JD4010 (gas) won't start, acts like out of gas

[wcbpolish]

I have a John Deere 4010 (field tractor), with a gas engine.
I am having issues with getting it to run.
I MAY have run it out of fuel (I personally don't think I ran it dry, but may have)
It acted like it was out of fuel, would not start when fuel added.
Changed fuel filter, good to go, ran for like 2 hours moving round bales. Then it died again, like it was out of fuel, which it very much is NOT out of fuel.
*fuel pump pushes fuel (disconnected at carb, turned ignition, fuel squirted out just fine)
*got carb rebuilt by a local guy who works magic with antique John Deeres
*checked spark on 1 sparkplug, was getting spark.
*Engine seems to be flooding? Lots of gas in the air intake every time I try to start it.
*tried using starting fluid, no difference.
Things I have been told to do, but have not yet:
*run seafoam in fuel (I have some to put in as soon as I get it to run!)
*check all spark plugs (only checked one thus far)
*see if needle is stuck in the carb? (seems like having the carb cleaned and rebuilt should/could have solved this?)
Would it help to try pull starting?

Please note... I'm a complete novice when it comes to fixing engines.

 

[Roadworthy]

Check the float level in your carburetor and be sure the needle valve is capable of stopping fuel flow when float is up. If needle can't turn fuel flow off and on you may have found your problem.

 

[Williy]

If there is a bowl on the carb remove it and see if you have any dirt
in it also use some carb cleaner to spray from top openings in carb
to clean out. I would also purchase a cheap see threw filter to put
in fuel line with a shut off . carb then filter then shut off

willy

 

[rScotty]

On most vintage gas JDs, there is a screen fuel filter somewhere in either the gas tap or the carb. Undo the line to the carb & if gas pours out, that isn't the problem. If it will run for a few minutes after sitting for awhile that is classic fuel filter screen clogging.

Not starting at all when you have spark at the plugs is very probably the carb. From what you are saying sounds like a typical thing. Take the fuel bowl off and clean the crud out of the needle valve and the main jet. Not uncommon to have to do that several times, especially if the fuel filter has been removed.
If you let it set for a month with old gas in the carb and without starting it or turning off the gas tap you can expect it to happen again.

That commonly used "automatic" JD gas tap that works by oil pressure has a diaphram inside of it that is very subject to failure from alcohol in the gas. If you have that tap, swap to a manual one.

BTW, you have one of the best and most reliable field tractors ever built. But modern gas causes many types of problems for old carbs - much of it because their rubber parts were never built to handle gas with alcohol in it. THat includes the fuel lines. You will eventually replace all the bad carb parts with updated materials and it will be reliable again. After all. modern gas cars do just fine.

And by then you will not be a novice anymore.
Just don't give up on a good tractor. It's worth the education.

 

[wcbpolish]

Check the float level in your carburetor and be sure the needle valve is capable of stopping fuel flow when float is up. If needle can't turn fuel flow off and on you may have found your problem.

So... it was just rebuilt, I'm worried about messing anything up.
There's a plate on the bottom back end that has bolts and looks like it could be removed. Let's say I remove it... how do I find the needle valve and float? how do I check that they can stop the fuel?

 

[wcbpolish]

On most vintage gas JDs, there is a screen fuel filter somewhere in either the gas tap or the carb. Undo the line to the carb & if gas pours out, that isn't the problem. If it will run for a few minutes after sitting for awhile that is classic fuel filter screen clogging.

Gas comes out when line is disconnected at carb.

Not starting at all when you have spark at the plugs is very probably the carb. From what you are saying sounds like a typical thing. Take the fuel bowl off and clean the crud out of the needle valve and the main jet. Not uncommon to have to do that several times, especially if the fuel filter has been removed.
If you let it set for a month with old gas in the carb and without starting it or turning off the gas tap you can expect it to happen again.

Please excuse my ignorance...
Is the "fuel bowl" the plate on the back/bottom of the carb? It has 4 bolts and looks like it could be removed. Also, when I open it, how do I clean the crub out? Clean rag? Spray? How do I recognize the needle valve and jet?

That commonly used "automatic" JD gas tap that works by oil pressure has a diaphram inside of it that is very subject to failure from alcohol in the gas. If you have that tap, swap to a manual one.

Again, excuse my ignorance... what is a gas tap?
There is a brass colored shut-off valve by what I assume is the fuel pump. It's one of the kind that if it's parallel to the line, the fuel is on, perpendicular to the line, fuel is off. Should I shut this off when I park the tractor for the winter?

