Vermont?

[ejb]

Just starting to think about a move to vermont...I live in the berkshires area of western, mass, which in a lot of ways is very similar to VT, but none-the-less is still part of massachusetts /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif I have a nice big place here(lots of land), but the writing is on the wall already in terms of development pressures in the not to distant future. That combined with the cronic tax and spend government is making me rethink things...

Anyway, I know of you guys live in VT...any recommendations on areas to narrow in on the search?

I'd be ideally looking for an older farm type setup, barns etc, 100 acres or more would be better with a mix of tillable/open and forested lands etc. Condition of the house/buildings is less important to me than the land/location and potential.

Preferably in an area that is less likely to feel too much development pressure in the next few decades (I know no place is immumne) and I don't need to live in any "trendy" area where the prices have already gone thru the roof.

Recommendations on regions to look at, realtors recommendations or even any specifc places for sale would be appreciated.

Also, any big issues facing vermont that I should know about?

Thanks.

 

[DocHeb]

My general impression - and its only an impression from this forum - is that the people in Vermont don't want anybody else moving there /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif.

 

[rancar]

You might want to explore Vermont's northeast kingdom, or somewhere where Boondox lives in the northern part of the state. Forget the Bennington, Brattleboro, Arlington, and Manchester areas. Land and/or homes in these areas have already skyrocketed well out of range of most middle income wage earners. I've also heard they have some kind of extensive land use regs and laws in place that control somewhat how one can use or develop their land. Boondox might be more familiar with this than I am.

.....Bob

 

[ejb]

>>Vermont don't want anybody else moving there

Probably true...better get in before the pass a law forbiding it though /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[beenthere]

I think you can run, but I don't think you can hide (from the tax man and those who want to control your land). Remember the popular song "This land is your land, this land is MY land".
Others want you to own it, and let them decide on how you will operate it and charge you mucho taxes to do it for them. I hope that doesn't sound too negative.
/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[Justaplain]

Doc heb: The reason for that is 75% of them have not lived there 20 years.. Last man in wants to lock the door!!! /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[OverlyRun]

I'd be cautious about Vermont...once Governor Dean becomes President Dean, the whole place might get as cutesy as Kennebunkport, Maine.

I've been to Kyrgystan....the taxes are low (Government can't collect em too well) and they don't spend it on things that benefit most people. There is lots and lots of space and mountains that beat the heck out of the Berkshires or the Green Mountains in Vermont. One of several drawbacks: I didn't see any compact tractor dealers.

I'd guess you've got to get pretty far into the Northeast Kingdom in Vermont to find prices that would induce you to give up a great spread in the Berkshires. Of course if you did, there would be easy access to canoeing on the upper Connecticut, skiing and hiking in both NH and VT....mmmm

Good luck...hope the Vermonters haven't already slammed the door.

 

[rancar]

<font color="blue">"...once Governor Dean becomes President Dean,..."</font>

You mean....if he becomes President, don't you? /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

 

[rancar]

<font color="blue">"...Condition of the house/buildings is less important to me than the land/location and potential....Preferably in an area that is less likely to feel too much development pressure in the next few decades...any big issues facing Vermont that I should know about..."</font>

You may want to also familiarize yourself with the information in the following link. This may assist in your 'relocation' decision.

Vermont Land Use Laws -- Smart Growth

 

[alan40]

Ejb, here's some of the downsides to living in Vt. High tax's. /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif Now the upside. I live in Fairfield Vt right in the center of dairy country. It's beautiful and but a bummer to try and get building permits. Good old boy network you know!
We're about 12 miles from St. Albans pop.8000. 45 minutes from Burlington the largest city and a hour away from Montreal. It's the best place for us to raise our boys. Now if you want out of the way somewhat try Eden, Morrisville, Elmore or Wolcott. Not much employmet but alot of land. Almost all of this is considered Northeast Kingdom.
We don't try to keep everyone out only the ones with no tractors!! /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif We now have a new Gov and he's just got on board so who knows whats next.
His big thing right now is no property tax for farmers and big spending cuts in many social sevices areas. Just what I read in the paper anyway. No offense meant to anyone. /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
Take care

 

[Justaplain]

dON't forget Deans liberal marriage laws? [if you call it a plus]

the old curmudgeon

 

[Egon]

Have you considered Northern Saskatewan. Land is inexpensive and if you want solitude thats avalable to. Lots of lakes but no Mountains.

