Pulling Power of a JD4100???

[Anonymous Poster]

I was trying to find out how hard I can pull using a 5/16 chain behind my new 4100 using the drawbar? For pulling small trees out of the ground? Can I leave a little slack and drive away and "pop" the tree out? Is it better to take up slack and go slowly? I tried going slowly and got wheel spin and did not do much? How strong is the drawbar?

 

[Bird]

Carl, you're not likely to hurt the drawbar; it's probably about the strongest point in that hookup. However, think twice and consider all the other possibilities, of which there are many. Which ones will, or will not, be a problem depends on lots of things. Pulling trees out with a small tractor is a tough job. How much slack will you leave in the chain? How fast will you be going when you hit the end of it? If the chain breaks, is it going to snap forward and get you? If the chain holds, and so does the tree, is it going to throw you forward into the steering wheel? And how hard are you going to jar everything; yourself and the tractor? I've done a little bit of what you're proposing, but don't like to and can't recommend it.

Bird

 

[Thomas]

Carl, I agree w/ Bird 110%...just be careful.

Maybe if you dig around the stump than loosen the stump up w/ the FEL,or cut off some roots you have better luck.

A tractor can only take so much than it will cost $$$. /w3tcompact/icons/frown.gif

Thomas..NH /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif

 

[JiminMI]

Carl...I agree with Bird also, but the real problem is when the chain snaps. On this matter, I have had some experience. The chain rockets forward and usually cracks the skull about half way down... BE SURE, again, BE SURE to put a blanket, jacket, anything heavy midway the lenght of the chain to prevent "snapback"..
On the pulling strenght, your tractor will run out of traction before you damage the tractor, assuming that you don't take a running start on the chain. Take out the slack and then "let her have it"...
Be safe...

Jim

 

[jyoutz]

The root system of even a 3" diameter tree would amaze you. Unless the soils are saturated, or you dig or cut some roots, I don't think that a compact tractor is appropriate for pulling trees. Only four things I know of to remove trees: chainsaw, backhoe, dozer, beaver.

 

[DFB]

If I remember right beavers don't always come out on top either. http://www.tractorbynet.com/forumfiles/6-20669-beaver.jpg. Thanks Gordon

 

[john4nh]

Carl I would have to agree with the rest, but if thats all you got thats al you got. Try to catch the tree high with a long chain so you will have the tree to act as levarage against itself. I would definitely recommend if your gonna do it to put something on the chain in case it does break. I would not leave lots of slack in the chain neither but a little you would probally have to, so you could get the tree to go your way. i have done this but with a much heavier tractor. It worked most of the time.. Depending on how many you have to get down it may be better to hire someone and not beat up that new JD.. Be safe

 

[TomG]

I guess most people said that pulling down trees with tractors is a bad idea, but then proceeded to give advice on how to do it. Good advice. As far as I know, that's the way to use a drawbar and most of the safety issues involved were noted.

I'm going to be different and say: 'Yes that's how to use a drawbar and chain,' but don't do it in this case. Chainsaws are for taking down and cutting up trees, and really; how many times is it absolutely impossible to tolerate a stump?

However, without a backhoe, stumps are traditionally removed by digging down with a shovel and cutting several major roots on one side. Then, a stump might be pulled out with a tractor. A backhoe just makes the digging easier.

Dynamite, or black power, was an even more traditional solution but one that is not available to the unlicensed now. Basically, for a tree of any size, the stump is a lot of work is hard on equipment and isn't very safe. It's often easier to just live with the stump.

 

[dmccarty]

Carl,

I have been getting quite a few stumps out of the ground with my 4700, JD 48 backhoe and a 4n1 FEL.

I'm getting out hardwood and pine stumps that are from inch to 36 inches. One large pine stump, without a taproot took well over eight hours, mainly since I was learning how to dig large stumps. 36 inch oak stumps take me about 2 to 3 hours. I have red and white oak trees/stumps. I've noticed that one type has very large buttress roots and the other does not. This makes a big difference on hard it is to remove the stump. Last weekend I got out a 36 inch stump with the large roots and it all but exceeded the ability of the tractor and implements. I COULD NOT move stump and ball out of its hole after it had been dug out with the backhoe. Pulling with chains or pushing and lifting with the FEL would not get it out. I had to move it 12 inches at a time with the back hoe, move the tractor, and repeat until it the stump was positioned so I could push it into a burn pile.

