min stop, if you consider that everytime you shut down your motor your oil drains back down and for a fraction you are running with a less that ideal lubrication. I know that it is splitting hairs but I am a contractor and would be all day checking jobs and gofor materials. With my 02 (not lettin' go of the 7.3) , it would be running dark to dark with quite a bit of it idling. The hour meter says 6467 with the odo at 181045 still going strong oil changes and a water pump only (knock on wood) So other than being wasteful I don't see where idling, (at least the older engines that were not so fussy about emmissions) hurts the a bit.
I do remember reading that most of the wear that occurs to any motor happens during the first few minutes where everything is expanding from being cold, again this might be splitting hairs.
 
   / Diesel versus gas maintance #35  
I've only been running diesel engines for 35 years or so, so take this for what it's worth.
Idling a diesel engine is part of the maintenance. When you start up in the morning you need to let the engine idle until it warms up, it needs to warm up to full operating temp if you're pulling a load.
Now, as far as I'm concerned every truck that has a turbo charged diesel should have a pyrometer, or exhaust gas temp. guage installed. When you go to shut her down, a couple of minutes just won't cut it. That engine needs to idle until the pyrometer reaches no more than 300 degrees. A lot of modern techs. will cry BS to this, but if you're pulling a load your exhaust temp. can get as high as 1200 degrees (it can get higher, but not if your engine is going to last). Your turbo is lubricated with the oil from your engine's crank case, if you shut off the engine when you stop, you're going to cook the oil in the turbo, which can destroy the bearings in the turbo. Now when you start back up and the oil starts flowing again, this cooked oil will go back to the engine possibly stopping things up.
If you're not pulling a load your exhaust temps. can get up around 7 or 800 degree running down the hiway.
Sound like BS? Try this. With a torch heat up a 2" black iron pipe cap to 750 degrees, now drop in a teaspoon of the motor oil your running, and let it cook. Then see what you think about what I'm telling you.

Andy
 
   / Diesel versus gas maintance #36  
Possibly, but as a few have mentioned that for 5/10 min stop, if you consider that everytime you shut down your motor your oil drains back down and for a fraction you are running with a less that ideal lubrication. I know that it is splitting hairs but I am a contractor and would be all day checking jobs and gofor materials.
I do remember reading that most of the wear that occurs to any motor happens during the first few minutes where everything is expanding from being cold, again this might be splitting hairs.

Unless there is someone in the driver's seat or operator's station, SHUT IT OFF.

Not trying to be arguementative, but oils of today are a WORLD better than those before so everything you hear about it being "better" to idle is based on OLD wives tales and other mystical thoughts.

UPS does not idle a single truck for even a second, their "package cars" are stopped and started with every stop, they don't worry about wear and tear on the starter, battery, alternator or engine. Why? It takes VERY LITTLE to start a hot engine, so stress on the electrical system after the initial start of the day is neglidgeable.

Cylinder temps drop RAPIDLY at idle, this causes "wash down" of the cylinder walls as raw, unburned fuel contacts the wall and drains into the oil. Fuel dilution of the oil will do far more damage than shutting the engine down and restarting, even if it cools some.

I cannot ever recall seeing an oil related failure of a turbo, I have been doing this for 30 years on anything with oil in it or on it, oil coaking is very rare and due to ignorance and poor quality oils, nothing more. The turbo bearing failures I have seen could generally be bucketed into two groups: 1) Material defect, 2) revving the engine just before shut-down to "clear it out". This (very common) ignorant practise spins the turbo up to near peak speeds (80K-100K RPM!) than suddenly starves it of oil when the engine stops. Do it once and you damage the bearings, it will fail, but maybe not today.
 
   / Diesel versus gas maintance #37  
Well, like I said, take it for what it's worth.
You guy's run em like you want to, I'm gonna keep warming mine up and cooling them down.

Andy
 
   / Diesel versus gas maintance #38  
Obviously you should probably follow the manufacturer's maintenance recommendations, but you might want to consider a little longer air filter replacement interval than the 15K miles mentioned earlier ...

In reality, you may easily be able to go much longer than that (depending on the operating environment) - particularly if your filter system has a FilterMinder™ or other restriction gauge on it:

Myths vs Facts

I usually change mine out in the van every 12 to 18 months .... or every 120K to 130K miles or so ..... whether the gauge says it needs it or not (although I have pulled it midway - @ 60K miles - and vacuumed it off)

FWIW, on the oil, I run synthetic (Mobil 1 0w40) with a drain interval of between 14K to 18K miles .... but it's a 2.7 liter 5 cylinder Benz diesel (OM 647) - there may well be very good reasons not to due that on 7.3.
 
   / Diesel versus gas maintance #39  
Well, like I said, take it for what it's worth.
You guy's run em like you want to, I'm gonna keep warming mine up and cooling them down.

Andy

i know my diesel tractor says to start and warm 5 minutes before full load use, then idle for 1 minute after full load use before shutdown.

i tend to do similar to my diesel truck. start up, walk to paper box to get paper and electric gate open, then go back to truck and go.. when parking I usually watch the pyro till it drops then shutdown and go.. etc.

i also use a premium full synthetic oil... can't hurt.

soundguy
 
   / Diesel versus gas maintance #40  
mod mech diesel does not wash the walls down but gas does.i have seen bearing out in turbo's with oil cooked on them.ups trucks must not have turbos or they would be idled down.if idling puts diesel into the oil,then why does the oil level in my diesels not go up? the manuals on all my tractors says to idle the tractors down up to 5 minutes. do you think that i should listen to you over john deere ,cat ,caseih and mccormick?
 

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