Egon

 

[Boondox]

Well, employment would be a problem. Generally the jobs (and the voting block) center around the Burlington area, and most out of staters tend to settle there. I think the fact that Chittenden County is the most populous county (as Chittenden County votes, so votes the state), the most liberal by far, has the most personal wealth, and is populated these days in the majority by people from away...has a lot to do with the "us vs them" attitude. Civil union was a classic example -- it passed in the greater Burlington area and virtually nowhere else, but that was enough to make it law. But Burlington is one of the nicest cities I've been to if city living is what you want.

Your criteria (low development pressure) would rule that area out, though, as well as the southern counties and the interstate corridors -- all of which are becoming bedroom communities for long distance commuters.

As others have said, the Northeast Kingdom is feeling the least pressure from developers. And the natives really don't bite as long as you don't try to bring Boston/New York/Baltimore with you. I'm a California transplant. At first the locals stayed away. But when they learned I was a Marine, could shoot well, could handle a chainsaw, and didn't want to change a thing they warmed right up to me and now count me as a friend.

It's a great life up here on my hill with my wife, pets, and livestock. At certain times of the year the tourist pressure gets pretty hard to take (why must people park in the middle of the road, for instance, while taking pictures?), but get them out of their cars and most folks are downright decent. I think living in a big city folks tend to drive more aggressively than those in the country, and that rubs at times. We meet some great people from all over the world walking down our road, though, and have penfriends now in sixteen different countries that were met right here on our hill.

Good farmland is getting pretty hard to find, however. The best is in the valleys, and of course the valleys are the first to be developed. Hillside farms like ours grow mostly rocks, and as a result there are none of the large scale farms you see in upstate NY.

Heck, it's too hard to explain all this in a post. Why don't you just come up for a visit some weekend?

Pete

 

[PhilNH5]

ejb,
We have a camp up on Ticklenaked Pond (just love that name) in Ryegate Vermont. We used the following web site as a major tool for our reale estate search.
Northern New England Real Estate Network

It was a great resource. Kept up to date and most listings have pictures. You can search by state, city, land or residential.

One word of caution. VT realtors seem to be more optimistic than I was. I usually explained that we were looking for a summer place with the aim to retire there eventually. I also told them I was from SE NH and was 2 to 3 hours away. So I wanted to be sure the property was worth the trip up. One trip we had to stop our 4x4 and walk the last mile up a mountain. The cabin was held to the side of the mountain with chains and come alongs wrapped around trees. Not exactly retirement qaulity. Next property on that same trip was on a protected swamp (no more building allowed) with a run down shack. So make sure you ask ponted questions.


Phil

 

[Dozernut]

One plus for Vermont, Larry,Daryl and Daryl live there. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[ejb]

Thanks all for the help with VT.

Does sound like the father north you go, the more land you can get for less money...unfortunately it seems, it is probably that much colder, right? I can talk my wife into a lot of things, but a significant drop in average temperature is probably not one of them... /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Curious about the tax situation, someone mentioned that the taxes were "high"...curious what that means?(for some reason I had the im,pression that taxes were *low* in VT) High property taxes? high income taxes? What is the state income tax tax rate (mass is about 5-6%), and a typical property tax is just under 2% of assessed value, so a $400K house for example would have property taxes around $8k (varies by town).

Your soil situation sounds like mine exactly...I don't live in the CT river valley were there are miles and miles of rich soil with nary a stone to be found...my place is a "hillside" farm, extremly rocky and very poor clay soil...it makes sense that any place where the soil is good, its all that more likely that housing developments are going to be the main crop. Guess if I had to pick between houses and rocks, I'd take the rocks...I should count my blessings.


A move to vermont, if it happens at all, would probably take me 2-3 years at least, so at this point, just in the info gathering stage...but I appreciate all the helpful information.

 

[OverlyRun]

<font color="blue"> You mean <font color="red"> if </font> he becomes President, don't you? </font>

I wanted to see if anyone would bite. But the hook had no barb. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[loner]

Good un! Dang near forgot about that crew.Had a ARMY buddy from VT. Ya, we called him DARYL,HA!HA!, Thanks for the rethink.He was a keeper fer sure ,even If he was a yankee.

 

[Youare]

Why don't you check out the realestate just across the river in the land of the White Mountians. There is no sales tax, yet and land taxes are not much different than what Vermont's taxes are approaching. New Hampshire does not have Act 250 which can be a real pain should you what a building permit.

I work in the southeast corner of Vermont and I compare the difference between there and southwestern New Hampshire where I live
.
Both states are great places to live and would not be too much different than the Bershires as far as the land goes.

Good luck.
Randy