HST or gear-drive?

[MossRoad]

I’m not just dumping the dirt I’m grading beside it with very minimal hand raking required. And I’d like to see you try as accurately with a gear tractor and be anything close to as fast. You’re going to have to go down into creeper gear to have enough control to do it and probably take 5x as long. I don’t think you realize how much faster a HST machine is for loader work. You hype on loosing power which isn’t wrong but small tractors in America aren’t putting food on the table. Even 80-100 hp tractors largely aren’t putting food on the table.

The losing power thing is kind of a red herring.

If you buy a tractor that's PTO is rated at a certain HP, it's gonna be that horsepower, no matter the transmission type.

Same thing with draw bar pull.

You buy the machine that's got the specs you need.

If you want HST, your engine HP is going to have to be a bit higher. It's just that simple.

 

[4570Man]

Handling a clutch is second nature for anyone used to it. You would be surprised how much work someone who can actually handle a clutch will do. It's certainly not as slow as you think it is. Again, falls mostly on the operator.

ll.

Compared to a shovel I guess the clutch isn’t that bad. But you’d be surprised how much more efficient a HST machine is and even more so a joystick skid steer. Yes I realize a skid steer is a different tool but it’s still HST drive so somewhat fitting. The skid steer can drive between its top speed and a crawl with zero effort. I can scoop into a pile, drive quickly to the dump site, slow down to spread the dirt, probably change direction a couple times when I’m spreading it, and drive quickly back to the pile. To do the same job we you’d have to shift into low gears to scoop, shift into higher gears to travel, shift back into low gears to spread, shift into even lower gears for precise positioning, shift between forward and reverse several times and then repeat the cycle a hundred times. It gets old fast.

 

[Sawyer Rob]

To do the same job we you’d have to shift into low gears to scoop, shift into higher gears to travel, shift back into low gears to spread, shift into even lower gears for precise positioning, shift between forward and reverse several times and then repeat the cycle a hundred times. It gets old fast.

Actually, YOU would need to do all that shifting, I don't seem to have that problem with my tractor/loader work. I move dirt and load hundreds of loads of turkey poop, and I get along just fine with my gear drive, best part is, I don't get "tennis ankle" from having to keep the whiner whining.

I have both types of trans, I like the whiner for some things, like mowing my lawn, but I don't mow my lawn with my loader tractor.

SR

 

[LouNY]

I’m not just dumping the dirt I’m grading beside it with very minimal hand raking required. And I’d like to see you try as accurately with a gear tractor and be anything close to as fast. You’re going to have to go down into creeper gear to have enough control to do it and probably take 5x as long. I don’t think you realize how much faster a HST machine is for loader work. You hype on loosing power which isn’t wrong but small tractors in America aren’t putting food on the table. Even 80-100 hp tractors largely aren’t putting food on the table.

Dang you sure could have fooled me that 80-100 hp tractors aren't putting food on the table. Much of the truck "vegetable " farming is done with under 100 hp tractors.
Also how much hp does feeding beef cows and doing hay require.
My nephew on the farm has several under 100 hp tractors, he also has a few above that. The round baler tractor is 115 hp.

 

[4570Man]

To do the same job we you’d have to shift into low gears to scoop, shift into higher gears to travel, shift back into low gears to spread, shift into even lower gears for precise positioning, shift between forward and reverse several times and then repeat the cycle a hundred times. It gets old fast.

Actually, YOU would need to do all that shifting, I don't seem to have that problem with my tractor/loader work. I move dirt and load hundreds of loads of turkey poop, and I get along just fine with my gear drive, best part is, I don't get "tennis ankle" from having to keep the whiner whining.

I have both types of trans, I like the whiner for some things, like mowing my lawn, but I don't mow my lawn with my loader tractor.

SR

How do you not do all that shifting short of just staying in a low gear for the whole job and driving around at a snail pace?

