460 loader sticking

   / 460 loader sticking #1  

45104wd

New member
Joined
May 24, 2005
Messages
4
Location
VA
Tractor
4510 4wd
Hello,

I'm new to this forum, but have had 4wd tractors for some years.

My 460 loader bucket has begun sticking in the full rolled back Posit. Not every time, but occasionally. Ultimately it requires considerable fiddling/jerking with the joystick to get it unstuck.

Common problem or not? I grease regularly, fluid levels are fine. Machine has about 110 hours & is 1 year old. I have also been getting some squeaky, squealy noice from the Hyd. pump when the machine is warming up. Wondering if the pump is weak or going bad.

Thanks for any help.

Bruce
 
   / 460 loader sticking #2  
4510wd,

I wonder if you have some gunk on the loader joystick and if it is causing the bucket to stick? Is the joytick the problem? I have a 4700 with 571+ hours and don't have this problem.

The squeling noise from the hydrualic pump can't be good.

Later,
Dan
 
   / 460 loader sticking #3  
Swapping both pairs of lines could prove that the problem is in the valve.

I agree that the pump issue doesn't sound good. I would drain the hydraulic fluid and replace filters, just to be safe, but mostly, talk to a service tech ASAP!
 
   / 460 loader sticking #4  
Could the squeal be the system relief valve?

I think it should be possible to isolate whether it is a control valve or loader cylinder problem - by swapping the pairs of lines from the disconnects to the loader. If the problem follows the lines - you've probably got an SCV problem, if it stays on the rollback only - then it is either the loader (hydraulic or mechanical issues) or something systemic like your pump. However - I would think you'd see issues on all of the control circuits, maybe even the rear hitch rockshaft movement if the pump was the problem.

I suppose it could be a mechanical loader problem - something binding in the loader pivots - but I have a hunch the hydraulics would be strong enough to bend something if you had just a mechancial bind. Not sure if something could be failing inside of the cylinders to cause them to try to seize at one end of their travel.

The tech manual isn't hugely helpful in the diagnostic area for this! /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

Symptom: SCV Problems
(1) SCV Attachment Does Not Operate
Smoothly?
Yes - Rear gear pump faulty.
Yes - SCV faulty.
(2) SCV Attachment Does Not Operate?
Yes - Rear gear pump faulty.
Yes - SCV faulty.

Mike types faster than me!
 
   / 460 loader sticking #5  
<font color="green">Mike types faster than me!

</font>
sure and 1/10th as helpful...
 
   / 460 loader sticking #6  
Bruce, is it binding or just slowing down or stopping for a few seconds and starting up again as your dumping. If it's the latter, it only does that in UNLOCK mode. The loader has three modes, LOCK, OPEN and UNLOCK. Try the OPEN mode, the hydraulics will be slower but this shouldn't happen.

David
 
   / 460 loader sticking
  • Thread Starter
#7  
Thanks all for the ideas

I did the 50 Hr. service & replaced all filters & fluid, cleaned screens etc. Same deal. When it is cold just after start-up more often than not it will emit a few squeaks in there (sounds like in the pump to an old car nut but /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif) Sounds like rubber on metal, but obviously could be a bearing noise buried in the pump. It is as though some o-ring binds in the cycle somewhere.

I seem to have adequate pressure & strength. Heavy item on 3PH will stay raised for a good while. I use a Bush Hog 70-06 blade frequently which weighs, & there is no Prob w/ that. Same with BH. Plenty of power for lifting that beast.

I have also recently begun to notice a sound like air trapped in the system back at the 3PH around the top Cyl. Cyl. line (if you know what I mean). A hissing like when you relieve pressure.

I am going to reverse the FEL lines. That is a good idea & will help isolate the problem w/ the FEL. Only bad part is that you don't use the full forward position near as often as the full back.

I just can not see where there is anything that could bind enough to prevent that thing from rolling. As you say, something would get crushed or bent. It wants to go when you move the stick & will jerk & jerk when you work the stick until it is finally free. Not as though it is not getting the signal to move, so it does seem to be in the mechanics & not in the control. The controls when on the TNT do seem to get a little confused at times when going to the position that would be closest to the full power unload for the bucket. The top Cyl. wants to go in & out for a few shakes, but this could be operator triggering that switch (Nah, never /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif)

I still have a year on the warranty & have told the salesman about the prob (friend of mine). As you guys know, if they come get it & haul it back to the shop (120 Mi. R/T) it will never exhibit these symptoms. This is why I have not had it taken in yet. I am hoping the problem will manifest itself in some way that will show for sure what is up. If it was a car problem my mechanic buddy would say "run the **** out of it" so...

Thanks for your input, & I will post results for everyone's benefit. Rain here, so moving the topsoil pile w/ switched lines will have to wait.

I'll post pics next time BH is hooked up for full show-off effect. The JD-TNT kit is killer - well worth the $1200 IMO. Cheaper than knee replacements from hopping on & off! /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
   / 460 loader sticking #8  
It's the joystick that is sticking, mine does it in the down position. I just wiggle it back and forth several times and the prob goes away for a while. I've heard you can grease it but haven't got around to it yet.

By the way, it's a 460 too.
 
   / 460 loader sticking #9  
You sure it isn't yer elbow? /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif
 
   / 460 loader sticking
  • Thread Starter
#10  
Nah, I greased that! /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

I can hardly wait to locate that fitting. I'm sure it's "right there". /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 

Tractor & Equipment Auctions

City of Buckhannon Onan 450 Set Stand By Generator (A52384)
City of Buckhannon...
BUSH HOG 7007 LOT NUMBER 116 (A53084)
BUSH HOG 7007 LOT...
2015 Ford Econoline Box Van, VIN # 1FDWE3FL4FDA28220 (A51572)
2015 Ford...
JOHN DEERE 3040 TRACTOR (A50459)
JOHN DEERE 3040...
Unused 2025 Spirit Mini Golf Cart (A51694)
Unused 2025 Spirit...
2023 CATERPILLAR 299D3 SKID STEER (A51246)
2023 CATERPILLAR...
 
Top