A travesty you should know about

RichZ · Jul 24, 2001

Premarin is a drug that is prescribed to women in menopause or who have had hysterectomies. Premarin (PREgnant MARe urINe), or PMU, is made from the urine of approximately 60,000 pregnant mares. Their foals are considered a mere by-product in the manufacturing of the drug, and are sold at livestock auctions, bought by marketers, sent to feedlots to be fattened, then sent to slaughterhouses for their meat, which is marketed in Europe and Asia. Older mares, who no longer can conceive, are also generally shipped for slaughter. A small percentage of the foals at the PMU farms do not survive due to exposure, starvation or "clubbing" at birth. Of the surviving foals, 90% of fillies (females) and 99% of colts (males) are sent to slaughter. There are several synthetic and plant based alternative on the market today that can replace Premarin, but Premarin is still one of the highest prescibed drugs in the nation, prescribed to an estimated 9 million women. It is manufactured by Wyeth-Ayerst Laboratories.
For more info, contact:
Spring Hill Horse Rescue
2617 Union St
Brandon, Vt 05733
(802) 247-2857
www.springhillrescure.com

Thanks,

Rich

cowboydoc · Jul 24, 2001

No offense Rich but this is full of half truths. Yes Premarin is used to treat women and is made from pregnant mare urine but the rest of what you say stops right there. There are articles in all three of the big horse magazines that have investigated this in the last three months: Western Horseman, Equus, and Horse and Rider. None found any of the travestys that you talked about. This is simply not true that these horses are mistreated. The foals are not sold for slaughter unless the slaughter house buys them at the auction, which rarely happens. Yes they are taken to be sold at auctions or are bought right off the farm for a very low price but everyone takes horses to auction to be sold. In all three of the articles the horses were not mistreated at all and led better than average lives. The only horses that go to slaughter are horses that are lame, crippled, or otherwise outlaws or ones noone wants. I personally don't see a problem with this. Much better for an animal to be put down this way than to suffer for years. This whole thing with horse rescue is way overblown. Yes horses that are abused and neglected need to be rescued. That is not the case at these mare farms.

RichZ · Jul 24, 2001

Richard, I had no idea that 3 magazines did articles about this. I'm basing my information on the rescue group. Their information seems pretty convincing, and my wife and I are already in the process of adopting a foal from them.
I certainly look pretty stupid now, as there's no one I respect regarding horses more than you. Is there anyway I could get copies of those articles from you? I'd like to read them, and have the rescue group respond to them.
I appologize to everyone, if my information was wrong, as it appears to be.

Rich

cowboydoc · Jul 24, 2001

Rich go to westernhorseman.com and quarterhorsejournal.com and do a search for PMU. There are a number of articles that are there on it. Some of them you have to order though. I will have one of the girls here at the office see if she can find that most recent one in equus and western horseman.

Bill_Ryan · Jul 24, 2001

My 2 cents worth...

Wrt to any written report or article concerning any topic...be sure to get background of author(s) as well as who funded the article/study and also who advertises in the publication.

All of the above may place bias on the outcome.

Bill

cowboydoc · Jul 24, 2001

Bill,
Just for clarification purposes Dr. Robert Miller is THE authoritative vet on horses in the United States. He wrote the latest article in Western Horseman. You would be hard pressed to find a man who has done more for the horse population. He is a man of incredible integrity that I would believe without a doubt. When he says something it is with a wealth of information and the science or studies to back up what he says. Equus magazine is also devoted primarily to the exclusive rights of horses. They are the left wing of the horse world so if horses are mistreated in any way they will let you know and even they said that the mares and foals in these facilities were well cared for.

ejb · Jul 24, 2001

I guess it must depend on your defintion of mistreated...I can't say I know alot about this drug, or the mistreatment of horses, but I did a quick search on yahoo and came up with dozens and dozens and dozens of organizations that are trying to raise awareness of the mistreatment of horses in the manufacture of premarin. Certainly all those people and organizations can't be completely bonkers? Should we really beleive that all of these organizations and people just don't have there facts straight? or is it closer to the truth to think that they are mistreated, but not anymore than any other farm animal (i.e. chicken or cow). Certainly we are not to believe that these horses are being treated like pets?

kubmech · Jul 24, 2001

Don't get me wrong, I love animals as much, if not more than most. But speaking of travesty, what about the Popes visit to "W" to give him his view of experimenting on human embryos? They say the embryos are leftovers from fertility clinics. SHEESH!! Where do you draw the line??????????????

