John Deere power-tech and bio or veggie oil

DPic105 · Apr 24, 2008

Need questions answered by someone smarter than me!
1. Can you run a JD power-tech 3 cyl engine on bio or veggie oil?
2. What happens if you run it on straight, cleaned, veggie oil?
3. Has anyone done this?

I just purchased a 5203 and am SICK of paying the high costs of diesel fuel. I have friends that run straight, cleaned veggie oil in their equipment (JD950, Kubota tractors, Cat excavator,numerous Ford 7.3's and 6.0's) They all claim that nothing bad will happen. I am a liitle "put off" about putting veggie into a brand new engine.
Any insight would be appreciated.

Solo · Apr 24, 2008

I thought the motor had to be at a certain temp. before straight veggie oil could be used as fuel? Sorry this isn't an answer to your question.

Solo

Wherewolf · Apr 24, 2008

Rudolf Diesel's original "diesel" engine ran on peanut oil. The issue with veggie oil is viscosity - if the oil is heated to 180deg then it's viscosity is like regular diesel fuel. A great deal of Car/Truck conversions that run on Veggie oil use a dual tank system, and use a water circuit off the engine that runs thru a copper coil in the veggie tank to keep the oil at 180 deg. (Some also use a water heater element for a while in the morning to heat up the oil prior to starting so the engine doesn't have to heat up all that oil - and the water coil then keeps it hot.)

They start on Diesel, warm up the oil - then via a dual tank switch, swap over to veggie - run all day - then prior to shutdown, they switch back to diesel allowing the diesel to replace any veggie in the injector pump, lines and injectors - do they don't gel with veggie overnight and plug.

It's not that complicated - plumbing the dual tank system is probably the hardest part, since you need separate pumps, fuel filters and separate returns to the fuel tank to prevent mixing of oil and diesel - but the right crossover valve handles that anyway.

I wouldn't worry about oil doing harm to the engine, it provides more lubrication than diesel does, although it's slightly less powerful - slight reduction in max horepower - it sure smells good.

You can find more info in a book called "From the Fryer to the Fuel Tank" which explains how to make biodiesel yourself.

One further note to clarify: Biodiesel is veggie oil that has been alterted via chemical "transterification" (Lye and Methenol, mixed, heated, separated and cleaned) to remove the "Fats" and it's consistancy is similar to regular diesel fuel. Straight Veggie oil is what I was referring to in the heated tank situation in my comments above.
If you are able to obtain waste veggie oil to use, please keep in mind the cost of fuel filters, and add that into your evaluation - you will go thru them often and they are not cheap either.

Hope this helps

Wherewolf

RWolf · Apr 25, 2008

I'm also not looking forward to paying over $4 a gallon. I went through my JD manual last night and the safe answer is no more than B5 (5% mix). I've seen other posts that say up to B20 is ok. Straight veggie oil would be great but unless something changes soon I'll probably wait until the warranty runs out.

deere755 · Apr 26, 2008

I just posted a week or so ago about this . My JD shop foreman says he does not recommend bio at all. I am not saying he is right just what he told me. He bieleves it is hard on pumps, injectors, and he also said the shelf life is very short. I am not sure I agree with this a 100% but I am just passing it along. I would ask your dealer before I did anything.

DPic105 · Apr 27, 2008

Thanks for the info. I seem to get a diffrent answer from every person that I ask! Maybe its just to soon to know what will happen, however, it is true that the diesel was invented to run on filtered peanut oil, so it kinda makes you wonder.
I just purchased a 5203, (it still hasn't gotten here yet) and I don't want to do anything that would mess up the warranty from JD.

bjcsc · Apr 27, 2008

The viscosity issue with straight oil (SVO) is easily overcome by heating it and starting up/shutting down like wherewolf posted. The potential problem with it is coking the head. The transesterification of the SVO by the biodiesel process removes the glycerin which actually settles out of the solution. If you research this a bit, you'll find three camps on this issue: One believes the glycerin won't cause any problems, one believes that it hasn't been used long enough to decide one way or the other, and the last believes it is harmful to the engine. You'll find cases of people running it for years without problems and cases of people who ran it for short periods and coked their heads and ruined their engines.

It's moot anyway. You're buying a new tractor and you can't risk it under warranty. But, you're not going to be burning as much as you might think. If you are burning a lot, just think about the money you're saving vs. hiring out and that will make you feel better!