International 340 track loader - thoughts?

[queen of spades]

I have a line on a couple tractors, one of which is a International 340 loader. The man selling it said that the engine is locked up from sitting 10 years - he mentioned something about water getting in the cylinders - no idea what I'd be getting into there. He did say the engine was rebuilt before it was parked, and that the tractor ran good. The machine comes with a set of brand new clutches that haven't been installed yet.

The tractor is about 2 hours from me, and he is asking $1,500. No pictures, as he is an older gentleman and not up with "modern technology".

How is parts availability for the old 340 crawlers?

Also, he said that his machine has a ROPS cage, but I've yet to see a 340 with a rollover cage installed. Did IH offer this from the factory, or would this be something custom?

 

[DJ54]

Engine and tranny parts should still be available through Case/IH, or aftermarket. The undercarriage will be the tough part. May find some parts through crawlerheaven: Crawler Heaven - Construction Equipment Parts in Palmyra, NY - The Source for All of Your Bulldozer Parts Needs

There is a decent crawler/construction eq. thread at Redpower magazine: Red Power Magazine Community If it's available, those guys will find it, or know where one will be.

With water in the cylinders, you're probably looking at the minimum of a sleeve set, and gasket set. Hopefully it did not bust the block between the cylinders, or block itself.

I'd imagine the ROPS was added by someone.

 

[queen of spades]

Thanks for the links.

What's the difference between a T340 and a TD340?

 

[Foxtrot08]

Alright...

The International 340 came in several flavors, as it replaced the older International single digit and single letter tractors.

The International T6 / TD6 would be the predecessor to what the 340 is. The 340, however is also a wheeled tractor that shares the same engine. Much as the Farmall M, shares the same engine as the T6 and TD6.

Now, first you have to see if it's a T340, or a TD340 - the T is a gasoline engine, the TD340 would be a diesel engine.

Secondly, what year is it?

Third, you would really need to check the condition of the loader parts, who the loader is made by and the condition of the 'track' parts - i.e. final drives, pads, rollers, etc.

The issue with international crawlers (as I have 2 of them on my family's farm, and spent ALOT of time rebuilding each) is this - Engine parts are very, very easy to get. As well as certain other parts that were 'shared' between the tractor family and the crawler family. Transmission parts, engine parts, water pumps, etc. are all fairly available as long as you have a smart dealer that will cross it over. (When we redid the engine on the T6 5 years ago, we ordered all farmall M parts.)

The problems you run into, is everything else on the machine and the loader or blade package.

International made the engines and chassis, everything else was produced by aftermarket manufacturers. Every T series machine (T6 / T9 / T340 etc.) was sold as a 'tractor' first, then whatever you wanted to mount on it, you could. Unfortunately for us, the companies that made 'everything else' are gone. The majority of the IH loaders and dozers were made by 2 companies - Drott and Bucryus-Erie. My blade package on my T6, is a BE, which split companies, which half is gone and half is owned by CAT. Drott, is also nothing more then history - it became part of CASE.

My dad and I (meaning... I) replaced all the grousers on the T6 10-12 years ago. They were pretty much impossible to find, ended up having to have longer pads shipped in then cut down to fit, which gets very, very expensive.

Undercarriage parts are pretty much non-existent anymore unless you have access to a machine shop to make you new pieces.

So really, for $1500 - it depends on how much you want to spend fixing it up time wise and money wise. The engine, from what it sounds - gas or diesel - will need to be rebuilt. Putting new clutches in... is not fun. These machines are very cramped to work on and require a lot of heavy lifting to do.

If you do decide to restore it? Awesome. If not, I don't blame you.

The roll cage is more just like a 'brush' cage, then a roll cage on a track machine. It probably came with whoever made the loader.

 

[queen of spades]

Excellent information. Just what I was looking to hear. This tractor is a TD model, but I do not know the condition of the undercarraige or loader. If it's been sitting 10 years I'm going to assume the worst. He did mention that the tracks (grousers?) had been turned around once.

With a tiny budget, what crawlers would be good starter machines? Something to get my hands dirty with, but that won't give me headaches at the parts counter (ie, nonexistent rollers, ect)?

 

[Foxtrot08]

I've actually been looking now for over 2 years for the exact same thing.

Personally, I want an international T6 / TD6 / T9 / TD9 (Any of those models) with a DROTT 4 in 1 loader to restore. If I could get it with the backhoe... wow. Problem is, everything I've found is rotted.. junk. I don't mind investing time and money, but I'm not going to raise the dead, you know?

International's problem is parts, even in the early/mid 60's when they started making their own loaders. (The machine you're looking at could either have a Drott loader, or an International loader - depending on year made.) Sure, engine parts are around - how many old farmers still have their M around? Or How many people still have a Cub or an A running around? Everything else... blah. Non-existent really. IH and suppliers have changed hands so many times on construction equipment and the like.. no one knows.

CAT is the only equipment brand that they will, get you the part. You might wait a month or so for it, but CAT will have it somewhere.

Mid 1970's Deere's tend to hold up as well, you still see a lot of them running around.

Something like this.. It's hard to say. Track loaders like this have... lots of issues, without further look into what you're looking at. $1500, it's worth that weight in scrap, worse case... But if you want to make it run? Could be simply redoing the engine, sleeves and head gasket. Or, you could be looking at trying to machine parts for it..

 

[queen of spades]

Went out to look at the tractor today. How's the undercarraige look from the pictures? The sprockets look pretty decent, but I'm not sure what constitutes high wear on the links/pins. The grousers seem to be in pretty good shape, from an untrained eye.

Current owner clarified engine issue. He said that he was getting water in the oil when he last used it. He parked it, and the water that was in the oil (he thinks) rusted up the cylinders and stuck the motor. He says he is positive there isn't a cracked block.

I'm not as concerned about the engine since I can still get parts for it apparently. The undercarraige is what I'm most concerned with now.

 

[Foxtrot08]

Replying from my phone, so sorry for any shortness or typos.

First... are the lift cylinders missing? Not seeing them on the loader... which is worrisome.

Second, the final drives are not original, looks to me like someone cut and welded new drive teeth on. I could be mistaken because I am not familiar with the 340s final drives first hand.

Are the rollers in the chains good? The pads look ok, from the pics there is one broken pad, but its notable big deal. With street pads like that, it would be a turtle off road. By chance, what are you looking to use it for? Restoration or actual use? Because this machine, from the looks, seems like a restoration project not a use.

Oh, how is the chain and rollers? Flat spots on the rollers or fairly new?

 

[queen of spades]

This would be my first crawler, and I'm pretty sure I would use this a little around the yard (emphasis on little). Being my first, I am not very clear on what to look for as far as the wear on rollers, ect. The drive sprockets seemed to be in decent shape, but you see some welding so I'm not real sure.

Both cylinders were taken off a couple weeks ago, before I was contacted about possibly buying the machine. It was headed for the scrap yard.

 

[Foxtrot08]

Are the cylinders included with it? (Just taken off.) Or are they completely missing?

If they're gone for good, that would be a deal breaker for me.

For 'around the yard' and a good restoration project, it seems it would be fine to me as long as the cylinders are included.

If you can transport it for a low cost (Your own truck/trailer, or a friends, etc.) At 1000-1500$ it's worth that in scrap if you give up on it.