DK45SE... Hst or Gear?

[whitmerlegacyfarm]

Well kinda had the breaks put on the new dk45se hst. The quote was wrong/misunderstood. Quoted me 21k for a shuttle/gear n I swore he said hydro price. Was at 24k for the dk45se hst. Guess im gona keep lookin. Man I thought I had a great deal worjin up. Just my luck lol.

 

[kco]

My DK35 HST with R4 tires (no ballast yet, but that should be done onsite today) was delivered late Saturday night replacing my L275 DT (roughly similar to L2800?) gear tractor with AG tires.

.

I got the Rim Guard installed onsite today. It is new in this area and the technician was not that familiar with it. He told me its risk is rated "0" (i.e. none) on the WHIMS (rates materials hazard risk). That's good because he got sprayed in the face a couple of times. But it is nothing a bit of soap and water won't clean up, and it doesn't taste that bad.

 

[grsthegreat]

I got the Rim Guard installed onsite today. It is new in this area and the technician was not that familiar with it. He told me its risk is rated "0" (i.e. none) on the WHIMS (rates materials hazard risk). That's good because he got sprayed in the face a couple of times. But it is nothing a bit of soap and water won't clean up, and it doesn't taste that bad.

rim guard is just Beet Juice........vegitable based. ummmm tasty

 

[k8m]

You mentioned in your post that your wife might operate once and awhile, that is the main reason I went with the DK45 hst wanted the wife ,kids, 80 year old father to be able to jump on the tractor and be able to operate.Had a ford 3000 but didn't feel comfortable with anybody else doing close in work. When you let the clutch out on that tractor it was moving,unless you ran it alot like any geared tractor hard to work in tight quarters. I got tired of having to operate then get off to load something in the bucket that the wife wasn't strong enough to move. She doesn't operate the tractor much but with the hydro I feel alot more at ease working close to the bucket.

 

[grsthegreat]

You mentioned in your post that your wife might operate once and awhile, that is the main reason I went with the DK45 hst wanted the wife ,kids, 80 year old father to be able to jump on the tractor and be able to operate.Had a ford 3000 but didn't feel comfortable with anybody else doing close in work. When you let the clutch out on that tractor it was moving,unless you ran it alot like any geared tractor hard to work in tight quarters. I got tired of having to operate then get off to load something in the bucket that the wife wasn't strong enough to move. She doesn't operate the tractor much but with the hydro I feel alot more at ease working close to the bucket.

i hope you wife likes you hehe

dont let her get too close to you with the bucket:laughing: :laughing:

 

[Greg9504]

Well kinda had the breaks put on the new dk45se hst. The quote was wrong/misunderstood. Quoted me 21k for a shuttle/gear n I swore he said hydro price. Was at 24k for the dk45se hst. Guess im gona keep lookin. Man I thought I had a great deal worjin up. Just my luck lol.

Are these cash price quotes? What state are you in? I'm in Canada and I was quoted almost that for one with a cab, dk40se cab $26k even (plus tax). The dk45se cab would be more money but not worth it for the extra 4 pto hp, for me.

 

[k8m]

She has too many projects for me to complete to take me out now

 

[IslandTractor]

Are these cash price quotes? What state are you in? I'm in Canada and I was quoted almost that for one with a cab, dk40se cab $26k even (plus tax). The dk45se cab would be more money but not worth it for the extra 4 pto hp, for me.

I don't understand why Kioti charges so much extra for the 45 and 50. They are the identical tractor and engine as the DK40se except for bored out cylinders. Probably costs Kioti about fifty bucks in upgraded pistons. I understand they can get more money for higher horsepower tractors selling against their own line up but can you imagine how many of the DK50se's they could sell if they undercut equivalent Kubotas and JD's by ten thousand bucks instead of five thousand?

I think I will eventually replace my DK40se with a cab version and would consider the 45 just to keep the power equivalent to my 40 when the cab version has the A/C running. The 40 has all the power I can put on the ground though so I don't see any need for more hp for the mowing (six foot flail) or tilling (six foot tiller) that I do.

 

[dennis52]

I recently bought my new DS4510 gear/hydraulic shuttle and decided against hst for following reasons:

Most of my heavy work will be slashing (brush hogging) 25 acres at constant speed. I rarely have a need to change speed on the run.

I have about 10 acres that are steep and and I like the security of having gears braking me when I am hanging off the hill.

