Certain fittings...Why so expensive??

[/pine]

I am getting an online order together for some hoses and fittings...I usually like to order a few extra relative fitting to have on hand...

I am fond of ordering hoses with just straight male pipe ends and use mechanical (swivel) fittings where they connect to a cylinder, valve etc...

I was shocked to see the price difference between a 1/2" male pipe to 1/2" female swivel ($2.27) and a 1/2" female swivel to 1/2" female swivel ($27.62)...

MP - FMS: Male Pipe (NPTF) x Female Pipe Swivel (NPSM)

FMS- FMS: NPSM Female Pipe Swivel Union

 

[oldnslo]

the dual swivel is more difficult to manufacture & would require extra handling and machining time.

Curious: Why are you so fond of pipe threads VS JIC 37 degree flare?

 

[/pine]

the dual swivel is more difficult to manufacture & would require extra handling and machining time.

Curious: Why are you so fond of pipe threads VS JIC 37 degree flare?

I'm not opposed to JIC connections...but for instance for one (3/8" crimped) 90 degree JIC hose end fitting is over $6.00 alone...a straight male pipe end fitting is about $2.50 and a 90 degree swivel fitting is about the same...
For myself it makes things more versatile...most of the application hoses I use have QD's on at least one end and with pipe it is easy to change both the sizes and end fittings...i.e., easy to add a JIC end if needed to use/pirate a hose from one application to another in a pinch...

 

[Steave]

I do most of my work in heavy brush and tree areas and am replacing hoses more often than some. A JIC fitting will last for years even with repeated changes. So will the NPT last too but are more prong to leaking after the initial installation. I've seen the price difference as you stated and try if at all possible to stay away from the expensive type.

I've been following your other thread about your DW aux. and am not surprised to see this thread. I know you've been buying a lot of fittings.

 

[/pine]

I do most of my work in heavy brush and tree areas and am replacing hoses more often than some. A JIC fitting will last for years even with repeated changes. So will the NPT last too but are more prong to leaking after the initial installation. I've seen the price difference as you stated and try if at all possible to stay away from the expensive type.

I've been following your other thread about your DW aux. and am not surprised to see this thread. I know you've been buying a lot of fittings.

In most instances I try to use the NPSM swivel fittings wherever possible...they use a machined 30 degree camfer seat...male ends have the camfer and the female (swivel nut) ends have a (male) bevel inside...no sealant, tape etc. is required...all the ease of JIC flares but a little stouter IMO...

Actually I have not bought any fittings in a few years...other than an item or two at TSC when I did not have what I needed on hand...
...Even before I bought my first tractor I started acquiring (in assorted lots) all the (tractor applicable) hydraulic paraphernalia I could find on e-bay for cheap...I bought (many times in lots) fittings, QDs, valves, cylinders, hoses etc., etc...

When I first got the DW I did buy (retail) a variety of ORFS to pipe adapters (and extra o-rings)...mainly so I could connect my pressure gauge manifold to different DW circuits (all of which are ORFS)...they also came in handy to rig a temporary hose on a skid steer (also ORFS) for a friend in a pinch...

I will be adding a few extras with the order I'm working on...I almost had enough stuff on hand to rig all three of the valves mentioned in the other thread...

 

[/pine]

...the dual swivel is more difficult to manufacture & would require extra handling and machining time.

I get that...but c'mon...is it really over 10 times more costly to manufacture etc...?

 

[RickB]

I get that...but c'mon...is it really over 10 times more costly to manufacture etc...?

The M/F swivel probably outsells the F/F double swivel by 1000 to one or more. Low numbers = higher unit cost.

 

[MtnViewRanch]

How about one of these? Not a double female swivel, but a singe swivel with a fixed female and less than $3.

 

[wdchyd]

The M/F swivel probably outsells the F/F double swivel by 1000 to one or more. Low numbers = higher unit cost.

Yep, supply vs demand

 

[/pine]

How about one of these? Not a double female swivel, but a singe swivel with a fixed female and less than $3.

Honestly I have no current need for the double female swivel...thought a couple of them in 3/8" and 1/2" would be handy to have on hand but not at that price...!...I am opting for something similar to what you cited as well as just a couple of standard (steel) female pipe couplings and nipples etc...

I do have a little invested but I also have a better selection of assorted (tractor applicable) hydraulic fittings etc. than any place within 50+ miles including a couple of TSC stores...don't always have exactly what I need (without pirating something else) but a majority of the time I can improvise with what I do have on hand...my latest endeavor exposed a lack of a few type/sizes of fittings/adapters that I'll be adding...

 

[Industrial Toys]

There is big mark up on some of this stuff. Fortunately, a friend of mine buys wholesale and I can get in on this action. But it's an eye opener.

 

[MtnViewRanch]

Honestly I have no current need for the double female swivel...thought a couple of them in 3/8" and 1/2" would be handy to have on hand but not at that price...!...I am opting for something similar to what you cited as well as just a couple of standard (steel) female pipe couplings and nipples etc...
I do have a little invested but I also have a better selection of assorted (tractor applicable) hydraulic fittings etc. than any place within 50+ miles including a couple of TSC stores...don't always have exactly what I need (without pirating something else) but a majority of the time I can improvise with what I do have on hand...my latest endeavor exposed a lack of a few type/sizes of fittings/adapters that I'll be adding...

I hope that you mean std steel hydraulic fittings & nipples. Most Std steel fittings are only rated as 300psi and are not a good idea to be used with hydraulic pressures.

