Tires Mixing turf and R1 tires on 4WD CUT?

John_Mc · Jun 4, 2003

My brother-in-law scrounged up a free Ford 1510 by being in the right place at the right time (and having someone who owed him a favor).

He showed me a picture of it, and I noticed there are turf tires on the rear, and R1's on the front. He is almost always running on sand or sandy soil, and does not use 4WD on pavement. From his description (left some pretty good black rubber marks when he once ran over a cement slab in 4WD) it sounds as though the diameters are mismatched for the gearing (though the tractor does appear to be level front-to back from the photo). I'm wondering how much damage he could be doing due to the mismatched tires if he limits 4WD to sandy soil. Any comments?

Also, I noticed from the photo that the front tires are on backwards... the tread is pointing the wrong way on the R1's. I pointed this out to him. He won't be back down there to work on the tractor till next fall. In the mean time, we're wondering: do turfs on the rear work better in sand? (Wider tires may avoid sinking in?) Is there a chance that the R1's on the front were put on backwards on purpose? Perhaps this is some trick to improve traction in sand that we never heard of? In sand, he doesn't have any problem with the treads "loading up" like they would in mud or clay. Any thoughts on this?

John Mc

thcri · Jun 4, 2003

John_Mc,

I wished I could find a previous post on mis-matching of tires. There really is some good information there. But from what I got out of it mixing tires is a no no and really hard on your drive system.

murph

Anonymous Poster · Jun 5, 2003

I have a friend who tore the ring gear out of the front differential on his bota. The ring gear alone was 900.00. A lot cheaper to get the right sized tires.

frank_f15 · Jun 5, 2003

not an expert on tires(or anything for that matter) but can not imagine why u would want to run turfs on the back and ags on the front, or why they would be on backwards? /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif think u might best check with a dealer, either way he decides to go, he only has to replace 2 tires. /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

Anonymous Poster · Jun 5, 2003

Don't worry about damage to the tires - think about the front gears! Very, very hard on the drivetrain, and that is a bunch of $$$$ parts.

Some folks put tires on 'backwards' on combines. You drove in to the wet field until it spun, then put it in reverse & backed out.

I make a manure pile on a down-slope from the barn. Come to think of it, mounting the tires backwards would help me back up that hill again.

I believe in 2wd you have slightly better steering with those front tires backwards.

With turfs on the back, perhaps it was an effort to lower the heavy traction load on the front end, by de-rating the front tires.

In any event, get matching tires. On a big farm tractor, you get one flat, you replace all 4 tires. Even 10% tire wear is too much difference, will ruin the drivetrain. Cut's are more forgiving, but why push your luck that far outside the lines?

--->Paul

s1120 · Jun 5, 2003

(left some pretty good black rubber marks when he once ran over a cement slab in 4WD) 

Here you go, here's your ansor. If the size is that far off, that it was spinning, or draging a tire,its doing damange. In "just" sand, it would not be a "huge" thing, but as you wrote, there are things in the sand. Being that it was a free tractor, I would say spring for the new tires. Its money well spent. Tires may be costly, but they are cheeper than the hard parts that will break.

WVBill · Jun 5, 2003

I have exactly this arrangement (Turfs rear, R1's front) on my Kubota B6100 4wd. BUT when I did it, thanks to cautions and advice I got here on TBN, I was very careful to make sure the rolling ratio of the tires is correct for the gear ratio. Therefore I have no scuffing or wind-up in 4wd on hard surfaces (although I avoid 4wd on hard surfaces anyway).

I put the turf tires on the back because the B6100 has a very narrow footprint and I wanted to get it wider ("vider es better" /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif ) for stability. My Father-in-law gave me the tractor but made me promise to do this because he had tipped it over a couple of times in the 22 years he owned it.

I think it's a good combination. When I put it in 4wd I do it for traction so having the aggressive tread of the ags on the front makes sense.

I don't mow with the tractor but I've been all over my yard with it doing other things and the front ags do not scuff the grass unless I have a load in the FEL and am turning tight - but that doesn't surprise me.

markct · Jun 5, 2003

often on industrial loader tractors they put the front tires on backwards to help you back out of a downhill spot or a soft spot when ya have weight in the bucket

RobertN · Jun 5, 2003

I have turfs front, R4 on back of my Kubota b8200. I could only afford one set at a time.

So... I spent some time on the Firestone and Goodyear web pages. I was able to find out what the overall diameter was of my front turf tires. I found the diameter for the proper sized R4 for the front. They were withing 0.5". Then I looked at diameters of the existing rear turfs, and looked up the numbers for the Goodyear R4 to replace them. They were withinless than 1". I found there seemed to be about a 1" window of margin within the range of diameter for the proper size tire, whether it was R1, R4, or turf. That is, the stock tire spec's for my tractor.

It sounds like you have a tire that is outside that spec range. Get the right size tire, before you blow out the transfer case or one of the ring and pinions. Mix types as you like, but match those diameters properly...

John_Mc · Jun 5, 2003

( I wished I could find a previous post on mis-matching of tires. There really is some good information there. But from what I got out of it mixing tires is a no no and really hard on your drive system.)

Let me know if you come across that post again. I know mixing is generally not a great idea, UNLESS you can match the original diameter ratio between the front and rear. It sounds from his description as if this is not the case. Hopefully, the fact that he is always operating in sand when he uses 4WD will save him (the tractor is on an island in the Bahamas).

John Mc