Might plant white clover.

[N80]

I'm thinking about planting white clover in the majority of my few and small food plot areas. I might even overseed some of my grassy 'lawn-fields' around the cabin.

I'm thinking about a mix of Patriot (good early yield) and Durana (last for years).

I do not know when to plant them. Seems like you can plant them in late winter, early spring and fall. I'd like to do it soon. Maybe late February or early March. This way I may get some 'frost' effect.

I do not have the proper equipment for this. I have access to a nice no-till drill but 1) it is really too big to maneuver in my little plots (1/4 acre or less and oddly shaped) and 2) I don't think it will handle clover seeds. I do not have a cultipaker. I do not have a spreader. I don't think a typical PTO spreader would work on such a small scale anyway.

So here is my plan.

1) In the next week or so, turn everything over with my two bottom plow.

2) Disk and fertilize. Probably 0-20-20. Too late to lime and I think the pH is okay anyway. Soil test last spring showed it pretty close to 7 which should be fine for clover.

3) Plant using a hand spreader. I know, tedious. But the largest plot is about 1/2 acre and a push spreader really can't handle the rough ground. I also think (guessing) that I might get more control with a hand spreader.

4) Run homemade harrow over it (6' 6x6 with chain link fence rolled around it).

Any thoughts? Any drawback to late winter or early spring planting? Anything I've mentioned going to cause a disaster?

 

[ToadHill]

Sounds like a plan. You might look into renting a commercial push spreader they have large pneumatic tires about 12" and handle rough ground very well.

 

[Egon]

I've done slightly larger areas just hand spreading and then harrowing with a home built excuse for a harrow. It seemed to work for me.

 

[schmism]

if you have any bee's in the area they will thank you for planting the clover.

 

[Highbeam]

White clover is a wetland plant and red clover is not. I would never plant white clover on purpose.

 

[3RRL]

I did the same as Egon suggested, hand spreading and then I ran a drag harrow over it pulled behind an ATV.

 

[N80]

White clover is a wetland plant and red clover is not. I would never plant white clover on purpose.

I'm no expert but what I understand about white clovers like Durana and Patriot is that 1) It is a perennial not an annual and that the Durana may last 5-7 years. 2) It is attractive and beneficial for deer and turkey. 3) Weed control can be managed by mowing the clover a few times each summer. 4) It is highly graze resistant. 5) Do not require nitrogen which also helps keep down weeds, etc. 6) Was designed specifically for the region I am in. 7) Does not like dry sandy soil. 8) Handles low pH well.

My soil is clay and rocks. It is not good for anything but pottery and getting stuck in. When it is wet, it holds onto water. When it is dry it is like concrete. So it won't be ideal for clover, but the two primary places I want to put it are fairly low and wet.

So based on what I've been told, these white clover hybrids will be as good for my purposes as anything else I can think off.

I'm going to give it a try, so we shall see!

 

[Jimbrown]

I had that stuff growing in my yard (5 ac) in Carlisle Pa and absoultely nothing would kill it. Rabbits, deer and bees loved it. It some how got mixed in with the grass seed when they planted the grass. The neighbors hated me. One of those houghty toughty areas with golf course like yards except for mine.

 

[DocHeb]

I had that stuff growing in my yard (5 ac) in Carlisle Pa and absoultely nothing would kill it.

It is interesting to note that white clover used to be intentionally mixed in with grass seed for home lawns in the 40s and 50s. It stays green all season, doesn't require significant irrigation, fixes its own nitrogen so it doesn't need fertilizer, and doesn't grow much more than a couple inches high. Sounds like the perfect lawn ground cover. It was considered as such until the "perfect green lawn industrial complex" declared it a problem in the 1960's. (Black Helicopter conspiratorial tone intentional and added for attempted humorous content.)

 

[schmism]

I'm going to give it a try, so we shall see!

plant for plant its THE best plant/flower for bees. I think youll be really happy with it.

 

[N80]

I had that stuff growing in my yard (5 ac) in Carlisle Pa and absoultely nothing would kill it.

That's what I'm looking for then! Of course, I haven't met many plants that I couldn't kill......when I was trying to make it to grow.

 

[charlz]

It will slowly choke out everything else... good for weeds, bad for desirable grasses. The bee thing is cool if you are not going to walk around barefoot

 

[dmccarty]

It will slowly choke out everything else... good for weeds, bad for desirable grasses. The bee thing is cool if you are not going to walk around barefoot

I am not a "lawn" person. Grass is just green stuff to keep us from walking on mud when the ground is wet. And boy is the ground wet lately. I planted some grass, maybe Rebel IV/V or some such. It looks good but its thick in some places but it does not get too high if I let it go. In other places there are weeds that can get 3-4 feet tall.

I mow the "lawn" with a DR Brush mower so I don't give a rats fanny how high it gets except it does slow the mower down a bit. Have to go to 2nd gear.

So this clover is hard go kiil... Sounds like N80's soil is like mine. Rock with clay or clay with rock. The clover chokes out both "grass" and weeds. Low growing. Attract honey bees. Hmmm. So far I'm seeing nothing but positives with clover.

Is there some reason I SHOULD not plant this instead of expensive grass? How expensive is the seed?

Later,
Dan

 

[DocHeb]

How expensive is the seed? Later, Dan

You can get an idea at Seedland.com. Their website is a little disjointed, but you can get an idea. It is important for clover seed to be innoculated with the bacteria that lives symbiotically in the roots. This bacteria lets the clover fix nitrogen gas in the air into soluble nitrates the roots can take up into the plant.

 

[dmccarty]

You can get an idea at Seedland.com. ...

Thanks Doc. Very informative.

The only problem I have after reading the site is I now have a mind worm running over and over in my head,

"Crimson and Clover over and over,
Crimson and Clover over and over"



Expensive but cheaper than grass seed. I'll check my farm supplier and see what Dallas has to sell. But it looks like it should be planted in the fall.

"Crimson and Clover over and over,
Crimson and Clover over and over"

Thanks,
Dan

 

[N80]

Pennington sells Durana. They say it can be planted late winter (frost helps it to make good soil contact), early spring and fall. It cannot be planted when it is dry. Both Durana and Patriot are pre inoculated.

 

[N80]

Thanks Doc. Very informative.

The only problem I have after reading the site is I now have a mind worm running over and over in my head,

Which one? Tommy James and the Shondels or Joan Jett?

 

[dmccarty]

Pennington sells Durana. They say it can be planted late winter (frost helps it to make good soil contact), early spring and fall. It cannot be planted when it is dry. Both Durana and Patriot are pre inoculated.

One blurb I saw on the link said fall. Which I thought was a bit strange. But with my To Do list it might be the Fall of 2009 before I can try the clover.

Later,
Dan

 

[dmccarty]

Which one? Tommy James and the Shondels or Joan Jett?

Tommy James's version with the psychedelic sound!

Later,
Dan

 

[pappy19]

One thing to keep in mind: when I was an Ag student at Louisiana Tech, one of our professors was doing some research on bloating. One of his experiments included white Dutch clover vs red clover. We would collect a bushel basket of each, run it through a grinder and squeeze out the juice, Then we would force feed the juice via worming syringe into 2 steers and 2 wethers (castrated sheep). We did the red clover first and noticed no ill effects whatsoever. Four hours later, we did the same thing with the white Dutch clover. By the time we injected the 4th animal, the first one was bloated so bad, we couldn't get a rubber hose down it's throat to stop the bloat. In short, all 4 died within 20 minutes. The worst part was that us 2 students and the prof had to butcher all 4 critters right then. To this day, I can't look at white Dutch clover without cringing.