The Ferguson System and PTO Engagement

[Cahaba Valley Farm]

Can anybody explain to me how the PTO had anything to do with pulling a ground engaging implement?

 

[K5lwq]

The PTO disengaged the hydraulics taking away the ability to lift the implement. Because all the weight was now on the ground the tractor lost traction. With the PTO engaged the hydraulics worked again and the system could raise the implement putting weight on the tractor so it would get traction.

Fun video.

 

[AWSubie]

The pto system on the early Ferguson and Ford tractors was not “live”. In order to have hydraulics u must have the pto engaged.

When using a ground implement that is attached to the three-point u do not need to have the pto engaged.

If u hit a hard spot that causes the rear wheels to start spinning and lose traction u can engage the pto which then provides hydraulic pressure.

When you attempt to go forward again the control spring will sense the ground trying to hold the tractor back and raise the implement which in turn unloads the rear of the tractor and, usually, allows the tractor to gain traction again.

 

[milkman636]

Furgeson pioneered the three point hitch geometry. The lower lift arms pivot points were placed forward and below the rear axles. When the drafted load increased it had the effect of converting engine torque into additional down pressure on the tires. To further assist in the tough spots, the compression load on the upper link spring also caused the draft control to raise the lift arms and implement to decrease ground engagement, reduce the drafted load, and transfer more implement weight onto the rear tires. As the drafted load decreased the lower lift arms would lower to increase the amount of ground engagement. It was pure genius and Ford copied it. One difference between Ford and Ferguson though was that Ford used an engine driven hydraulic pump. Hydraulic power for the lift arms was available when the engine was on. Ferguson used a transmission driven hydraulic pump. So with a Ferguson if the clutch was pushed the hydraulics for the lift arms and draft sensing didn’t work.

 

[Cycledude]

Ford attempted to steal the Ferguson patented system , at the time the resulting lawsuit was about the biggest lawsuit in history and Ford lost.

 

[CobyRupert]

I drove my first Ford 2N a month or so ago. I had to get it off a trailer. No instructions. I figured out how to get it started, but couldn’t get the 3 point hitch and landscape rake to raise.
Took a minute to figure that clutch had to be let out for 3 pth to operate.
Doesn’t that mean pump was in transmission?

 

[Cycledude]

Yes pump is built in under the seat but PTO needs to be running to make the pump work

 

[Cahaba Valley Farm]

Ferguson used a transmission driven hydraulic pump. So with a Ferguson if the clutch was pushed the hydraulics for the lift arms and draft sensing didn’t work.

How strange. I never knew such a design like that was in existence.

 

[Cahaba Valley Farm]

Yes pump is built in under the seat but PTO needs to be running to make the pump work

I thought a transmission driven PTO was as basic as it could get but this takes it to a whole another level. That design definitely left a lot of room for improvement.

 

[LD1]

Cool video.

Others have already answered the question.

In modern times, we are so accustomed to live hydraulics and 3PH at our fingertips that we often forget that this was once unheard of. And a new concept.

When first implemented the 3PH (ferguson system) those tractors didnt have any other hydraulics or hydraulic requirements. So the hydraulic pump didnt run all the time. It had to be engaged to have hydraulics. Since it was driven off the PTO....turning on the PTO turned on the hydraulics.

Revolutionary at the time....but long since outdated by modern live hydraulics and live/independent PTO