Student Loan Debt?

[paulsharvey]

Fastest Growing Occupations

20 occupations with the highest projected percent change of employment

www.bls.gov

Surprisingly, according to them specifically Architects, shows expected 5% increase over next 10 years. I'm not disagreeing with the math, just my personal observation is not nearly as rosy. Broadly, it shows several medical (and medical adjacent) professions expecting massive growth in demand. I know they can't pump out enough nurses.

Certain professions are 100% degree driven; No mater how good of a CNA you are, you won't be am RN without the paper; generally (I know not All states), you can be God's gift to drafting/design, and you can't sit for a PE.

 

[paulsharvey]

But, case in point, I don't think most people would be served by racking up $200-400k in loans to get a job that pays $80k/year; vs no loans, and $60-70k. Not every lawyer is bring in $500k/year; not every engineer is making $120k. I never understood the private or prestige schools. I dont doubt Duke is a good school; but my personal world, no one will ever care which school it was. A BS in nursing from Duke pays the same as a BS in nursing from the local community College, or a A.A with a bridge program... but the cost for that education could Easily be 10x the price.

 

[two_bit_score]

Funny thing about the salaries listed for these so-called top demand jobs; it's said a manager at Buc-ee's convenience stores can make over $100K a year. Compare that to these salaries.

Fastest Growing Occupations

20 occupations with the highest projected percent change of employment

www.bls.gov

 

[two_bit_score]

Not every lawyer is bring in $500k/year;

A lot of lawyers win a huge judgement or settle a big case for a lot of money early in their career and do a structured settlement on their fee where they get an annuitiy and draw off that money for many years while doing it all over again and again.

I ran into an old friend who is a couple years older than me and we were talking about retirement. He said there was no way he could retire but I know he really ment there was no way he would retire because the money is just so good. He is an above average "shyster".

 

[paulsharvey]

Funny thing about the salaries listed for these so-called top demand jobs; it's said a manager at Buc-ee's convenience stores can make over $100K a year. Compare that to these salaries.

Fastest Growing Occupations

20 occupations with the highest projected percent change of employment

www.bls.gov

I think I get what you're saying; however, good managers are an extremely hard to find group, and takes a Lot of skill, and huge levels of stress. I hear from people all the time; it sure must be nice to have that air conditioned office and blah blah. I've been a superintendent in the past; and the stress level... waking up a 3am cause you didn't order mortar sand, and 20 stucco guys are gonna have nothing to do tomorrow, or calling the owner and telling him, I just cost you $80k cause I put the roll off dumpsters on the new parking lot, and it's going to need to be resurfaced.

I told one of my bosses, to his face, with his boss in the room; I wouldn't do your job for 1.5x my pay. Imagine the Buccees manager, keeping everything ordered, tracking/training 80 employees, etc.

I know she doesn't think it's funny, but I told my wife (an ICU nurse), "why are your stressed, few patients die, so what, they will bring you more the next day, it's not like you lost an important client"

Edit; I admit, I wouldn't do well in a medical field

 

[two_bit_score]

I know she doesn't think it's funny, but I told my wife (an ICU nurse), "why are your stressed, few patients die, so what, they will bring you more the next day, it's not like you lost an important client"

I have great respect for nurses. They are often well paid but IMHO, never enough. Most of us are not in jobs where almost every decision could be life or death to someone. Nurses are.

 

[Torvy]

Lots to unpack here...let's see what I remember.

Prestige schools are not a better education, just better connections. You graduate from Harvard Law and you have more and higher paying options. Regionally that works, too. Marquette, Purdue, SMU etc. all have grads who grease the wheels for new grads.

Professor's books...hated that. Two opposite examples. My Micro prof told us in day 1 of class not to bother buying the book. The university required them to have a text listed. Had a history prof who had a book published while we were in class. He gave us all a free copy. He passed a while back. Book is about his childhood during WWII. His dad was killed over there.

"When is daddy coming home?" : an American family during World War II : Haney, Richard Carlton : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

x, 140 pages : 22 cm

archive.org

 

[paulsharvey]

By the way, I'm Not saying trades are for everyone, education isn't for everyone. management isn't for everyone. Some people thrive under pressure; others can do montamous jobs for hours on end. I Hated moving from being a superintendent to an inspector, probably for the first 2 or 3 years; partly the money, partly the boredom, and partly, you aren't really running things; as I did it longer, the money eventually improved, and as I got better, I found I like it more. When the wife asked 'would you go back now" a few years ago, I told her heck no, I sleep better, I dont come home mad, I work far less weekends, ect.

On the money side; money is Always a motivating factor; however; according to some assigned continuing Ed I was assigned, once you reach something like $60-70k, for most Americans, in most areas, it is no longer the primary factor; things like PTO, new challenges, benefits matter as much or more. Below that number (roughly), those things aren't motivation at all. Can't send my Bluecross card to the mortage company.

I have also been temporarily put into the office side twice, once for 11 months, once for 7 months (currently job, they say is 80% field, 20% "office" but really computer on the console in the car); and although there is potentially more pay on the office side; it felt like a prison, sitting at a desk for 8 or 10 hours per day.

 

[Hay Dude]

But, case in point, I don't think most people would be served by racking up $200-400k in loans to get a job that pays $80k/year; vs no loans, and $60-70k. Not every lawyer is bring in $500k/year; not every engineer is making $120k. I never understood the private or prestige schools. I dont doubt Duke is a good school; but my personal world, no one will ever care which school it was. A BS in nursing from Duke pays the same as a BS in nursing from the local community College, or a A.A with a bridge program... but the cost for that education could Easily be 10x the price.