I'm hoping you don't have 36inch stumps because you ain't gonna be able to move them with a 4100.

Trees and their stumps are amazing. Some stumps like cedars I can just pop out of the ground with the FEL since they have shallow root systems. Pines with tap roots I can pull out like teeth with the 4n1 bucket up to 4 inches or so. If I push over saplings, 3-4 inch pine trees maybe 10 feet tall, I can sometime get the stump out. Sometimes the tree breaks off and I have to use the 4n1. Some hardwoods have tap roots that are just as big as the pine tap roots. The hardwood stumps with a tap root I have to dig out with th back hoe.

Most stumps of my stumps are cut low to the ground. If I hit them with the FEL the tractor just sits and the tires spin. Little 3-4 inch stumps will do this. If you have low stumps like this you will have to dig them out somehow preferably with a backhoe.

I have talked with a couple of people about blowing stumps out of the ground including the owner of a explosives company and one of his employees I saw working a project. I have been told that it is possible for someone to walk in off the street and buy dynamite. I'm still skeptical but I have been told that by people who should know. The problem is finding a company that will do it. The company I mentioned above does NOT sell to the public becase the Insurance policy does not permit such as sale. There is a local company that I have heard that MIGHT make such a sale. The owner of the explosives company does NOT blow out stumps for liability reasons. I could see this if the stumps were in a subdivision but I'm a good 600 feet to the nearest structure.

Even if you can get the stuff that goes boom you need to know what you are doing. I found some training manuals and I know a couple of people who have done this so I gave it some consideration. But so far my equipment is doing what I need it to do so I'm staying away from The Stuff That Goes Boom.

Stump removal is a pain. It will either take a little bit of money to get the equipment you need to get them out AND a lot of YOUR time. Or just alot of YOU money to hire someone to do the job. Take your pick which you wish to spend, time or money.

I made my choice and I should be on the tractor instead of talking about working the tractor! But I have all weekend to work.

If you don't have a backhoe I think the chances of removing stumps that are cut low to the ground and medium sized, say 10-18 inches are going to be impossible for a 4100 to remove. If you get out a shovel and spend alot of time and energy you might be able to get it done but it wont be fun. If you have the option of cutting the trees off three or four feet off the ground then you have a chance of pulling them out with a chain and your 3PH or pushing them over. By pulling with a 3ph I don't mean moving the tractor forward to get the stump out THAT IS DANGEROUS AND CAN FLIP THE TRACTOR. If you have enough trunk left on the stump you can wrap a chain around the trunk and lift with the 3PH it might pull the stump out. I have pulled many a fence post this way. But I have not tried this with a stump.

I'm off to work on the property. I need to get some more firewood, we burnt half a cord in the last week warming the house! I may go after some stumps as well today. So much to do and not enough time!

Good Luck and be safe...
Dan OffToWorkTheTractor McCarty

 

[TWINKLE_TOES]

Carl,

I cleared my place by hand with an axe, shovel, chain saw, and midnight oil(diesel). The stumps were primarily maple and alder. I would fell the tree's, dig down below grade on the stump clean it up with an axe and cut it off below grade with the saw, add a little 34/0/0 fertilizer cover it over and presto no stump. In this area (western Wa. very wet) below grade stumps decompose quickly. This works for pasture but obviously won't work if you want to plow.
My place was logged in ~ 1920 and has some humungous Cedar stumps, most still show the notches cut in the base for insertion of a board to stand on when the tree was cut. I call it a "spring board" Gordon probably knows the right name. This was done to get above the pitch in the base of the tree. All of these stumps have Huckleberries growing from the stump. For reason not understood by me they also have many varieties of wild flowers found no where else.
Bottom line these stumps are really attractive and taste good to./w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif