Help me decide - Massey vs Kubota - 40-50hp

[Mich4x4]

I'm a new guy looking to get into another tractor. I had (and sold) a 1978 Massey Ferguson 255 that was a very good tractor. The only problem is it wasn't 4x4 and didn't have a loader. Otherwise it served me well. Looking to get into a modern 40-50hp tractor with loader and 4x4. I wont go into what i'm using the tractor for etc as I have already decided that 3 offerings are on my short list. I looked at and researched virtually every other brand that is offered within reasonable driving distance. Here's where I'm at.

1) Kubota Mx4800 - I really like this tractor, seems well built, dealer is decent and the Kubota line almost has a cultish following. I have read that most people consider the Kubota to be the Toyota/Honda of the tractor world. Keeps going and holds it's value well. This tractor is also at the VERY top end of my budget. Much like deer, Kubota seems to be pretty expensive for the features one is getting with the tractor. Almost everything is an option. I realize this is an economy small utility tractor and not a grand, but price doesnt really reflect that compared to other brands with the same HP.

2) Massey Ferguson 2705E - This tractor intrigues me. It's cheaper than the Kubota above, seems to have a very nice fit and finish, and very similar (if not better) features. I am also having a real hard time finding any info on this tractor or someone that has one. I've watched every youtube video put out by a dealer in Missouri, but other than that, there isn't much info out there. Thoughts on this tractor? Shibura motor?

3) Kubota L4701 - This is probably my 3rd choice. Similar to the two above in a bit smaller/lighter package. Price is more in line with the Massey, but still more. Has a very good following but seems to be the answer to a non-existent problem. Based on my reading, EVERYONE who is considering this tractor is advised to move up to the MX4800 or jump into a L4060. Pricing between the L4701 and Mx4800 is VERY similar.

I know about both kubotas so I'm mainly looking for opinions on the Massey. I think the Massey might be a nice compromise between the high $$$ Kubota and something like a Mahindra, LS etc.

Another thing I have not decided on is HST vs Shuttle. I'm a pretty simple guy and don't always have to have the nicest or most convenient things. Case in point... I buy trucks in work truck trim with crank windows and 4x4 on the floor. That's how I like it. Seems as simpler = less problems from my experience. I also do all of my own maintenance.


Let me know what you think. Thanks!

 

[jeff9366]

Massey Ferguson 2705E
2016 - 2700E Series
Utility tractor
Series next: Massey Ferguson 2706E

Manufacturer: AGCO
Original price (USD)
$23,119 (2016 shuttle )

Massey Ferguson 2705E Engine:
Shibaura 2.2L 4-cyl diesel
Massey Ferguson 2705E Power:
Engine: 48.8 hp [36.4 kW]
Gear PTO (claimed): 41.4 hp [30.9 kW]
Hydro PTO (claimed): 39 hp [29.1 kW]

Capacity:
Fuel: 14 gal [53.0 L]

3-Point Hitch:
Rear Type: II/I
Rear lift (at 24"/610mm): 2425 lbs [1099 kg]
Rear Arms: telescoping lower links

Power Take-off (PTO):
Rear PTO: independent
Clutch: electro-hydraulic
Rear RPM: 540 (1.375)

Dimensions & Tires:
Gear Weight: 3836 lbs [1740 kg]
Hydro Weight: 3880 lbs [1759 kg]
Wheelbase: 78 inches [198 cm]
Length: 133 inches [337 cm]
Width: 74 inches [187 cm]
Height (ROPS): 104 inches [264 cm]
80 inches [203 cm] *

Front tire: 9.5x16
Rear tire: 13.6x28


Massey Ferguson 2705E attachments:
front-end loader
backhoe


Mechanical:
Chassis: 4x4 MFWD 4WD
Final drives: bull gear
Differential lock: mechanical
Steering: power
Brakes: wet disc
Two-post folding ROPS.

Hydraulics:
Type: open center
Valves: 0 to 3
Pump flow: 12.4 gpm [46.9 lpm]

Page information:
Last update: October 8, 2015
Copyright: Copyright 2016 TractorData LLC
Contact:

 

[jeff9366]

1) Kubota Mx4800 - I really like this tractor, seems well built, dealer is decent and Kubota almost has a cult following.

Kubota has 50% USA market share in subcompact and compact tractors due to Kubota pioneering sales of compact tractors in the near and far suburbs before anyone else. Tractor Supply Company followed with small farm supplies in the suburbs, successfully.