My best friend is an attorney. He has legitimate money, like makes more than me in one year than I make in 10 years. He sold a personal injury practice, signed a no-compete and went to work building another practice. He owns 2 nice homes outright (no mortgage) has a million dollar boat, bought all his kids new Jeeps, Mustangs, etc and bought wife a Range Rover. Nothing financed.
Did he go to Duke or Harvard?
No. He went to Temple Law School in Philly and barely graduated.

 

[ultrarunner]

I have great respect for nurses. They are often well paid but IMHO, never enough. Most of us are not in jobs where almost every decision could be life or death to someone. Nurses are.

Nursing covers a lot of ground… anything from clinical, public health, insurance review, teaching, admin, pharma, etc…

I know a nurse that has only had patient care during her training… she is now senior level management at Stanford 30 years later… she loves policy and being up to date on compliance…

 

[kenmbz]

Fastest Growing Occupations

20 occupations with the highest projected percent change of employment

www.bls.gov

The problem with these charts is they have a 2 year lag and we have seen a lot of changes in the tech and mortgage sectors.

Thanks for the info on booster clubs, that's a new one for me.
We did also think about 1 or 2 years in a local college and then transfer.
It seems that the ranks get thinned out in year 1/2 at bigger colleges and more accepting of new students in transfer.

 

[Torvy]

Pros and cons to JC first.

Pros:
cheaper tuition,
usually easier (YMMV)
smaller (some kids struggle from a small school to a big one),
live at home?,
continue working same job,
final degree still says 4 yr school name (no asterisk)

Cons:
professors assume a Jr or Sr knows their way around campus and town (may leave details out),
upper courses assume you had their lower courses and prep is usually more lined up,
Friend groups (study groups) may be harder to get into as a transfer
4yr students get inside track to campus jobs
4yr students get to know profs sooner (may lead to research opportunities
Some JC courses are too easy, leaving students ill-prepared

These are not equally weighted and may be more or less relevant to some students/schools than others

 

[jyoutz]

I tell young people, get good at something that pays the bills. When you master a skill, you will learn to like it. I dont know that Love is the right word, or enjoy; but I you master something, you get satisfaction from it. Weather that's being the best defense attorney get creeps out of jail, or the best truck driver, or septic pumper.

No matter how you look at this, septic pumper isn’t a high satisfaction job.

 

[paulsharvey]

No matter how you look at this, septic pumper isn’t a high satisfaction job.

Never actually pumped a septic tank, but I've rodded plenty of sewer lines. I would prefer doing that to working in a loan office, or insurance. But, if you're the best in the septic game, and get a truck of your own, that might be far more satisfying. Certainly not saying it's for everyone, but no job/profession/career is. If I had to wipe old people's butts in a retirement home; I'm pretty sure I would suck start a 12 gauge. Another part of thus satisfaction conversation, is the satisfaction of providing for yourself and/or family.

 

[paulsharvey]

Huge part if this whole discussion; you need to know yourself. If you Know you would hate an office job, and dread every day, don't go into accounting. If you hate to sweat, don't get into construction. I know I couldnt sell water to a man dying of thirst, and I wouldnt go into car sales.

I also acknowledge that I don't know/understand 95% of the economy. Most people get pretty 'silo'd' in their part of the world.

 

[kenmbz]

I talk to people in a lot of countries every day, Interesting to hear their take on local economy, global view and how their school system works.

 

[Eagle1]

No matter how you look at this, septic pumper isn’t a high satisfaction job.

I have my own sewer system and have been knee deep in crap before, turtle got stuck in a 6" line. Someone has to the crap jobs so civilized life can happen.

 

[WM75Guy]

Never actually pumped a septic tank, but I've rodded plenty of sewer lines. I would prefer doing that to working in a loan office, or insurance. But, if you're the best in the septic game, and get a truck of your own, that might be far more satisfying. Certainly not saying it's for everyone, but no job/profession/career is. If I had to wipe old people's butts in a retirement home; I'm pretty sure I would suck start a 12 gauge. Another part of thus satisfaction conversation, is the satisfaction of providing for yourself and/or family.

When I did bedside nursing in the hospital, I had to clean up people at times. It isn't that bad, especially if you remind yourself one day that may be me laying in the bed and how would I want to be treated. I always treated the patient with dignity and respect. Somedays that was the most satisfying part of the shift, knowing I had really helped someone that needed it. But that is why I went into nursing, to help others in need.

 

[paulsharvey]

Oh, I've been covered in sewage several times; dealing with broken forcemains (pressurized sewage), and all. I agree it's not really bad, just take your boots off before you go in the house in the evening; and probably strip down outside.

I would rather work in a sanitary manhole than flag traffic... Hate flagging traffic, it's all the bad things in one, 120 degrees, standing in one place for 14 hours, no breaks, boring, and at the same time, you have to pay attention, all while waiting on somebody to try to run you over. I've also know people who like flagging traffic, or sitting watch in a fire tower, or bridge tending....

I will say, after 6 months in community College, got a job as a plumbers helper, and the owner was strictly against mini-hoes, even on 120 ft long building sewer rough, no shade in miles. Anyways, when I got the job, I was making $7/hr, and thought that was great, but day two, all the skin on the back of my neck had pealed off from 14 hours in 100% total sun, and by day 4, the 2nd layer had peeled off to the red meat... I decided that after 6 months of that, maybe I should give college an honest try.

 

[jyoutz]

I have my own sewer system and have been knee deep in crap before, turtle got stuck in a 6" line. Someone has to the crap jobs so civilized life can happen.

Agree, and I have had nothing but septic tanks myself. It’s a necessary job, but I still can’t picture anyone liking it.