Help - ford 1520 bachoe hydraulics

[bbarnes871]

Also posted this in Hydraulics -

I just mounted a Woods 6500 backhoe on my Ford 1520 copact tractor. I called the Ford Dealer and they told me to just connect the two lines from the backhoe into two of the lined that go from my hydraulic manifold to the loader (7108) controls. The block has three lines that go to the loader: inlet, outlet and return.

I had two hoses made up with a tee and disconnect to connect to the backhoe. I connected one line to the outlet and the other line to the inlet. I also tried swapping inlet and return. In both cases neither the loader nor the backhoe work unless I pull a lever on eathier unit. When I pull a lever the other one will work just fine. I disconnect one line for the backhoe and the loader then works fine. Seem like the backhoe must have open flow such that it is robbing fluid from the loader. Seems like there is only one other option which is to connect the backhoe to the inlet and return line but just doe not make sense since it seems I would need the outlet (power) line in order to get pressure.
Not sure if this helps but when I put the loader valve in the float position the backhoe has slight movement but not enough to do anything.

Thanks in advance

Bob

 

[RickB]

Also posted this in Hydraulics -

I just mounted a Woods 6500 backhoe on my Ford 1520 copact tractor. I called the Ford Dealer and they told me to just connect the two lines from the backhoe into two of the lined that go from my hydraulic manifold to the loader (7108) controls. The block has three lines that go to the loader: inlet, outlet and return.

I had two hoses made up with a tee and disconnect to connect to the backhoe. I connected one line to the outlet and the other line to the inlet. I also tried swapping inlet and return. In both cases neither the loader nor the backhoe work unless I pull a lever on eathier unit. When I pull a lever the other one will work just fine. I disconnect one line for the backhoe and the loader then works fine. Seem like the backhoe must have open flow such that it is robbing fluid from the loader. Seems like there is only one other option which is to connect the backhoe to the inlet and return line but just doe not make sense since it seems I would need the outlet (power) line in order to get pressure.
Not sure if this helps but when I put the loader valve in the float position the backhoe has slight movement but not enough to do anything.

Thanks in advance

Bob

You got incomplete (poor) info from your dealer. You have tapped into the pressure line going into the loader control valve, you should have diverted the power beyond tube flow directly to the backhoe valve (marked PB at the loader valve, DO NOT use a 'T' fitting.) This needs to be set up with a coupler so the PB line can be re-connected to power the 3PT when the backhoe is dismounted. Backhoe return flow can be directed to a coupler plumbed into the cover on the upper RH side of the 3PT housing. A coupler in this location can be left unused when the hoe is off the tractor.

 

[bbarnes871]

Power Beyond Tube??? Which one is that? What you are saysing makes very good sense since I obviosly will not be needing power to my 3pt hitch but I really don't know which line that is. The tractor is at a buddys so I can't look at it but I seam to recall a line that runs towards the back of the tractor and goes thru a filter.

You got incomplete (poor) info from your dealer. You have tapped into the pressure line going into the loader control valve, you should have diverted the power beyond tube flow directly to the backhoe valve (marked PB at the loader valve, DO NOT use a 'T' fitting.) This needs to be set up with a coupler so the PB line can be re-connected to power the 3PT when the backhoe is dismounted. Backhoe return flow can be directed to a coupler plumbed into the cover on the upper RH side of the 3PT housing. A coupler in this location can be left unused when the hoe is off the tractor.

 

[RickB]

The power beyond tube is one of the three tubes running from the loader valve to the hydraulic diverter block. The loader valve should have PB cast into the body near the port for that tube. My first post described this. With the tractor running and the loader control fully in neutral, this tube will have oil returning from the valve to the diverter block.

Get over the notion of installing "tee"s' to accomplish this job. That doesn't work as oil will take the path of least resistance.

Double posting questions isn't helpful either. You now have two guys giving different answers on different forums. I am not going over there and debating this issue. I work on these units for a living, and have for a long time. The connections I have described are the factory installation, and are working on hundreds, if not thousands of units.

 

[bbarnes871]

Sorry for double posting but just trying to get an answer. Didn't realize there would be differing opinions since it seems what ever the right answer is, would be cut an dry.