BTW, you have one of the best and most reliable field tractors ever built. But modern gas causes many types of problems for old carbs - much of it because their rubber parts were never built to handle gas with alcohol in it. THat includes the fuel lines. You will eventually replace all the bad carb parts with updated materials and it will be reliable again. After all. modern gas cars do just fine.

There's a gas station in the next town that sells "Rec-90" gas that I think is ethanol free. Is it worth the extra drive and extra cost (she drinks a lot of gas) to get different gas?

And by then you will not be a novice anymore.
Just don't give up on a good tractor. It's worth the education.

 

[rScotty]

So... it was just rebuilt, I'm worried about messing anything up.
There's a plate on the bottom back end that has bolts and looks like it could be removed. Let's say I remove it... how do I find the needle valve and float? how do I check that they can stop the fuel?

"Rebuilt" doesn't mean much in a gas carb. 9 out of 10 times the problem is simply a stuck float - and that doesn't negate the value of the rebuild. But it does mean it is time to do a float job. It can happen after ten minutes or take a year. You have to learn to do this. Post an exploded diagram of YOUR 4010 carb. here - use the tractor serial number to get the right one.
Then anyone of us can show you how.

Yes, all it takes is to take the parts out and spray them or often just wipe them with a clean rag. I usually use acetone on a rag rather than a spray. It is a better solvent, but only an idiot would spray it. very flammeable. Wear gloves to handle any chemcals. The crud that sticks float parts together when it shouldn't is nearly invisible. Half the time you may not even know you've been successful until you try it and it stats. You can usually reuse the float bowl gasket a few times, but not always. So get several gaskets and any O rings or washers you encounter for your carb kit.

I buy my old JD parts from Steiner Tractor Parts online. But there are lots of others. I like the way they do busness - it's a family business.

Carb kits contain dozens of parts you don't need - especilly if yours has been rebuilt recently. AFAIK, nobody makes a kit with just the float bowl parts. But they do sell parts individually and eventually you will see what you need. One spare float, several spare needles and seat pairs, 3 or 4 float bowl gaskets, and whatever O rings and compressible washers you encounter when you open up the float bowl.
Don't worry about getting the float level just exactly right to the fraction of an inch. Close enough is good enough.

Keep carb parts and tools in their own clean carb kit container....you will use them often. Generally there is no need to take the carb off the machine to access the float and needle. You don't have to be a mechanic. It is a ten minute job, and not necessary if you've run it in the last week and also remembered to turn the gas tap OFF. Absolutely always shut off the gas when you stop for the day. Not generally necessary if you stop for less than an hour....but not a bad habit to get into, either

If it won't start, the float is stuck shut. If it overflows, the float is stuck open. The problem is much worse now with modern gas. Modern cars are all fuel injected and tractors mostly diesels. Both of these have allowed the quality of the gas to decline = more alcohol (eats old style elastomers) and more dissolved varnish to coat critical float parts when the gasoline evaporates.

Carb makers know the float and needle are the vulnerable parts, so they make the float and needle easily accessible.
Find a picture of your carb & we can help. There are some good JD mechanics here.

If I missed something, ask again
rScotty

 

[rScotty]

BTW, I believe your operator manual for the 4010 has basic carb maintenance described in it.
But the carb operaton is described in more detail in one of their carb-specific shop manuals.
I recommend both. I may even have both....gotta check my library. But your serial number is the key to parts and manuals both.
Ebay has an active market in old manuals. I like the original printed ones...YMMV.
rScotty

 

[wcbpolish]

But your serial number is the key to parts and manuals both.

where do I find the serial number?

 

[rScotty]

where do I find the serial number?

Generally there is an embossed tag on the frame beside the engine or transmission. But I think the 4010 may have had that serial number plate on the rear of the tractor right above the PTO shaft.

I can't emphasize too much that carbs rarely need a rebuild. They don't wear much and they don't break. What they normally need is cleaning out. And the main thing in any "rebuild" is gaskets plus a new needle and seat. If you can find a $30 kit, it will have those parts and more besides...parts that nobody ever uses.

When I had my shop we had boxes of carb kits all missing the same key parts.
BTW, I would never trade a good OEM carb (core charge) for a new rebuilt carb. Rebuilding the old core is better - that's why they want cores.
rScotty