 

[Sawyer Rob]

How do you not do all that shifting short of just staying in a low gear for the whole job and driving around at a snail pace?

I don't have to use the "lowest" gear, I can just drive into the pile at or just above an idle, then add rpm as needed (foot throttle) when traveling to dump the bucket. If I'm going a long distance with the loaded bucket, I can shift into a higher gear when I take off, after backing away from the pile.

SR

 

[sd455dan]

My understanding is the HST builds alot of heat when worked really hard, at like maximum pulling ... Besides they tend to have a bit more PTO HP Loss than the gear drives ...

I wouldn't consider a 50 HP tractor a "farm tractor" ... It's more of a hobby farm, homestead tractor, unless its on a farm with bigger tractors to do the heavy work ... Sure you can "farm" an acre garden for the farmers market type thing ... But forget about trying to till 100 acres of crop and, or harvest it, even marginal for haying on anything more than a hobby farm.

Mostly agree but there are exceptions, The Ford/NH and Versatile 80 HP+ bi directional tractors had Eaton 3 range HST's and handled all chores well. I liked Ford's and Cases Powershift for mowing and tilling when we had them. Big fan of the hydraulic clutched power reverser in the TLB as well very "quiet" easy to use like driving an automatic and no need to run at high RPM all the time. I still use my non syncroed geared 55HP the most , but it really is a more physical machine to run, but no need to rev it all the time or listen to a loud whine.

Can't stand noisy Hydrostats. Some companies do a good job at refining that and making quiet hydros, some do a poor job.

 

[big bubba]

most of the members here are of later life stage. by that time, i'd assume tractor owners would find their niche, consumer or commercial agri application
then why all this fuss over HST & gear?

i'll bet (w/o data) that Europe & Asia in both consumer & commercial markets go gear much more than the US. admit it, we are a country of mostly automatic vehicles and compact HST tractor owners. that's all.

there's lots of poor joint health here in US that accompanies older age, hence there are many HST owners on this forum w/ consumer & compact use.
at least we have options today, not so in the past.

no question, we're much luckier than our fore bearers operating machines at our age, glad to have the set up for what i do... regards

 

[RB5]

most of the members here are of later life stage. by that time, i'd assume tractor owners would find their niche, consumer or commercial agri application
then why all this fuss over HST & gear?

i'll bet (w/o data) that Europe & Asia in both consumer & commercial markets go gear much more than the US. admit it, we are a country of mostly automatic vehicles and compact HST tractor owners. that's all.

there's lots of poor joint health here in US that accompanies older age, hence there are many HST owners on this forum w/ consumer & compact use.
at least we have options today, not so in the past.

no question, we're much luckier than our fore bearers operating machines at our age, glad to have set up for what i do... regards

I will have to agree with you on the people not being able to operate a clutch later in life. All you have to do is visit a local walmart and see how many older people go in there that can barely walk. I'm 61 and still toss my feed bags and tposts around. I get a kick out of it when the young kid asks if I need help loading pavers or concrete bags at home depot. Seeing those people with issues motivates me to eat healthier and keep active.

We do not walk as much here as in some places in other countries. Our cities were mostly built around the automobile. Many places in other countries have narrow roads that were there before the cars showed up. People walk more than here. I'm sure that is better for health. The more you sit the more you can't get up when you need to.

As for hst vs gear? I've had a gear driven riding mower. That is the worst way to mow. Now I have a zero turn with hst. For large areas I have a gear driven tractor that basically runs at the same speed and gear for hours when I am mowing or disking. It has shuttle shift for loader work, and in reality it is not very hard to shift gears anyway.

 

[big bubba]

all good points. i don't intend to put any value judgement or condescending opinions, i hope just an observation on us tractor owners from all walks of life.
i'll be selling my estate of 49 yrs next spring. glad to be able to walk away & still clutch my ol' 4x4 truck

this forum is superb. HST or gear?...it's not for me to say