My understanding ( happy to be more informed ) is that steep country can place a lot of strain on hst (heating the fluid); apparently the newer Kubota hst technology allows you to select a lower torque for hst steep work.

Increased HP at pto

In 5 years, if it breaks I know how to fix it.

The hydraulic shuttle (forward/reverse) is convenient if your knees need a rest.

Having said all that I am sure that a HST would be more suitable for loader and stable work or if you need to constantly change speed and direction.

It's horses for courses.

Love my Kioti

 

[whitmerlegacyfarm]

Wow. Decisions decisions. I like the ease of use of hydro but my land is like halk flat n half hills. I have to go up a decent hill just to get to my fields. I just cant seem to decide all these posts keep helpin I rely appreciate it. Openhouse at my local kioti dealer tomorrow n sat. So I wana go test drive a dk40 hst to c how I like the hydro. Hopfully I can narrow it down.

 

[IslandTractor]

I think Dennis52 makes some good points (and the DS line is definitely a great value). However, HST still seems to make sense to me for most folks. I would not worry about hills. HST is probably safer in fact as if you take your foot off the pedal the tractor stops. I'd think there are more ways to get into trouble on hills with a clutch and standard tranny than with HST. You'd have to run an HST awfully hard to cause problems on hills. No one here has ever complained about the Kioti HST (except for the limited two range version on the CK20). The HST still carries some undeserved baggage related to early days of HST which is kinda like comparing a modern automobile auto transmission to an old two speed Chevy slush box from the 1950's. HSTs made by all the major manufacturers seem to be extremely reliable these days. It is a pretty mature technology.

For my money, I'd go with HST unless ground engagement is your major task or if the extra two or three PTO horsepower used will reallyl change what you can do with implements. Of course the other reason to opt for standard or shuttle is the extra cost of HST and that is always a perfectly valid reason.

 

[kco]

I think Dennis52 makes some good points (and the DS line is definitely a great value). However, HST still seems to make sense to me for most folks. I would not worry about hills. HST is probably safer in fact as if you take your foot off the pedal the tractor stops. I'd think there are more ways to get into trouble on hills with a clutch and standard tranny than with HST. You'd have to run an HST awfully hard to cause problems on hills. No one here has ever complained about the Kioti HST (except for the limited two range version on the CK20). The HST still carries some undeserved baggage related to early days of HST which is kinda like comparing a modern automobile auto transmission to an old two speed Chevy slush box from the 1950's. HSTs made by all the major manufacturers seem to be extremely reliable these days. It is a pretty mature technology.

For my money, I'd go with HST unless ground engagement is your major task or if the extra two or three PTO horsepower used will reallyl change what you can do with implements. Of course the other reason to opt for standard or shuttle is the extra cost of HST and that is always a perfectly valid reason.

Your view agrees with my limited HST experience Island. I got my DK35 HST late Saturday night and have put in 10 hours just "playing" with it and testing its handling on my narrow, winding, hilly and uneven trails. The DK35 has industrial tires and feels much bigger than my previous Kubota L275 DT (similar to L3400). The DK35 is longer and the bucket 6" wider.

I have challenging places where the tractor just fits between trees. The HST is much easier to inch around tight spots, reverse if necessary, and resume speed when in the clear.

I also feel one has more control on steep hills because the speed control is so fine and it is easy to slow to a crawl without having to shift to a lower gear and restart using a clutch.

I finished the testing today and took the DK places where the L275 was near its limit of stability. No doubt a lot has to do with what seems a lower centre of gravity, industrial tires and more weight.

The testing was fun and I now know I can operate the new tractor over all the places I went with the old one. Now I can put it to work...which really is no different than playing!

Cheers.

 

[dennis52]

Just remembered this very useful advice from Union Farm Equipment titled "HST vs Gear transmissions" link below. Thanks to the original poster. Enjoy the new tractor.





Union Farm Equipment - Tips

 

[IslandTractor]

Just remembered this very useful advice from Union Farm Equipment titled "HST vs Gear transmissions" link below. Thanks to the original poster. Enjoy the new tractor.
Union Farm Equipment - Tips

The only point in that article I disagree with is the rather odd statement that it is difficult to maintain one speed with HST. We all understand that hst requires pedal pressure just as driving a car does. Most of us don't have much trouble maintaining a steady speed driving a car. They say that changing terrain and work loads make 'cruise control' less effective. I don't see that is really very different from what you get with a standard transmission and a fixed throttle position. Presumably if you are in a fixed gear and go up a hill the engine will start to bog down with either hst or gear. Same for mowing and hitting a very lush patch of high grass with either transmission. In both cases you would need to increase throttle if the temporary reduction in speed is a problem.