If you were happy with your previous MF and found service/parts adequate I would go with MF again. I like the combination Category I/II Three Point Hitch on MF 2705e. What implements do you have now, what widths and what size/category hitch do your current implements fit?

Telescoping Three Point Hitch stabilizers are also helpful.

VIDEOS: Kubota MX series walk around and features by Messicks. | MX48 MX52 MX58 - YouTube

MASSEY 275E - YouTube

 

[Hozzie]

I have an MX5800 and am very happy with it. I don't know the Massey, but if you really like the MX better, I would look for a lightly used MX5200 to get the turbo. I bought my 5800 two years old with 150 hours and saved about 10k over new.

 

[Mich4x4]

Answering a few questions.

I'm in Michigan about 45 miles north of Detroit.

I do not have any implements at the moment so I'm starting fresh. Sold everything with my MF 255 this past summer. I have two young kids and wasn't planning on getting a tractor anytime soon. Obviously that changed.

Used equipment is out of the equation as I cant find a source of financing that doesn't come with a ridiculous interest rate.

Just heard back from the Massey dealer and they emailed me a quote based on MSRP. Kubota dealer took 5k off MSRP right off the bat... I've read that one can expect 10-15% off MSRP as a fair price. Very surprised by the Massey dealer as his quote is actually considerably more than the Kubota dealer... To the tune of $30.00 a month for the same interest rate and term..

 

[Mich4x4]

Welp... Massey has been removed from consideration.

Just spoke with the dealer about the quote he sent me. Based on flat MSRP with no movement or discount of any kind. He explained that Kubota's "cash price" is normally only +/- $900.00 different compared to their finance price. Massey's cash price is several thousand dollars better than their finance price.

In other words, Massey makes customers pay and arm and a leg to take advantage of their financing deals. Kubota does as well, just not as bad.

When talking about the 2705 vs MX 4800
Kubota carried a higher MSRP and interest rate vs the lower MSRP and better interest rate from Massy. I wanted 0 down, less than 2% interest, for 84 months. Massey came back with a monthly payment $30.00 more than Kubota given the same terms. In fact, the MSRP on the Kubota was more than the Massey, the Interest rate from Kubota is 1.99 as opposed to Massey's .99%, and the both deals were 0 down. Massey dealer quoted me $30.00 a month more based on a lesser MSRP and Lower interest rate.. Ummmm... NO THANK YOU!

So Kubota it is... hands down.. Maybe I should have this discussion moved to the Kubota specific forum as I have questions regarding the difference between the Kubota models.

MX series vs L series... More specifically, the MX4800 vs the L4701. I do have the 3901 in the back of my head but I would really like something closer to 50hp and a frame size up from the 3901.

What does the L offer that the MX doesn't? What does the MX offer that the L doesn't. Price is similar (within 15.00 a month) but I'm at the top of my budget considering these two machines so every dollar makes a difference.

Thoughts.. Also still on the fence regarding HST vs Shuttle. Shuttle being $1200.00 cheaper, any arguments one way or another?

This is harder than buying a new car. Too many variables and too much "if I'm going to spend that much, why not spend a bit more and get this"

Help.. Please!!!!

 

[jeff9366]

MX series vs L series... More specifically, the MX4800 vs the L4701. I do have the 3901 in the back of my head but I would really like something closer to 50hp and a frame size up from the 3901.

What does the L offer that the MX doesn't? What does the MX offer that the L doesn't. Price is similar (within 15.00 a month) but I'm at the top of my budget considering these two machines so every dollar makes a difference.

The 'standard' L series and the MX series are both 'economy' model tractors. The functional difference is WEIGHT. Minor difference: the MX series has a considerably more spacious operating station relative to L3901.

The fundamental importance of TRACTOR WEIGHT eludes many tractor shoppers. Heavier tractor weight is more important for most tractor applications than increased tractor horsepower. Bare tractor weight is a tractor specification easily found in sales brochures and web sites, readily comparable across tractor brands and tractor models, new and used.

Heavier tractors are constructed on larger frames and longer wheelbases. Heavier tractors are built with thicker steel to withstand greater stress. Heavier tractors have larger diameter wheels/tires, increasing ground clearance. Heavier tractors with large diameter wheels/tires have more tractive power pulling ground contact implements, pushing a loader bucket into dirt and pushing snow. Larger wheels and tires permit heavier tractors to bridge holes, ruts and tree debris with less operator perturbation.

