Hydraulic Float Question

[blueriver]

I took delivery of my new V hay rake today. One hyd cylinder with one hose, the owners manual states ...

"The V rake is designed to be operated with the hydraulic cylinder in the float position allowing the rake beam to float up and down without the cylinder restricting its motion"

Then it goes on to state "If your tractor does not have a float position you will need the second hose option"

So, does the second hose actually allow the float of the cylinder without using the tractor float?

 

[J_J]

If your valve does not have float on the spool, then you could add this valve which is designed as a float valve. Click on drawing to see connection.

https://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?item=9-4352&catname=hydraulic
This valve is a 2000 psi valve.

The valve below will take 2500 psi.

https://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?item=9-7899&catname=hydraulic

 

[blueriver]

Thanks JJ ... neither one of my tractors (I don't think) have the float on the rear remotes ... at least I am aware of.

So again the question is does the second hose actually serve the same purpose?

 

[AKKAMAAN]

Thanks JJ ... neither one of my tractors (I don't think) have the float on the rear remotes ... at least I am aware of.

So again the question is does the second hose actually serve the same purpose?

I do not think here is not enough info about definition of "2nd hose", to answer that...but J_J's valve will work if you plug one port on the float valve...
Drawing

 

[blueriver]

I do not think here is not enough info about definition of "2nd hose", to answer that...but J_J's valve will work if you plug one port on the float valve...
Drawing

Yes the 2nd hose definition is why the question ... I like the valve ... has me questioning things!!

 

[teg]

If he only has a single hose, it would make it an SA cylinder? so the diagram and valve would not work... it's for a DA cylinder... correct?

 

[AKKAMAAN]

If he only has a single hose, it would make it an SA cylinder? so the diagram and valve would not work... it's for a DA cylinder... correct?

see my post...

 

[teg]

I do not think here is not enough info about definition of "2nd hose", to answer that...but J_J's valve will work if you plug one port on the float valve...
Drawing

Plug = close off... Got it, sorry, Plug for me went the other way "plug in" So, we need to know what "2nd hose" means...

 

[J_J]

I do not think here is not enough info about definition of "2nd hose", to answer that...but J_J's valve will work if you plug one port on the float valve...
Drawing

With the the 4 way valve in neutral,

Why would you plug any port on the float valve. The float valve simply allows the fluid in the cyl to draw and push fluid into the tank. It has to have the return line connected, and the two cyl hoses. Am I missing something here. With the knob pushed in, the cyl works normally. Pull the knob out, and the fluid is free to move to and from the tank.

 

[teg]

...and the two cyl hoses. Am I missing something here...

"...One hyd cylinder with one hose..."

One not two...

 

[J_J]

Now I see said the blind man. I missed that SA cyl.

Like AKKAMAAN said, plug one port.

 

[blueriver]

Now I see said the blind man. I missed that SA cyl.

Like AKKAMAAN said, plug one port.

All good advice. The owners manual for the rake states nothing in reference to adding anything other than a second hose.

The hyd cylinder has the place for that second hose and the manual says remove the vent plug and install the second hose ... so I am assuming this allows the cylinder to "self float" ??

 

[JB4310]

I can't help with your plumbing problems, can only point out that my rear remotes have float, you mentioned you were not sure if yours was capable. Mine is on JD 4310 with 3scv off the loader valve.

But that raises a question to myself, if my HTL has a check valve would float work on a cylinder like that? not that I can think now of a use I would need HTL to float.

JB.

 

[J_J]

When you release the valve handle, and go to neutral, the cyl is locked and fluid is blocked. In order to float, the fluid has to be free to move from cyl to tank, and it can do that through the valve I posted.

If that is an SA cyl, the hose they are talking about is just a vent hose. It could also be a DA cyl and they are not using fluid in the rod side of the piston.

 

[J_J]

I can't help with your plumbing problems, can only point out that my rear remotes have float, you mentioned you were not sure if yours was capable. Mine is on JD 4310 with 3scv off the loader valve.

But that raises a question to myself, if my HTL has a check valve would float work on a cylinder like that? not that I can think now of a use I would need HTL to float.

JB.

The check valves allows the cyl to hold. You need pressure to relieve the check. Float would not work with a checked valve.

 

[jinman]

Yes the 2nd hose definition is why the question ... I like the valve ... has me questioning things!!

I think they are saying that by adding the "2nd hose" you turn the cylinder into a DA cylinder and you have to adjust it manually with your non-float valve. You can't turn a non-float system into a float one by adding only a 2nd hose, but you can make the cylinder adjustable in a "non-float" way. That's my take on what they mean. They are saying that non-float, but adjustable via the 2nd hose is better than no adjustment at all.

Of course, if you want to add a 2nd hose and a valve that tees into the pressure side, you could open that valve and allow the cylinder to float while in use and then close the valve to operate the cylinder in the transport position.

 

[blueriver]

I think they are saying that by adding the "2nd hose" you turn the cylinder into a DA cylinder and you have to adjust it manually with your non-float valve. You can't turn a non-float system into a float one by adding only a 2nd hose, but you can make the cylinder adjustable in a "non-float" way. That's my take on what they mean. They are saying that non-float, but adjustable via the 2nd hose is better than no adjustment at all.

Of course, if you want to add a 2nd hose and a valve that tees into the pressure side, you could open that valve and allow the cylinder to float while in use and then close the valve to operate the cylinder in the transport position.

Got it ... I believe the float valve mentioned would be a good idea.