oil for Farmall A

[RobertN]

I'm picking up the oil filter for my "new" Farmall A. What oil should I use? I haev a manual on order, but hasn't come in yet... Oh' it only has a couple hours since rebuild...

For my B8200 Kubota, I use Delo-400 multi weight. Will this work in the Farmall?

RobertN in Shingle Springs Calif

 

[art]

You could use any gas engine oil with little or no trouble but I would stick with a straight weight 30. I know that there was not a multi-grade oil when the tractor was built. You could use a multi-weight oil if you are not using the tractor under hard conditions.

 

[JerryG]

Robert, we wore out more than one Farmall 140 over the years, which is the same tractor (just bigger). We always put straight 30W in it. Any thing that I use straight 30W in, I use Pennzoil or Valvoline. I have had good luck with both in gas powered equipment.
JerryG

 

[Anonymous Poster]

I have a Farmall 140 and have used Rotella 15W- 30 in it for many years with no problem.

 

[Bird]

Robert, if that tractor were burning oil, I'd agree with the other guys about the straight SAE 30W oil, but if it's just been rebuilt and in good condition, if it were mine, I'd sure put the Delo 400 in it (which is what I use in my Kubota). I have a neighbor who has a Super H and two Super M's (one on LPG) and he uses the same Rotella 15W-40 that he uses in his diesel International and Oliver.

Bird

 

[art]

Bird what you are talking about is a big no-no. There are two things that differ between gas and diesel engine oils. Gas oils don't need ash or the bright metals that the Diesels do. The ash will build up on valves and cause them to burn. The diesel uses them to help control the damage from the partially burnt fuel of a cold diesel engine. You might not be using the tractors enough to cause the problem to surface quickly but you will!!!

 

[JerryG]

Art,
This is what I like the most about this place. The longer that I have been here, the more things I learn. I always knew that there was some oil that was to be used only in diesels, but I didn’t know what was different about the formulation. Now I do.
JerryG

 

[geneP]

Art, My kubota manual calls for 10w30 w/a cc/cd classification. Of course, there is no such animal now. The previous owner told me he had been using Valvoline 10W30, changing about twice a year. The tractor is about 14 years old and has 1000 hrs on it. I removed the valve cover to check valve lash, and you won't believe how clean it was. Since there is no 10W30 diesel oil (that I can find) is the Valvoline likely to be causing any hidden damage to bearings, etc? Is there an oil I should be using? Thanks for inserting your knowledge here. I,too, am amazed at the knowledge of the board participants.

 

[Bird]

Art, you may be right; I sure don't claim to an expert on oils, but the Delo 400 has the SJ rating as well as the CH-4 rating, and it says on the container, "exceeds warranty requirements for all gasoline, diesel, and turbo charged engines" etc. And of course you can get it in a straight 30W although I use the 15W-40 in my tractor. I'm still using Quaker State 10W-40 in my gasoline engines. You know in the early 80s (and I don't know for how long), the Quaker State oil had the CC/CD rating, but dropped their diesel ratings some time ago (I don't know when). I called Quaker State's technical support folks and was told it was just fine to use in a diesel engine, but because of the ash, it should be changed more frequently. Of course, I'm not doing it; I prefer staying with the manufacturer's recommendations, but sometimes manuals get out of date, since Kubota manuals still call for the CC/CD rating and I don't know how you could find such now.

Bird

 

[RobertN]

Interesting...

I would have assumed to use a diesel oil would be ok, becuase of the extra additives they put in for higher heat and pressures.

I know recent articles in motorcycle magazines have pushed me to either Harley or RevTech oil in my bike. The newer car/water cooled engines don't need the additives they used to have. Those additives are harsh on Cat convertors too. Those additives were important in air cooled engines though, which tend to run hotter.

I have heard grumblings that a deisel oil is better to use in a air cooled engine if factory oils are not available, since they have the additives for the hotter running engines.

RobertN in Shingle Springs Calif

 

[Bird]

RobertN, in 1973 I bought a new Winnebago motor home that had an Onan generator for auxiliary power (gasoline powered, air cooled generator, of course). Very shortly after the first oil change, I noticed the exhaust was smoking and I was having to add oil. I took it to the authorized Onan service center in Dallas in July and when I went back to get it, they had left it running in the heat for 24 hours, after simply changing oil in it; no smoke. I had used the same 10W-30 oil that I was using in the chassis engine and they told me that was the problem. Even though it was a gasoline engine, it needed to have a motor oil rated for diesels, or as they called it "diesel lube." I never had another problem with that generator after I changed to a motor oil rated for diesels.

Bird

 

[art]

Bird on your generator you had not run the engine hard enough to seat everything in right. What they did by running it at full throttle was to heat every thing up and get it to seat the rings and clean the cylinder walls.

 

[art]

Bird we also sell Pennzoil and Quaker State oils and on there quote, (better oils) they do have both the S ratings and the C ratings. That says that they will produce well for 3000 miles in either. Back in the early 70's Viscosity oil and IH went at testing oils there goal was 3000hours on a diesel and 1500hours on a gas engine. They found they had to remove the ash from the oil to get past 700hours on the gas engine to stop the valves from burning. The diesel they had to add ash to slow cylinder wall and piston build up. We have in the past taken care of cylinder glazing by installing gas engine oil to a diesel engine. What a diesel needs today is a CF or H will replace your CD rating. Lower end or rod and main wear can be increased by the wrong oil because the oils do have additives that wear out. I don't as a rule like multi-weight oils as they will break down on the vicosity on hard running engines like in agriculture.

 

[Bird]

art, you could be right about the generator; I don't recall how much use it'd had, but it was a single cylinder 2.5kw Onan, used primarily to run one 10k BTU air-conditioner and a coffee maker, and after changing to Exxon Dieselube 40W, never had another problem.

I grew up with a Dad who owned a Texaco service station, then sold it and bought a Mobil service station, and we also had an auto parts house, so I read lots of the trade journals, test reports, etc. but that was 40 years ago. Twenty years ago, part of my responsiblities was fleet management for a 300+ vehicle fleet, and I regularly attended the annual National Association of Fleet Managers (Law Enforcement Group) Conferences, read their journals, etc. So, like I said, I don't have any technical expertise and my experience is dated, but I've been using multiple viscosity oils, either 10W-30 or 10W-40 for 40 years, Quaker State for the past 20 years in gasoline engines, Delo 400 in diesel, and (knock on wood) I've never owned an oil burner and never had to pull the pan or heads on any vehicle I've owned. As to which is best; depends on which company's tests you read about. Lots of different opinions and I guess if there was agreement instead, there wouldn't be so many different products.

Anyway, I don't disagree with anything you've said. But of course, I'm just staying with what I know has worked well until I have strong evidence to the contrary.

Bird

 

[art]

Bird I learned a long time ago if the shoe fits wear it. When people are not having good luck it's time to change and your program seems to be working right now so stick with it. If you think about uses farm is nearly 100% full throttle full load. Trucks are considered 1/3 throttle 1/3 load and auto's 1/4 & 1/4. This does leave a bit of difference for design of oils and of coarse use is a critical part.

 

[Bird]

Art, for right now I'm in favor of continuing as is, but I appreciate the information you posted, know that a lot of my information is dated, and things really are changing (too rapidly for an old man to keep up with sometimes), so I may need to change too some day.

Bird

 

[chuckp]

Art:
I agree with your arguments for the diesel vs gasoline. But let me pose another facet. For older gasoline tractors, should that 30W oil be non-detergent or high detergent.

Chuck