Advice sought re using water truck in grading project

[beowulf]

I have previously posted about building a second home on our property for daughter and son-in-law on a hill top area. Right now we are stuck because we need the pad and a road to the pad graded but we have had no rain to speak of. The Grading contractor says he needs to wait for rain before starting, and I understand that as I cut a preliminary road/path to the sight and the dirt soon turns to powder - no cohesion at all. And there is also the dust issue. We have been told the hill may have to be taken down 3-5' for a pad depending on precisely where on the hill we choose to build. We can probably get by with 2' or so on some site locations.

There is no rain in the forecast and we would like to start before 2021 (for economic reasons - specific costs will go up) . So I began wondering about using water trucks to soak the pad area and perhaps on the projected driveway (500') as well. I have also thought about placing a 5000 gallon tank near the site as well as that will be needed anyway per fire regs, and I could have that filled so as to have that water available in addition to the water trucks. I could move the empty tank to a final location once the pad is done and we can situate the home footprint. Once we know where the footprint will be (how much lower, precisely where, etc.) we can then locate the well relative to the site and electrical runs and start on that - we did not want to drill the well until the pad was situated.

A rough guess for the pad size is about 10,000 -15,000 square feet to accommodate yard, well etc. The building site is a bit rocky, a lot of small rocks just below the surface.

So, is this practical? What do I need to be concerned about? Costs? Rain here is an iffy prospect, and even if it does rain we will likely need several decent rains to make the grading work well.

Thanks for any advice you can provide. I will be contacting a water truck company later this week to get their take on things.

 

[Streetcar]

Do you have easy access to water and what is the cost of the water. Lots of trips needed depending on area to be graded

 

[beowulf]

Streetcar, we have no access to water here except for our well. I am thinking that we will be buying the water - delivered and applied by the water trucking company.

 

[dodge man]

I’m recently retired but when I worked I occasionally did soil testing. Every soil has a moisture content where it compacts the best. They have trucks that are designed for this, usually just a big nozzle or two that sprays a pretty wide pattern. I assume these trucks have a pto driven pump. I have also seen them mounted on a setup that would normally be a scraper that is self powered for more off road use. They also use them for dust control. From what you describe one truck would easily do the job.

 

[Jim Nelson]

I worked in the dirt business most of my working life and water is absolutely necessary.On most job sites the contractor would have to get a water meter from the local water district and it would be installed on a fire hydrant and locked in place. On most jobs of any size the hydrant would feed a 10,000 gal. tank that the water trucks or pulls would fill from. Most jobs of any size would use 1 or more 4000 gal water trucks, on bigger jobs they would use 10,000 gal water pulls powered by the tractor part from a scraper. On smaller jobs and street work 2000 gal trucks were used.It is a considerable cost to be built into the estimate.

 

[kevin37b]

Do not understand why water is a concern ? If it turns to dust it will turn to snot if it does rain . Kevin .

 

[beowulf]

Thanks Dodgeman and Jim, I really appreciate your input. I will talk to a local water trucking company this week to see if they can come out and check out the site to see what they recommend and get rough cost estimates. It is on a hill top - there is an existing road to get to it which should be satisfactory - I can wait on the grading of the new and more direct 'to-be-built' driveway until we get rain but want to start on the pad so need the water for that. Not having the pad - with a footprint identified - is what is holding up the other tasks.

Because a good bit of the crown of the site (depending on which part of the hill we choose) will have to be taken off, it may be that the grader can push part of that off first and then we could then bring the water in at the point he thinks he needs it for compaction - but he may want it right away for the dust issue. I will leave that up to him. Thanks again.

 

[beowulf]

Do not understand why water is a concern ? If it turns to dust it will turn to snot if it does rain . Kevin .

The water is needed for cohesion and compaction. I have graded roads to the back of the property for years and moist dirt makes a huge difference in what you can do and the efficiency and results.

 

[Jim Nelson]

One other thing to consider, at least back when I was still in the business, you are only allowed to add a certain amount of water after the fill material is placed so pre wetting is necessary. This brings up the problem of evaporation which is a big deal in warm weather with a little wind, it's amazing how much moisture can be lost in a short time so you have to work very efficiently or water costs will eat you up .
This is all assuming you are doing this as a permitted project and following code and the inspection process. In this day and age I think it would be foolish to try to bootleg a job like you are planning. In the old days you could get a permit and just give the inspector a bottle of whiskey every week and sail right through, too much liability now after too many catastrophic failures.

 

[beowulf]

Jim,

Jim, all will be fully permitted. I am not certain, however, at what point the grading inspection issue kicks in. A few years ago I tore down a garage/with studio apt attached, (pulled a demo permit) and cut up the slab and removed it piece by piece. Then contractor pulled a permit to build a new garage with gym mostly on the footprint of the demolished building. There was minimal grading. The County did not require an inspection of the pad, and did not require a compaction test. The contractor, however, did want a compaction test but as a slab had been on that footprint for 30-50 years and rock hard ground beneath it, the contractor let it go as long as I signed a waiver.

I will discuss how the county will handle this with my grading guy.

BTW - I was told by several people I did not need to pull a demo permit for the very old garage/apt building. However, because the old garage was so old it predated any permit requirement when built and was not in the county records, i.e., it did not exist as far as they were concerned. But because I pulled a demo permit for that, that caused a record to be made of the building's existence and then the new building was considered a replacement and I avoided a reassessment, and also avoided school impact fees for the part of the building considered living space (gym with bathroom etc.)



Thanks for the input. I always feel I can never have too much information. Much appreciated.