 

[/pine]

I hope that you mean std steel hydraulic fittings & nipples. Most Std steel fittings are only rated as 300psi and are not a good idea to be used with hydraulic pressures.

Yes I do mean steel hydraulic fittings & nipples and some stainless...

 

[CDN Farm Boy]

Interesting timing of this thread.

Last week I needed a pair of #8 SAE male to 1/4" NPTM fittings which are $12.11 at Discount Hydraulic Hose

BUT

I ended up with #8 SAE male to 1/4" NPTF swivel and 1/4" NPT double male which are $2.26 and $0.62 to accomplish the same thing. $3 vs $12 definitely a volume thing vs a manufacturing cost.

The sad part is those same $3 worth of fittings cost me $16 at my local shop as I didn't want to wait to order online and it's not worth the 3 hr round trip to the States for me to pick them up from UPS Store. That $12 fitting that I would have preferred is $67 at my local shop

 

[Steave]

BUT

I ended up with #8 SAE male to 1/4" NPTF swivel and 1/4" NPT double male which are $2.26 and $0.62 to accomplish the same thing. $3 vs $12 definitely a volume thing vs a manufacturing cost.

If I've got the room I don't mine "Macgiver"ing to save a little money or to get by till later.

 

[LD1]

I use the same logic you do /pine.

Try to keep the hoses as simple as possible. That way I can swap around if needed, and the hoses are 10x more likely to need replaced than a fitting. So when I do a hose change, (like I just did on dads 4500tlb and IH444 loader) I try to avoid the ******* and expensive ends.

For example, I have ran into many fittings like these SAE/ORB Male Swivel 90° (MBX90) or these NPTF Male Pipe Swivel 90° (MPX90) on loaders before.

But instead, I like to use one of these 6801 | JIC 37° x Straight Thread (ORB) 90° with just a standard JIC hose. The initial cost of the adapter and hose is about the same as the hose with the ******* fitting, but future replacement is FAR easier and cheaper. Especially if needed quick and have to be sourced locally, everyone has standard JIC hose ends. Not everyone has a 90 degree ORB swivel fitting.

I personally prefer the JIC stuff, as thats whats most common OEM. But have no issues at all using NPSM stuff. Works just as good as JIC and I see your point about QD's being NPT.

As to the price of those fittings. YEA, that does sound high. Have you tried calling them? perhaps they have the decimal in the wrong place? Probably not, because the JIC double female swivel unions are pricey too.

But I cannot think of any instance where you would need a double swivel that you couldnt get by with a single swivel Female x female? Just loosen the swivel side first then you can loosen the rigid side as if it were a swivel. Something like this NPTF Female Pipe x NPSM Female Pipe Swivel

 

[LD1]

Interesting timing of this thread.

Last week I needed a pair of #8 SAE male to 1/4" NPTM fittings which are $12.11 at Discount Hydraulic Hose

BUT

I ended up with #8 SAE male to 1/4" NPTF swivel and 1/4" NPT double male which are $2.26 and $0.62 to accomplish the same thing. $3 vs $12 definitely a volume thing vs a manufacturing cost.

The sad part is those same $3 worth of fittings cost me $16 at my local shop as I didn't want to wait to order online and it's not worth the 3 hr round trip to the States for me to pick them up from UPS Store. That $12 fitting that I would have preferred is $67 at my local shop

What am I missing here?

You needed one end to be #8 male, and the other end to be 1/4" pipe thread male?
Seems its a $0.91 fitting Steel Fittings: JIC 37° Male x NPTF Male Pipe

 

[oldnslo]

In most instances I try to use the NPSM swivel fittings wherever possible...they use a machined 30 degree camfer seat...male ends have the camfer and the female (swivel nut) ends have a (male) bevel inside...no sealant, tape etc. is required...all the ease of JIC flares but a little stouter IMO...

Not sure if you have run into this yet but some NPT fittings are not chamfered to accept the NPS swivel and don't seal at all. These may have been cheap Chinese fittings but they were a very common size of fitting.

 

[/pine]

In most instances I try to use the NPSM swivel fittings wherever possible...they use a machined 30 degree camfer seat...male ends have the camfer and the female (swivel nut) ends have a (male) bevel inside...no sealant, tape etc. is required...all the ease of JIC flares but a little stouter IMO...

Not sure if you have run into this yet but some NPT fittings are not chamfered to accept the NPS swivel and don't seal at all. These may have been cheap Chinese fittings but they were a very common size of fitting.

For sure...Actually the only male pipe fittings I have that are not chamfered are stainless steel and maybe a couple of reducing bushings...

 

[CDN Farm Boy]

What am I missing here?

You needed one end to be #8 male, and the other end to be 1/4" pipe thread male?
Seems its a $0.91 fitting Steel Fittings: JIC 37° Male x NPTF Male Pipe

Close. That's JIC/pipe. I needed SAE/pipe
This was what I was looking for: 6401-08-04 | #8 SAE/ORB Male x 1/4" NPTF Male

When they told me $67, I said the same thing, decimal must be in the wrong spot, and asked them to double check. I should also clarify, that $67 is list price. I setup a business account with them that I get a pretty decent discount even not being a huge volume buyer. If I was just a regular Joe buying a few pieces now and then it would have been pretty close to list.

Hydraulics are one of the many things that are ridiculously and unexplainably more expensive this side of the border.