I feel the low volume L4707 is an orphan in Kubota's lineup, likely to be discontinued in the indefinite future. Only larger Kubota dealers maintain an L4707 in inventory.

The MX series are high volume and share many components. Kubota strives to have common parts in model lines, which pleases Kubota dealers too. Every Kubota dealer I visit has multiple MX tractors in inventory.

VIDEO: Kubota Standard L-Series. L251 L331 L391 L471 features and operation. - YouTube


If you will do a lot of Loader work HST is the preferred transmission, as forward/reverse direction change is just foot pedal pressure. With HST you can creep the tractor easily attaching implements or loading a truck.

MORE: HST vs Shuttle site:tractorbynet.com - Google Search

If you will do more long pulls in fields, not requiring frequent changes from forward to reverse, shuttle shift will give you 5% or so better fuel economy doing the same work.

 

[jeff9366]

In other words, Massey makes customers pay an arm and a leg to take advantage of their financing deals. Kubota does as well, just not as bad.

Looking at the Wall Street Journal, Japanese interest rates on ten year gov't money are .012% today. ( 12/100's of 1% per annum )

Looking at the Wall Street Journal US interest rates on ten year gov't money are 2.75%, ~~225 times higher~~ than Japan.

I presume Kubota can borrow money to finance US tractor purchases cheaper than AGCO.

 

[Jchonline]

In addition to Jeffs thorough comments:
1. You make if very difficult to help make a recommendation when we dont have applications of use. The reason Kubota makes a MX and a L is because they are targeting different markets/applications. Please consider posting this again.
2. Dont be naive on the cash vs financing options with Kubota. Just because there is a $900 difference does NOT mean they havent already baked some financing fees into every tractor they sell. They want you to finance. Dont forget about insurance if you finance...you will need to carry it. That said, I financed with Kubota. Just do it with eyes wide open.

 

[Mich4x4]

In addition to Jeffs thorough comments:
1. You make if very difficult to help make a recommendation when we dont have applications of use. The reason Kubota makes a MX and a L is because they are targeting different markets/applications. Please consider posting this again.
2. Dont be naive on the cash vs financing options with Kubota. Just because there is a $900 difference does NOT mean they havent already baked some financing fees into every tractor they sell. They want you to finance. Dont forget about insurance if you finance...you will need to carry it. That said, I financed with Kubota. Just do it with eyes wide open.

Thanks..
I didn't mention my intended use because I didn't want the post to get cluttered up with the "bigger vs smaller" tractor debate that is so common as soon as someone mentions their property size or tasks they want to use the tractor for. I have already decided on the L4701 or Mx4800. I like the larger from size as opposed to the L3901. I'm also probably going to bite the $1200.00 bullet and opt for hydro over gear.

I'm a no frills kinda guy. I definitely don't need all the options of something like the grand series to be comfortable. Hence, I'm looking at the economy models. It does appear that the only difference between the L4701 and MX 4800 is weight and a few inches here and there. I cant really find any major differences that would push me to one over the other.

The L4701 is $13.00 a month cheaper and will likely do less work than the heavier MX4800 with a loader capable of lifting more weight. This is a tough decision. I agree, that the 4701 seems like an answer to a problem that never existed. Much too close in price to the MX4800. Not sure where it really fits.

For fear of starting a "smaller vs bigger debate" I'll be using the tractor for general tasks. Work in the woods (Moving brush, pulling out small trees, skidding logs), Snow removal (couple hundred foot drive, private road), Gravel drive maintenance, food plots, reclaiming fields, brush hog work, moving dirt, maintaining a small orchard, building a pole barn, setting fence posts... Nothing that screams get a 45-50hp tractor. I know. Probably 60% loader work and 40% other tasks.

Yes, I'm aware of the insurance and based on my reading Kubota charges somewhere around 1.3% of the selling price (before tax) as the yearly insurance premium. So in my case, it looks like selling price for the Mx4800 is right around $26,500 based on the best quote I received for the configuration I started with. 1.30% of 26,5000 is $344.00. $344.00 / 12 months = $28.67 a month. Kinda sucks... My homeowners covers the tractor while it's on my property but they have no additional riders or endorsements to cover it while it's being used on, or moved to, another property.