 

[kco]

Just remembered this very useful advice from Union Farm Equipment titled "HST vs Gear transmissions" link below. Thanks to the original poster. Enjoy the new tractor.





Union Farm Equipment - Tips

Thanks for the article Dennis. It makes valid points for both types of transmission. I just realised that, in my enthusiasm for my new tractor and HST, my post last night was insensitive and did not acknowledge your very valid points. I apologise for that.

Gear transmissions have clear advantages in efficiency, power, and likely serviceability. The gear DK35 has over 5% more PTO power than the HST. I imagine it has a 5% advantage in what the article calls "traditional work" such as plowing, haying, etc.

While I like the HST's easy speed control on my hills and winding paths, I'm sure I would have been just as enthralled with a gear transmission as the new tractor is so much more stable than the old L275DT.

Perhaps the vast improvement in stability is due to the industrial tires. There's another huge debate where there is no "right" answer! ;-)

 

[whitmerlegacyfarm]

Ok one last thing. Do you guys think i will really notice a difference in a 40 hp to a 45hp if i go with the hydro? I just applied for the financing so if that all goes threw i'm redy to take the plunge. Getting closer everyday

 

[IslandTractor]

Ok one last thing. Do you guys think i will really notice a difference in a 40 hp to a 45hp if i go with the hydro? I just applied for the financing so if that all goes threw i'm redy to take the plunge. Getting closer everyday

I haven't driven a 45 but have never wanted for power with my 40. Runs a six foot flail and six foot tiller with no issues. I have a 5ft Bush Hog only because I got it cheap used and I know the 40 usually runs a six or even seven foot hog.

As I've noted before, the only difference between the two tractors is 200cc of displacement. If Kioti charged a few hundred bucks extra I wouldn't squeal but as I recall the difference is more like $1500 which seems like highway robbery for slighly larger pistons.

If I were getting the cab version I'd probably spring for the 45 so I'd have the same practical amount of PTO hp as the 40 when the A/C was running.

 

[whitmerlegacyfarm]

I got approved today for the equipment loan. So it's time to get serioius and start test driving these kiotis and make the decision. I can't wait hopfully have time to go this weekend and check out a few dealers. Im pretty dead set on this DK45SE HST platform and loader. But theres still a lil thought about this cub yanmar ex450, of coarse it's gear but i can get TLB w/ ex450 for $26,500 all about. Sure would be nice to have the hoe. I'm lookin at 25k for the dk45 hst. It's a tough decision i noticed the cubs don't seem to have the lift capacity. I just like the sounds of having the backhoe to play around with and possibly some side jobs for the business that would be very enjoyable. I'm tired of thinking about all these tractors and want to just have it sittin in my barn. My fiance is also tired of me talking nothing but tractors. So i'm sure she will be glad once i get one and shut up about it.

 

[grsthegreat]

I got approved today for the equipment loan. So it's time to get serioius and start test driving these kiotis and make the decision. I can't wait hopfully have time to go this weekend and check out a few dealers. Im pretty dead set on this DK45SE HST platform and loader. But theres still a lil thought about this cub yanmar ex450, of coarse it's gear but i can get TLB w/ ex450 for $26,500 all about. Sure would be nice to have the hoe. I'm lookin at 25k for the dk45 hst. It's a tough decision i noticed the cubs don't seem to have the lift capacity. I just like the sounds of having the backhoe to play around with and possibly some side jobs for the business that would be very enjoyable. I'm tired of thinking about all these tractors and want to just have it sittin in my barn. My fiance is also tired of me talking nothing but tractors. So i'm sure she will be glad once i get one and shut up about it.

once she drives it....there will be no holding her back.

I paid 27000 for DK45SE HST with cab. 25 without cab seems kinda high, but i know prices have risen. also, mine was all cash deal

 

[whitmerlegacyfarm]

I'm hoping to work a dealer down to around 23.5k w/ TL, R4 tires loaded all 4 and atleast a tooth bar for bucket. I will be payin by check being i go my own financing threw my business account. Same as cash rite?