I believe the "outlet" from the tractor is the "power beyond" tube to the loader valve. Loader schematic calls this the "power" port.

I now understand the whole teeing in thing wont work. So, that means it must be connected in series? Am i to take the "outlet" (PB) from the tractor and connect to the backhoe; then take the return line from the backhoe and connect it to the loader valve where the old "outlet" PB used to come in? Or based on what I think your saying, one of the two other lines that comes out of the loader valve, is pressurized back to the tractor. Where I'm confused is that you say to basically discoonect Power Byong to #pt and connect to backhoe; then back to 3PT when not using backhoe. But when I asked which line was PB you stated it was one to loader valve. Wouldn't this mean I have to disconnect and reconnect my loader everytime I want to use the backhoe or even move it since you use the loader to set the front end up a bit when using the backhoe. If power goes into the loader valve and then out and back to the tractor, can't I just connect in series with this line?. Maybe I have this whole series thing wrong too. On my loader schematic these lines are labled "Return" and "Tank" . I will try to get some pics this weekend.

I appreiciate you help

The power beyond tube is one of the three tubes running from the loader valve to the hydraulic diverter block. The loader valve should have PB cast into the body near the port for that tube. My first post described this. With the tractor running and the loader control fully in neutral, this tube will have oil returning from the valve to the diverter block.

Get over the notion of installing "tee"s' to accomplish this job. That doesn't work as oil will take the path of least resistance.

Double posting questions isn't helpful either. You now have two guys giving different answers on different forums. I am not going over there and debating this issue. I work on these units for a living, and have for a long time. The connections I have described are the factory installation, and are working on hundreds, if not thousands of units.

 

[RickB]

Sorry for double posting but just trying to get an answer. Didn't realize there would be differing opinions since it seems what ever the right answer is, would be cut an dry.

I believe the "outlet" from the tractor is the "power beyond" tube to the loader valve. Loader schematic calls this the "power" port.

What you are describing as the outlet from the tractor IS the power port to the loader control valve. Do not disturb this tube. It IS NOT the power beyond tube.

I now understand the whole teeing in thing wont work. So, that means it must be connected in series? Based on what I think your saying, one of the two other lines that comes out of the loader valve, is pressurized back to the tractor.

Yes and yes. One of the other two lines connecting the loader valve to the tractor is a return to tank; leave this tube alone. The other is the Power Beyond tube. It supplies "power beyond" the loader valve, either to the 3PT (now), or the backhoe (what you want to do).

Where I'm confused is that you say to basically discoonect Power Byong to #pt and connect to backhoe; then back to 3PT when not using backhoe. But when I asked which line was PB you stated it was one to loader valve.

That's exactly what I said. More accurately, it is one FROM the loader valve. Sorry.

Wouldn't this mean I have to disconnect and reconnect my loader everytime I want to use the backhoe or even move it since you use the loader to set the front end up a bit when using the backhoe.

No, because you are interrupting flow FROM the loader valve, not to it.

If power goes into the loader valve and then out and back to the tractor, can't I just connect in series with this line?. Maybe I have this whole series thing wrong too. On my loader schematic these lines are labled "Return" and "Tank" . I will try to get some pics this weekend.

That's what a power beyond connection is, in series with, and "beyond" the original valve. If you have identified the "tank" and "in (power) lines to and from the loader valve, the third line is the power beyond and this flow must be connected to the backhoe. The return from the backhoe valve goes to a new connection made inboard of the right rear tire into the end cover where a remote valve would be mounted, if you had one.

 

[bbarnes871]

lets see if I have this right. See attachment sketch

 

[RickB]

That is exactly correct.

 

[bbarnes871]

Thanks again for your help. All makes pretty good sense now. Preconceived ideas on teeing in and "P" being the power beyond, kind of had me going in the wrong direction.

I looked last night and the only thing I couldn't figure out was where the port is behind the right rear tire. Didn't actually crawl under tractor, so I will look closure this weekend. I assume its somewhere up high and I am looking for some sort of threaded plug that can be removed?

That is exactly correct.

 

[RickB]

Above the right rear axle and in front of the 3PT rockshaft. There is a small cover held on with 4 bolts, 12 or 13MM hex heads, Should be a 3/8NPT plug in the cover. Cover bolts and plug are parallel with the axle.