I know experimentation on animals has made alot of progress in medicine, but who's to say whether a rat or a fuzzy bunny has less or more rights than a horse.

I have personally snipped the testicles out of squeelers all in the name of porkchops and bacon. Does anyone know where veal comes from? What about fur???????? Come on now, where do you draw the line.

Not a rant or any disrespect intended/w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif/w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif
Just my thoughts on the big picture...........

<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by kubmech on 07/24/01 06:24 PM (server time).</FONT></P>

glennmac · Jul 24, 2001

I had never heard of this controversy or of premarin. Turns out that it is one of the most frequent drugs prescribed by doctors in the US and Canada. (Premarin = pregnant mare urine)

I dont know the truth about this anymore than anyone else, but what is true is that an internet search turns up scores of articles reporting "facts" essentially similar to the information repeated by RichZ. There appear to dozens of organizations in the US and Canada that are concerned about the mistreatment of the pregnant mares, which are "milked" for their urine during their 11 month gestation period, as well as the treatment of later-born foals. Even the most favorable article towards PMU I found estimates that 30,000 PMU foals are sent to slaughter each year (compared to the 75,000 figure reported by some anti-PMU organizations, which was based on an older Canadian study). One of the issues with the mares is how long a time they are confined in small stalls while they are being milked. Some animal rights articles suggest they never move out of the stall for the entire 11 months. Even the most favorable article seems to suggest they are stalled substantially fulltime for 5 or 6 months.

While I certainly would retain healthy skepticism about "facts" asserted by any advocacy organization, I would retain the same skepticism about "facts" asserted in commercial horse-owner magazines or by pro-PMU vets.

cowboydoc · Jul 24, 2001

Guys this is no different than milking a cow for gosh sakes. Tell you what how about everyone on TBN go on a strike and not drink milk. That's how ridiculous this is. No they are absolutely not treated like pets. They are not pets and neither is a pig, a cow, etc. I know people all over that stall their horse full time! They are rarely turned out from a 10x10 stall. Most of these horses are in a 10x6 stall for up to 8 hours a day and then turned out. Anyone that has half a brain about horses knows that if you leave an animal tyed up for days on end that they are going to stock up. This means that they are going to get fluid in their legs and get edema and then heart failure in a very short time. That simply doesn't happen to these horses. And the comment about the horses not being given water. I mean come on they want the mare's urine. Do you really think that the mares aren't going to be given water? How much do you pee when you don't drink? Yes you can find all sorts of information out there about these facilities. The truth is that yes these mares are hooked up just like a milk cow is that's the truth. Yes every 11 months they have a foal that is true. Yes it is true that some of these foals wind up in slaughter. But again they are not mistreated in any way shape or form!!! They are no more at risk to be sent to slaughter than any other horse at any other auction anywhere else in the country. And so what! WE eat cows, why can't they eat horses? My gosh what is it with this sacred cow issue that you can't eat a horse? It's no more cruel than ordering up a burger. These horses are fed and watered to the max! They have to be to keep up their strength and produce foals and good urine. They are fed round the clock, watered around the clock and treated better than anyone I know treats their horses with regards to basic health.

Now those are the facts period. If you think that is cruelty to animals then so be it that's ok. I personally don't see it but that's ok too. I guess the reason that I am so incensed about this is because the same damn people that propagate this crap also propagate against rodeo and ranching. Rodeo animals as well are some of the most well kept that there are. There are so many rumors and false truths about rodeo as well. But anyway that's how these mare farms are run and yes I have been to them first hand.