river pump suggestions ?

[bcarwell]

I need to pump water from a shallow (4 feet deep) river up a steep bank of about 150 feet of head to a tank for 6 cows (e.g. 100 -200 gallons a DAY) I'm thinking a horizontal submersible well pump would be the way to go unless somebody thinks otherwise. Could anyone suggest any pump that might fit the bill ? Tnx.

 

[Larry Caldwell]

1) Don't try to pump out of the river channel. Dig a sump to the side of the channel with a ditch to the river. Screen the sump so debris washing downriver doesn't get into your pump station.

2) Allow for floods and droughts. If you choose a simple centrifugal pump, mount it on a float, or mount it above flood height with a long suction. Centrifugal pumps push water a lot better than they suck. You will get better performance mounting it at water level. A submersible has to stay submerged, so dig your sump deep enough that it is always under water. Don't forget to screen the top of the sump.

3) Make the whole thing easily removable. One good flood will fill the sump with gravel and mud. This is easier than it sounds, because it won't take much of a pump to pump 200 gallons a day. A quarter horse motor running a roller pump would do it.

 

[PILOON]

Also place a check valve shortly after the pump so that water will not flow back and 'unscrew' the impeller blade (Blades).
A tip provided me by a company pump rep. I gather this is especially important on sump type pumps.
I also agree a 1/3 hp any type should be OK but go for largest diameter line to reduce friction. (yes there is friction loss in water pipe lines and you do say 150ft)
Check pump sites fo specs; i.e. Groundfoss, RedJacket, Monarch etc.
Using a regular sump pump float switch installed in the tank (providing the power source is near the tank) could give you 'automatic' filling feature.
That style float switch could contol any type pump.

 

[RobertN]

0.434lbs/ft. For structure firefighting, expect each floor to be 10', so ~5psi head loss per floor.

150' of vertical means 65psi of head pressure at the pump. That is not even counting losses for friction.

That is a fair amount of pressure to consider.

I also agree a 1/3 hp any type should be OK but go for largest diameter line to reduce friction. (yes there is friction loss in water pipe lines and you do say 150ft)

 

[Larry Caldwell]

0.434lbs/ft. For structure firefighting, expect each floor to be 10', so ~5psi head loss per floor.

150' of vertical means 65psi of head pressure at the pump. That is not even counting losses for friction.

That is a fair amount of pressure to consider.

It's actually closer to 75 psi if you consider any line loss at all. That's why I mentioned high head pumps. The horsepower is not really relevant, but the pump design is important. High head water pumps normally have multiple stages, each one boosting water pressure. If you want to get a lot of water, you need a lot of horsepower, but this guy only needs 200 gallons a day, which is just a trickle. A 1 gpm pump would do that much in a little over 3 hours. Running 24/7, 1/6 gpm (a little over a pint) would do it.

 

[RobertN]

0.434*150=65.1 head pressure That is just to get 0.0psi at 150' vertical.

Yes, there will be loss over and above that value, even at the low flows needed by the OP. I used to do landscape irrigation; 3/4", 1", 1-1/4" Schedule 40 pipe has a lot of friction loss even at relatively low pressure and flow. Rainbird has a friction loss calculator for most popular plastic pipe that may be useful.

I would fear the cost of the pump, and also the cost of running power to the pump. Niether will be cheap.

So at a minimum:
- Low flow high pressure pump
- 150'+ pipe
- 150'+ power line from tank to pump,
- additional power from source to tank

My other concern would be the legal water access rights to the "river".

http://www.rainbird.com/landscape/resources/FrictionLossCharts.htm

 

[Egon]

Consider a Ram pump??

 

[DAY]

Consider a Ram pump??

A ram needs a drop (head) to function- even a couple of feet will pump water "uphill". Once again, "use the google"

 

[Mace Canute]

For your situation, a diaphragm pump might be the better choice rather than centrifugal type pumps.

 

[RobertN]

You mean run a PTO pump off your Ram that has a Cummins?

Consider a Ram pump??