Air Cooled Diesel vs Air Cooled Gas

[TimberXX]

This is my first post, glad to be on TBN. I have been following this site for about a year. Thanks to all those to post and help those who are new! I am about 8 months away from a purchase of a BCS 852. I am considering making side money by cutting 5 lawns and snowblowing like 4. EarthTools offers an aircooled diesel (Yanmar). How many hours can i expect from an aircooled diesel? I cant be as reliable as a liquid cooled. Is it worth to get over a Honda gas? how does it start in the cold? can it take a heater? is it effective? I have found the other posts on the BCS and i am impressed. thanks guys

 

[JDFANATIC]

Can't answer your questions, but here is the correct link:
http://www.earthtoolsbcs.com/html/bcs_tractor_specs.html

 

[ZJ_HR]

Hard to say for me how Yanmar is doing, but my experience with Lombardini air cooled diesels is excellent.
You have to notice some differences, ositive and negative to both type:
1. Diesel is louder, and cause more vibrations, particularly single cylinder, compared to gas.
2. Diesel has bigger torque, especially in bottom rpm - better for pulling and pto work which don't need full pto speed (like tilling).
3. Diesel use less fuel per hp, compared to gas, and fuel is cheaper (non road diesel).
4. Diesel engine is heavier in same hp class, so, it will give you a better weight balance when we talk about walkbehind machines.
5. Diesel engine will last longer, as it is heavier built than apropriate gas, and ALL diesels have oil pump, compare to simple gas, which usually have splash lubricating.
6. Diesel engine is better for work on slopes, means non sensitive to "carb level".
7. According to my knowledge, Yanmar and Lombardini are direct injectin diesels, so, starting in winter will not cause a problem, even in winter. Especially if machine is stored in barn
8. Air cooled diesels (for walkbehinds) are simple built, like a gas - no radiator, no water pump etc, so maintenance is not a issue.
9. Diesels are hard workers, and are less sensitive for overheating, compare to gas engines on partial rpm.
10. Diesels are MORE EXPENSIVE /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif compare to gas engines (almost twice in same power class, Lombardini in my country)

Lok for a thread about 2-wheel tractors , and you'll find lot of usefull information there.

 

[Henro]

Great answer, ZJ! /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Keep those posts coming, TimberXX. Guess it's too late to say welcome to TBN since you have been lurking for a year. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[TimberXX]

yeah ive been lurkin' for a while... thanks for the responses guys... anybody know the hours before a rebuild would be needed? i know that yanmar makes stand alone generators so someone to TBN land would have to have an idea...

 

[ZJ_HR]

Hard to say, but this motors will probably last 500-1000hrs.

Some of Lombardini's on walkbehinds are 30years old, without overhaul, but hard to say how many hours they have.
300-500 maybe?

Buy one and enlighten us about their life span /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

 

[Dargo]

I have an old Onan generator from the 70's that is an air cooled diesel. It was hooked to a 5000 gallon diesel tank and ran 24/7 for many years powering lights in a coal mine operation. I was told that it was in service for several years. If it ran all the time, that would be over 8000 hours per year. It's hour meter only goes to 9999, but it has been rolled over several times. It was never shut off except to change the oil in it monthly. It has never had any major work done to it and it still starts and runs fine. It is a loud, smelly, heavy rattling single cylinder air cooled diesel that leaks, but it seems like it will run for a few thousand hours more.

 

[RoyJackson]

"Hard to say, but this motors will probably last 500-1000hrs."

I hope you mean 5000 to 10,000 hours

 

[otus_branch]

I can't really comment too intelligently on the air-cooled diesels, as I only own a gas-powered BCS. I will say that I inquired with Joel (who is an excellent equipment dealer btw) about Lombardini diesels, which he offered when i bought the 850, and he convinced me that I would be better off with the gas option (Kohler Command CS12 on my model). Cost, noise, and winter performance were all factors he mentioned at the time. It took a while for me to even pay off the gas model, so perhaps I was easily convinced.

There have been a few times when I have bogged down the gas engine that I have wondered whether I made the right choice, but they have been few and far between. You woul dprobably do as well or even better with the 13-horse Honda now standard with the 852. They are both reasonably torque-y (for gas) and durable engines. My Kohler has around 200 hours on it with no maintenance besides oil changes and air filter cleanings, and all's well. Oh, and the plug has been replaced once too, but I had fouled it through my own negligence (rolled the bugger on a steep bank, then tried to run it after oil and gas had run amok).

Now about durability: it's almost certain that a diesel will outlast a gas engine, given proper maintenance on both. But 15 or 20 years from now, will it really be that much of a hassle to replace your gas engine? I personally am hoping that by that time I will be able to buy an appropriately powered and weighted hydrogen fuel cell by that time (OK, maybe this is fantasyland, but we can hope). Even if gas and diesel are still the only options, the nice thing is that the BCS can take a fairly standard horizontal shaft engine. There should good be options a-plenty. Or maybe I'll luck out, and my Kohler will be comparable to the Farmall 140 and Ford 8N gas engines and be running fine 50 years from now...

I would recommend that you do something that I did not: ask Joel if you can run both a diesel model and a gas model side-by-side. If you are planning on picking your unit up from him, his shop is out on a farm, and the owners don't seem to mind when customers try out a bit of mowing... /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Whatever you choose, please post your observations here! I'm very curious to hear more about how the diesels do with walking tractors, and I would also like to know what you think about the new brake setup on the 852, especially on hills.

Welcome to TBN from one newbie/former lurker to another!

-otus

 

[TimberXX]

thanks for the info... i am havin' a hard time finding info on the bcs other than this site, the BCS site and a few dealers... can you suggest other sites about the BCS? and how much louder is the diesel than a gas? whats the deal with the brakes?